Australian Politics Forum - Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.

Kat

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #60 - Nov 4^th, 2014 at 3:25pm

St George of the Garden wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 8:25am:

Some parents may not have the room or the money to support a young unemployed adult child who may have a wife and kiddies and a mortgage.

If this policy got implemented there will be a sudden huge drop in spending as people are frightened they or their child may find themselves unemployed with zero money coming in. That in itself will create more unemployment.

A much better policy—boost NewStart by at least $50 a week, $100 even better.

$50 would have been (just) adequate when the increase was first mooted under Howard TEN YEARS AGO.

It now needs to be a minimum of $100 a week. NO less.

And there should be NO hoops to jump through to get it.

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Bam

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #61 - Nov 4^th, 2014 at 8:03pm

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 8:36am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 8:25am:

A much better policy—boost NewStart by at least $50 a week, $100 even better.

Either that or supply jobs for all that want them.

These jobs need not be the best jobs, of course, but even $650 a week removing graffiti is better than $260 a week and being lied to.

It only takes about $10 billion to $15 billion to create enough jobs for those that need them, or at least to offer jobs to households that currently have none. And it's far better than the Work for the Dole rubbish that is either pointless rock painting, or corrupt deals for private companies that ends up being work for well below the minimum wage.

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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.

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Bam

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #62 - Nov 4^th, 2014 at 8:05pm

Kat wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 3:25pm:

St George of the Garden wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 8:25am:

Some parents may not have the room or the money to support a young unemployed adult child who may have a wife and kiddies and a mortgage.

If this policy got implemented there will be a sudden huge drop in spending as people are frightened they or their child may find themselves unemployed with zero money coming in. That in itself will create more unemployment.

A much better policy—boost NewStart by at least $50 a week, $100 even better.

$50 would have been (just) adequate when the increase was first mooted under Howard TEN YEARS AGO.

It now needs to be a minimum of $100 a week. NO less.

And there should be NO hoops to jump through to get it.

I think $50 a week but double the rent assistance ceiling and extend rent assistance to include people with mortgages.

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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.

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MumboJumbo

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #63 - Nov 4^th, 2014 at 9:52pm

Bam wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 8:05pm:

I think $50 a week but double the rent assistance ceiling and extend rent assistance to include people with mortgages.

Kat wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 3:25pm:

It now needs to be a minimum of $100 a week. NO less.

And there should be NO hoops to jump through to get it.

Raven wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 12:14pm:

The Abbott Government follows the Dennis Denuto guide to government policy: just assert there is an age of entitlement or the welfare systems is being rorted. Don't worry too much about there being a paucity of evidence regarding the age of entitlement or that the welfare system is being rorted - the vibe will do.

Why not email your local MP? Mr Abbott'll be bound to change his policy with all of you guiding him.

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See Profile For Update wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:58pm:

Why the bugger did I get stuck on a planet chalked full of imbeciles?

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #64 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 5:01am

ian wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 6:00am:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 5:33am:

ian wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 5:27am:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 5:22am:

John Smith wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2014 at 1:12pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2014 at 1:12am:

If you're under 30 and homeless without money then you can thank your parents. There seems to be this odd thinking amongst "progressives" that once you're 18 then the state is your new mummy and daddy and your biological (or step) parents are relinquished of their parental responsibilities.

so if the parents are drug buggered arseholes, we'll punish their offspring?

Again, the percentage of parents being drug-f*cked would be minuscule and therefore doesn't effect my original point. Anyway, the child would have, or should have, been taken away from their parents if they are drugged losers.

Quote:

you had better hope that no one ever punishes yopur kids for your deeds, both real and perceived

I, as well as my wife, have gained skills in areas that assure our family does not have such a future. See, this is called thinking and planning ahead. "Progressives" should try it sometime, instead of expecting everything to fall into place for them while they do sweet f.a. about it.

Id really ;like to respond to your argument here but unfortunately the internet does not allow me to punch you in the mouth for being a smug arsehole.

Let me guess, you're another loser that stuffed their life up and want the government and tax payer to fix it for you? Sure sounds like it.

I have plenty of money now but I have known extreme poverty and being wealthy doesnt mean that I automatically look down on the less fortunate, there but for the grace of God go I. You should remember that., Some people arent born to the priveleged start in life that you had, thats something else you should remember.

Where have I mentioned I was "privileged"? I lived from ages 17 to 34 week by week, rarely saving a cent. At one point I lived off about $250 a week for 3 and a half years. Anyway, I am not interested in anyone's pity or sympathy. I want to know why the government is solely responsible for the homeless under 30. Where is the parental responsibility?

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #65 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 5:04am

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 7:10am:

Amazing assumptions and generalisations there, Culture - you need to get out more.

Many of us developed skills etc - it's no guarantee that the fools who run the who won't ruin things for you and cause you to be tossed on the scrapheap at fifty, then whine about what it costs their 'budget'.

When governments deliberately introduce and pursue policies that cause unemployment, they are responsible. Let them eat that cake since that age of entitlement for them is over.

Yawn. No government or business in the world can destroy one area I have skills in (not in the next 500 or more years anyway). There's a never-ending marketplace for it.

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #66 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 5:21am

John Smith wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 7:42am:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 5:22am:

John Smith wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2014 at 1:12pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2014 at 1:12am:

If you're under 30 and homeless without money then you can thank your parents. There seems to be this odd thinking amongst "progressives" that once you're 18 then the state is your new mummy and daddy and your biological (or step) parents are relinquished of their parental responsibilities.

so if the parents are drug buggered arseholes, we'll punish their offspring?

Again, the percentage of parents being drug-f*cked would be minuscule and therefore doesn't effect my original point. Anyway, the child would have, or should have, been taken away from their parents if they are drugged losers.

Quote:

you had better hope that no one ever punishes yopur kids for your deeds, both real and perceived

I, as well as my wife, have gained skills in areas that assure our family does not have such a future. See, this is called thinking and planning ahead. "Progressives" should try it sometime, instead of expecting everything to fall into place for them while they do sweet f.a. about it.

what a load of condescending bullsheat ..... no parent is responsible for their kids at 30. If the kids go out clubbing at the age of 25, screw around and ends up getting some girl pregnant, does that mean the parents are responsible?

You must live in lala land. You have obviously never dealt with reality.

I bet you are one of those uni lecturers that moved from a life of study supplied to you by your parent, to a life of acedemia, without having really lived outside of the confines of university life. You may know your subject matter, but you have a twisted concept of reality.

Stupid example. We are not talking about people getting pissed and pregnant.

If your son/daughter is under 30 and homeless, then any decent parent would take them back in. In fact, what parent says "f*ck our son, he should live on the street"? Only sh*t parents or a son/daughter that was a complete arsehole to their parents would do such a thing.

In non-Western countries it is normal for people in their 20s to live at home. In fact, they often live at home until they are married. Only in countries where the state has eroded family life is parental responsibility waning. Non-Western countries are still very family centred. Western countries, while still family centred to an extent, have shifted a great deal of responsibilities onto state machinery. This thread is a great example of this shift being encouraged.

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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole. Reply #67 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 7:47am You are crapping on like all under 30s are unmarried and childless and all parents can support an adult child for 6 months of every year.
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John Smith

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #68 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 8:11am

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 5:21am:

John Smith wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 7:42am:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Nov 4^th, 2014 at 5:22am:

John Smith wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2014 at 1:12pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2014 at 1:12am:

If you're under 30 and homeless without money then you can thank your parents. There seems to be this odd thinking amongst "progressives" that once you're 18 then the state is your new mummy and daddy and your biological (or step) parents are relinquished of their parental responsibilities.

so if the parents are drug buggered arseholes, we'll punish their offspring?

Again, the percentage of parents being drug-f*cked would be minuscule and therefore doesn't effect my original point. Anyway, the child would have, or should have, been taken away from their parents if they are drugged losers.

Quote:

you had better hope that no one ever punishes yopur kids for your deeds, both real and perceived

I, as well as my wife, have gained skills in areas that assure our family does not have such a future. See, this is called thinking and planning ahead. "Progressives" should try it sometime, instead of expecting everything to fall into place for them while they do sweet f.a. about it.

what a load of condescending bullsheat ..... no parent is responsible for their kids at 30. If the kids go out clubbing at the age of 25, screw around and ends up getting some girl pregnant, does that mean the parents are responsible?

You must live in lala land. You have obviously never dealt with reality.

I bet you are one of those uni lecturers that moved from a life of study supplied to you by your parent, to a life of acedemia, without having really lived outside of the confines of university life. You may know your subject matter, but you have a twisted concept of reality.

Stupid example. We are not talking about people getting pissed and pregnant.

.

you made a blanket statement and so far your answer to everything has been 'we're not talking about those ones' or 'we're not talking about those without parents,' or 'we're not talking about those whose parents are druggos' ...

the only stupid thing was your blanket statement.

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #69 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 10:20pm

No one has addressed the original point. Why is it solely the government's responsibility for the under 30s homeless? Have we become so "progressive" that asking parents to look after their children is now a radical idea?

In fact, if it's the state's responsibility, then why have parents at all? Why not take babies from their parents straight after birth and put them all into a state funded nursery? Anyone who claims the state shouldn't do this is admitting parents do have responsibilities toward their children.

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Grappler Deep State Feller

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #70 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 10:36pm

Told you already - government in many ways has taken over that mantle of caring for all.. even by reducing the rights of parents to control their children.... and therefore inherits the earth - the earth, mud and slush of having to support those children they have told their parents they have no real rights in or over and who are, according to government fiat, free to do as they choose.

You make the policies and you enforce them to the detriment of others - you take full responsibility and pay the piper.

That is ONE grievous fault of 'social engineering' and the excessive input of socio-fascist idealism.

I've told you many times to beware of freaks bearing grift.. you never listen...

I've also told you many times that by allowing government to take this mantle from us all - we are becoming serfs to its dictatorship - nowhere more revealed than in the attitudes of the current 'government'.

Will your 'skills' do you well when we have the equivalent of the Red Guards and the Cultural Revolution - when those such as you were vilified, imprisoned, attacked and re-educated to the new regime and according to the will of the young people blatantly deprived of their rights and their freedoms and the ability to build a secure life and family structure etc, for themselves??

I fear, Grasshopper, that like so many others - you have yet to understand life.... any such understand life only when it crashes in on them...... in the hands of the very ones they have vilified in the past.....

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St George of the Garden

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #71 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 10:38pm

Somebody in their 20s is not a child!

They would get 6 months dole in every 12 months!

The stupid idea would cause a drop in private sector spending directly (less money to spend) and indirectly (under 30s currently employed would save money—under the mattress most likely—if they feel they could be made unemployed and with only 6 months inadequate dole every 12 months.

Whatever studies you are supposed to have done clearly does not include economics or common sense.

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Datalife Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 2405 Gender:	Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole. Reply #72 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 10:44pm How old was Julia when she was young and nieve and practising law?
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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #73 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 10:44pm

Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 10:36pm:

Told you already - government in many ways has taken over that mantle of caring for all.. even by reducing the rights of parents to control their children.... and therefore inherits the earth - the earth, mud and slush of having to support those children they have told their parents they have no real rights in or over and who are, according to government fiat, free to do as they choose.

You make the policies and you enforce them to the detriment of others - you take full responsibility and pay the piper.

That is ONE grievous fault of 'social engineering' and the excessive input of socio-fascist idealism.

I've told you many times to beware of freaks bearing grift.. you never listen...

I've also told you many times that by allowing government to take this mantle from us all - we are becoming serfs to its dictatorship - nowhere more revealed than in the attitudes of the current 'government'.

Will your 'skills' do you well when we have the equivalent of the Red Guards and the Cultural Revolution - when those such as you were vilified, imprisoned, attacked and re-educated to the new regime and according to the will of the young people blatantly deprived of their rights and their freedoms and the ability to build a secure life and family structure etc, for themselves??

I fear, Grasshopper, that like so many others - you have yet to understand life.... any such understand life only when it crashes in on them...... in the hands of the very ones they have vilified in the past.....

Your posts are often all over the place - you hate the government one minute, then asking for a handout and for them to take control of something the next minute.

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: Will you be like this when under 30 cant get dole.
Reply #74 - Nov 5^th, 2014 at 10:51pm

St George of the Garden wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 10:38pm:

Somebody in their 20s is not a child!

They would get 6 months dole in every 12 months!

The stupid idea would cause a drop in private sector spending directly (less money to spend) and indirectly (under 30s currently employed would save money—under the mattress most likely—if they feel they could be made unemployed and with only 6 months inadequate dole every 12 months.

Whatever studies you are supposed to have done clearly does not include economics or common sense.

I see. So you're making a pro-business argument for the dole now. Before you just screeched something about it's unfair not to pay them.

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