Australian Politics Forum - Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10

Baronvonrort

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #75 - Nov 29^th, 2014 at 4:33pm

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 2:08pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 28^th, 2014 at 11:45pm:

Quote:

I'm not claiming it, HB isn't claiming it - the whole bloody world seems to be claiming it if all the references we've produced it are stating it, Baron. Are you stating that all the references are lying? Roll Eyes

You really are a complete loon. All the demographics state that the majority of Kurds are Muslim, Baron. Time to come back to reality and stop denying it. Roll Eyes

Are you saying the founder and leader of the PKK is a muslim?

Abdullah Ocalan the founder and leader of the PKK is atheist
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdullah_Ocalan

Quote:

as a committed Maoist the peasant kid from southeastern Turkey did not quite feel at home in Ankara. The capital’s leftist literati appeared too soft for Ocalan, whose weltanschauung was shaped by his patriarchal upbringing and the orthodox ways of Shafii Islam in Turkey’s Kurdish southeast.
[...]
Dramatic Opportunities for Ocalan

The year 1990 ushered in two important changes: the fall of communism and the Gulf War. Ocalan used both developments to his advantage. First, he switched the PKK’s base ideology from communism to Kurdish nationalism. This was ironic because as a dogmatic Marxist-Maoist ideologue, Ocalan had attacked nationalism as fascism. The end of communism also meant Ocalan could flirt with Islam. With his Soviet patron no longer lurking around, Ocalan adopted a Muslim outlook for the PKK, taking advantage of Islam’s appeal to conservative Kurds.

[Source]

Quote:

As a student of political sciences at Ankara University, he went to the other extreme, influenced by the far-left organisations which abounded in Turkey in the early 1970s. From being a dedicated follower of islamic teachings he switched to politics and donned the rigid Marxist-Leninist ideological straight-jacket he says he will never discard.

[Source]

Abdullah Öcalan appears to have started life very much as a Muslim and then changed to a secular leftist only to return to his Muslim roots, Baron.

Thus far you have only presented circumstantial evidence that Kurds are not Muslims whereas both HB and myself have presented several references which prove that the majority of Kurds are Muslim.

If Ocalan has reverted to Islam like you claim then perhaps you should Islamise his wiki page where it says atheist like you islamised your signature.

Do you consider old articles from frontpagemag a credible source,Ocalan is still running the PKK from jail he has written many things since your 15 year old so called last interview.

The PKK has evolved from it's marxist roots perhaps more than the old USSR,secular democracy with equal rights for everyone along with freedom of belief including disbelief is where it's at, your Ocalan article is over 15 years old you are scraping the bottom of the barrel there.

Please tell us any Islamic references in this video a kurd sent me, does the lady say around 9 minutes she would like to finish her studies and find a boyfriend, how many sunni girls are allowed to have boyfriends? just ignore the kurd wearing a christian cross she is a sunni pretending to be christian..

The Constitution of the Rojava cantons gives women equal rights to men and allows freedom of belief, none of the women in that video mention god or have a Quran.

Quote:

Iraqi Kurdistan region-
An equality decree,number 22 of the year 2014,unique in the middle east, recognising the rights of women in Syrian Kurdistan has prompted opposition from conservative muslim clerics.

The DUP issued its decree on Nov 10,insisting on womens participation in lawmaking,and on the inclusion of womens will and needs into legislation.
It asserts womens rights to stand for and to hold all kinds of political position.
In defining principals of equality between women and men its 30 clauses seek to establish gender equality at all social,economic and political levels.Most significantly it challenges patriarchal mentality in public and private arenas, criminalising polygamy,forced and early marriages and so called honour crimes as well as disparity with inheritance rights.

While some faith leaders will continue to oppose any move to liberate women from traditional roles and the subservient status at the core of their Islamist ideology,ultimately it will be up to women and their political allies who will win the battle.

Islamic parties in Iraqi Kurdistan hold 3 ministerial positions in the current government and 17 seats of 111 total seats in the regional parliament.
www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-nazand-begikhani/kurdish-womens-rights-fight_b_6205076...

The muslim leaders are butthurt the Kurdish women want equality, it appears Kurds are getting their freedom in spite of Islam not because of Islam.

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #76 - Nov 29^th, 2014 at 4:57pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 4:33pm:

If Ocalan has reverted to Islam like you claim then perhaps you should Islamise his wiki page where it says atheist like you islamised your signature.

Nothing contradictory there, Baron. The Wiki page doesn't mention his upbringing, so its only wrong by omission, not by commission like yourself.

It's not what I claim BTW, it's what all those webpages claim. I'm merely bringing them to your attention, showing that you appear to have the wrong end of the stick. Roll Eyes

None, BTW are Islamic pages. They are merely different pages which go into more detail about his political/religious views than Wiki does.

Quote:

Do you consider old articles from frontpagemag a credible source,Ocalan is still running the PKK from jail he has written many things since your 15 year old so called last interview.

He may have but none, I seem to be able to find contradict them about his early life, Baron.

All of this however is at best a distraction from the main point - most Kurds are Muslim, Baron, something you keep denying. Why? What actual, substantive, direct evidence have you got that refutes this? You have some circumstantial evidence but it does not refute the point - most Kurds are Muslim according to all the articles which mention the religious demographics of the Kurdish population. Roll Eyes

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #77 - Nov 29^th, 2014 at 6:29pm

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 4:57pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 4:33pm:

If Ocalan has reverted to Islam like you claim then perhaps you should Islamise his wiki page where it says atheist like you islamised your signature.

Nothing contradictory there, Baron. The Wiki page doesn't mention his upbringing, so its only wrong by omission, not by commission like yourself.

It's not what I claim BTW, it's what all those webpages claim. I'm merely bringing them to your attention, showing that you appear to have the wrong end of the stick. Roll Eyes

None, BTW are Islamic pages. They are merely different pages which go into more detail about his political/religious views than Wiki does.

Quote:

Do you consider old articles from frontpagemag a credible source,Ocalan is still running the PKK from jail he has written many things since your 15 year old so called last interview.

He may have but none, I seem to be able to find contradict them about his early life, Baron.

All of this however is at best a distraction from the main point - most Kurds are Muslim, Baron, something you keep denying. Why? What actual, substantive, direct evidence have you got that refutes this? You have some circumstantial evidence but it does not refute the point - most Kurds are Muslim according to all the articles which mention the religious demographics of the Kurdish population. Roll Eyes

You claimed Ocalan returned returned to his muslim roots, he has not he is still atheist.

The webpages that have been cited claim anywhere from most are sunni to 2/3's to 3/4, none of them provide any numbers but hey it's on the internet it must be the good gospel eh brian.

It would be difficult to get the numbers on the kurds,when they drew lines on a map Kurdistan became a part of Iran,Iraq,Syria and Turkey.
The sunni Turks never liked the Kurds they are called mountain Turks and classed as muslims and were not allowed to speak Kurdish in turkey.
Iran,Iraq and Syria have a long history of persecuting and hating the kurds, do you think they will give reliable numbers or will the Iranians claim they are shia?

You and HB claimed most kurds are sunni muslims.

Sunni Turkey have bombed and attacked Kurds recently
Sunni Islamic state are attacking the Kurds as i type.
Sunni turkey will not fight sunni Islamic state, sunni turkey allows Islamic state jihadis to transit through turkey while denying turkish kurds the ability to cross the border to help syrian kurds.
Sunni Islamic state fighters waltzed into sunni parts of Iraq with no resistance and took over.

If the kurds are majority sunni as claimed why do all the sunni neighbors attack them and no other sunnis?

Should we believe what that guy wrote about Ibn Sina being a devout muslim on the internet wikipedia or should we believe the fatwa saying he was atheist along with al ghazalis books that were very critical of Ibn Sina which backs up the fatwa?

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96434	Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10 Reply #78 - Nov 29^th, 2014 at 6:49pm You’re still going.
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Brian Ross

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #79 - Nov 29^th, 2014 at 6:52pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 6:29pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 4:57pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 4:33pm:

If Ocalan has reverted to Islam like you claim then perhaps you should Islamise his wiki page where it says atheist like you islamised your signature.

Nothing contradictory there, Baron. The Wiki page doesn't mention his upbringing, so its only wrong by omission, not by commission like yourself.

It's not what I claim BTW, it's what all those webpages claim. I'm merely bringing them to your attention, showing that you appear to have the wrong end of the stick. Roll Eyes

None, BTW are Islamic pages. They are merely different pages which go into more detail about his political/religious views than Wiki does.

Quote:

Do you consider old articles from frontpagemag a credible source,Ocalan is still running the PKK from jail he has written many things since your 15 year old so called last interview.

He may have but none, I seem to be able to find contradict them about his early life, Baron.

All of this however is at best a distraction from the main point - most Kurds are Muslim, Baron, something you keep denying. Why? What actual, substantive, direct evidence have you got that refutes this? You have some circumstantial evidence but it does not refute the point - most Kurds are Muslim according to all the articles which mention the religious demographics of the Kurdish population. Roll Eyes

You claimed Ocalan returned returned to his muslim roots, he has not he is still atheist.

His organisation appears to have abandoned Communism for a mild form of Islamism, Baron.

Quote:

The webpages that have been cited claim anywhere from most are sunni to 2/3's to 3/4, none of them provide any numbers but hey it's on the internet it must be the good gospel eh brian.

As I do not have access to good library resources (nor I must admit the time to research this fully), you can either accept what the varied sources are saying or you can continue to live in denial, Baron. That they all tend to agree with one another and not with you suggests what about your claims?

It appears to me that you have a fixed strawman view of what constitutes a Muslim individual and at the community level and you're not willing to acept that it's wrong. Roll Eyes

Quote:

It would be difficult to get the numbers on the kurds,when they drew lines on a map Kurdistan became a part of Iran,Iraq,Syria and Turkey.
The sunni Turks never liked the Kurds they are called mountain Turks and classed as muslims and were not allowed to speak Kurdish in turkey.
Iran,Iraq and Syria have a long history of persecuting and hating the kurds, do you think they will give reliable numbers or will the Iranians claim they are shia?

Most of the estimates are independent of government sources and as most of the governments are actually inimical to the Kurds I see no adequate reason for them to lie, Baron. All you're now quibbling about is numbers, not the proportions. Roll Eyes

Quote:

You and HB claimed most kurds are sunni muslims.

He may have, I have merely pointed out that the sources all state that the majority are Muslims. You have produced no evidence which directly refutes that, Baron. You twitter on about Kurdish recognition of other religions, equality of the genders and the constitutions of the various Kurdish cantons. Roll Eyes

Quote:

Sunni Turkey have bombed and attacked Kurds recently
Sunni Islamic state are attacking the Kurds as i type.

The Turks bombed PKK enclaves. The IS is attacking the Kurds because the Kurds refuse to accept the suzerainty of IS. IS attacks any Muslims who don't accept their claim to be the new Caliphate. Doesn't mean they aren't Muslims, rather it means they are not supporting IS.

Quote:

Sunni turkey will not fight sunni Islamic state, sunni turkey allows Islamic state jihadis to transit through turkey while denying turkish kurds the ability to cross the border to help syrian kurds.
Sunni Islamic state fighters waltzed into sunni parts of Iraq with no resistance and took over.

Not quite true. IS exploited a power vacuum left by the al Maliki Government. Sunni Iraqis weren't support the al Maliki Government, IS merely claimed it was the new government and the Sunnis shrugged their shoulders and said, "what ever!"

Quote:

If the kurds are majority sunni as claimed why do all the sunni neighbors attack them and no other sunnis?

Because the are Kurds and want an independent Kurdistan, Baron. It's not difficult to grasp, if you have an open mind. Roll Eyes

Quote:

Should we believe what that guy wrote about Ibn Sina being a devout muslim on the internet wikipedia or should we believe the fatwa saying he was atheist along with al ghazalis books that were very critical of Ibn Sina which backs up the fatwa?

Is this germane to the thread? Roll Eyes

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #80 - Nov 29^th, 2014 at 7:42pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 4:33pm:

Quote:

Iraqi Kurdistan region-
An equality decree,number 22 of the year 2014,unique in the middle east, recognising the rights of women in Syrian Kurdistan has prompted opposition from conservative muslim clerics.

The DUP issued its decree on Nov 10,insisting on womens participation in lawmaking,and on the inclusion of womens will and needs into legislation.
It asserts womens rights to stand for and to hold all kinds of political position.
In defining principals of equality between women and men its 30 clauses seek to establish gender equality at all social,economic and political levels.Most significantly it challenges patriarchal mentality in public and private arenas, criminalising polygamy,forced and early marriages and so called honour crimes as well as disparity with inheritance rights.

While some faith leaders will continue to oppose any move to liberate women from traditional roles and the subservient status at the core of their Islamist ideology,ultimately it will be up to women and their political allies who will win the battle.

Islamic parties in Iraqi Kurdistan hold 3 ministerial positions in the current government and 17 seats of 111 total seats in the regional parliament.
www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-nazand-begikhani/kurdish-womens-rights-fight_b_6205076...

The muslim leaders are butthurt the Kurdish women want equality, it appears Kurds are getting their freedom in spite of Islam not because of Islam.

Any comment on the reality in Kurdistan today brian, it appears they are implementing what their constitution of the rojava cantons says they should have.

The butthurt muslim leaders oppose womens rights, devout muslims will say islam gave women rights.

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #81 - Nov 29^th, 2014 at 10:03pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 7:42pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 4:33pm:

Quote:

Iraqi Kurdistan region-
An equality decree,number 22 of the year 2014,unique in the middle east, recognising the rights of women in Syrian Kurdistan has prompted opposition from conservative muslim clerics.

The DUP issued its decree on Nov 10,insisting on womens participation in lawmaking,and on the inclusion of womens will and needs into legislation.
It asserts womens rights to stand for and to hold all kinds of political position.
In defining principals of equality between women and men its 30 clauses seek to establish gender equality at all social,economic and political levels.Most significantly it challenges patriarchal mentality in public and private arenas, criminalising polygamy,forced and early marriages and so called honour crimes as well as disparity with inheritance rights.

While some faith leaders will continue to oppose any move to liberate women from traditional roles and the subservient status at the core of their Islamist ideology,ultimately it will be up to women and their political allies who will win the battle.

Islamic parties in Iraqi Kurdistan hold 3 ministerial positions in the current government and 17 seats of 111 total seats in the regional parliament.
www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-nazand-begikhani/kurdish-womens-rights-fight_b_6205076...

The muslim leaders are butthurt the Kurdish women want equality, it appears Kurds are getting their freedom in spite of Islam not because of Islam.

Any comment on the reality in Kurdistan today brian, it appears they are implementing what their constitution of the rojava cantons says they should have.

The butthurt muslim leaders oppose womens rights, devout muslims will say islam gave women rights.

This is immaterial to whether or not the majority of Kurds identify themselves as Muslim, Baron.

As all academic and non-academic articles that either I or HB have found have stated that the majority of Kurds are Muslim and you have yet to present any articles to the contrary, apart from a few youtube videos, I think you've lost the argument. Roll Eyes

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #82 - Nov 29^th, 2014 at 11:33pm

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 10:03pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 7:42pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 4:33pm:

Quote:

Iraqi Kurdistan region-
An equality decree,number 22 of the year 2014,unique in the middle east, recognising the rights of women in Syrian Kurdistan has prompted opposition from conservative muslim clerics.

The DUP issued its decree on Nov 10,insisting on womens participation in lawmaking,and on the inclusion of womens will and needs into legislation.
It asserts womens rights to stand for and to hold all kinds of political position.
In defining principals of equality between women and men its 30 clauses seek to establish gender equality at all social,economic and political levels.Most significantly it challenges patriarchal mentality in public and private arenas, criminalising polygamy,forced and early marriages and so called honour crimes as well as disparity with inheritance rights.

While some faith leaders will continue to oppose any move to liberate women from traditional roles and the subservient status at the core of their Islamist ideology,ultimately it will be up to women and their political allies who will win the battle.

Islamic parties in Iraqi Kurdistan hold 3 ministerial positions in the current government and 17 seats of 111 total seats in the regional parliament.
www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-nazand-begikhani/kurdish-womens-rights-fight_b_6205076...

The muslim leaders are butthurt the Kurdish women want equality, it appears Kurds are getting their freedom in spite of Islam not because of Islam.

Any comment on the reality in Kurdistan today brian, it appears they are implementing what their constitution of the rojava cantons says they should have.

The butthurt muslim leaders oppose womens rights, devout muslims will say islam gave women rights.

This is immaterial to whether or not the majority of Kurds identify themselves as Muslim, Baron.

As all academic and non-academic articles that either I or HB have found have stated that the majority of Kurds are Muslim and you have yet to present any articles to the contrary, apart from a few youtube videos, I think you've lost the argument. Roll Eyes

So nothing to say about the revolution going on that was inspired by the atheist Ocalam?

You and HB have presented no academic articles, are you trying to pass off wikipedia and frontpagemag as academic which would get laughed out of any academic institution, fair dinkum this just proves you and HB would be lucky to have half a brain between the pair of you.

Everything i have said is backed up in this BBC documentary that talks to Kurdish people fairly recently instead of your 15 plus year old webpages of dubious sources.

Do they mention something about all enemy neighbors claiming they are a one party atheist state,is there over a dozen references to Abdullah Ocalan, how many muslims do you see 1 or 2.

They give a lot of credit to the atheist Ocalam in that BBC documentary who you claim has returned to his islamic roots,go edit his wiki page set things right brian,islamise it.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdullah_Ocalan

How many muslims did you see in that video brian, the one who left islam to become christian does not count. Roll Eyes

What an effort from a Kurdish atheist in a Turkish jail,Brian will tell us the PKK are terrorists and the Turks never did anything wrong to the Kurds, destroying a few thousand Kurdish villages was really no harm done by the Turks was it brian.

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #83 - Nov 30^th, 2014 at 12:58am

Thus far you have presented no evidence that counters the claims made in the several sources that HB and I have presented which point out the majority of Kurds are Muslim.

One of the links that HB quoted was from the University of Ultrecht. by Professor Martin Bruinessen, Professor Emeritus, Department of Philosophy and Religious Studies
Section Arabic and Islam, whom is obviously an academic.

Speaking of which, here is another link which makes the point about how the majority of Kurds are Muslim, Baron:
Quote:

The Kurds and Islam

It has been said that Kurds "hold their Islam lightly," meaning that they are not so vehement about Islam and do not identify as closely with it as the Arabs do. This is perhaps due to two factors: First, many Kurds still feel some connection with the ancient Zoroastrian faith, and feel it is an original Kurdish spirituality that far predates the seventh century AD arrival of Muhammad. Secondly, their principal oppressors and antagonists for over one thousand years have been fellow Muslims, who have showered far more pain than pleasure upon the Kurds.

Nonetheless, most Kurds are Muslims, and about 75% today are at least nominally members of the majority Sunni branch. As many as four million Kurds are Shiites, living mostly in Iran where the Shiite faith predominates. However, the Kurds generally strive to express their Islam in a distinct fashion. For example, the Sunni Muslim Kurds of Turkey have adopted the Shafi'i legal code, ignoring the general rule among the surrounding Arabs and Turks, who adhere to the Hanafi school. Mystical practices and participation in Sufi orders are also widespread among Kurds. Many of these orders are considered heretical by rigid orthodox Muslims. Drawing heavily on shamanism, Zoroastrianism and elements of Christianity, Kurdish mysticism places emphasis on the direct experience of God through meditation, ecstatic experiences and the intercession of holy men or sheiks. Most Kurds possess a tangible sense of the supernatural, readily acknowledging demonic activity in the form of evil spirits and curses; they often worship at shrines or other holy places.

[Source]

Oh, and look, another academic article:
Quote:

The Islamization of the Kurds “started to materialize probably from the 9th century AD onward, becoming later, in the 10th century, an overwhelming process.”[3] Gradually over the course of more than 1000 years the Kurds became a majority Islamic people. Many Kurds have in fact played a variety of roles, some significant, in the overall history and development of Islam.
[...]
Today most Kurds would, in general, identify with strict Sunni orthodoxy, adhering to the Shafi’i school of law, while simultaneously possessing what may be the most pluralistic and heterodox worldview among any Muslim people of the Near East.[5] Echoing this perspective one observer considered the Kurdish religion to be “a form of Islam contaminated by pagan superstitions and strange rites, many of which are said to have points of resemblance with Zoroastrianism, Buddhism, and other heathen cults.”[6]

[Source]

Oh, and look, here is another article:
Quote:

Kurds are also Muslims, the majority of whom are Sunni. However, they identify themselves as only the Kurdish people. Kurds make up 15 to 20 percent of Iraq's population, between four and five million people. Kurds descend from Indo-European tribes.

[Source]

Oh, and look, another:
Quote:

Religion

Nearly three fifths of the Kurds, almost all Kurmanji-speakers, are today at least nominally Sunni Muslims of Shafiite rite. There are also some followers of mainstream Shiitem Islam among the Kurds, particularly in and around the cities of Kirmanshah, to Hamadan and Bijar in southern and eastern Kurdistan and the Khurasan. These Shite Kurds number around half a million. The overwhelming majority of Muslim Kurds are followers of one several mystic Sufi orders, most importantly the Bektashi order of the northwest Kurdistan, the Naqshbandi order in the west and north, Qadiri orders of east and central Kurdistan, and Nurbakhshi of the south.

[Source]

So, we have an increasing number of links to articles which all make the same point, Baron - the majority of Kurds are Muslim.

So how about you speak to that point, instead of haring off on other things? Roll Eyes

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #84 - Nov 30^th, 2014 at 8:59am

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 29^th, 2014 at 11:33pm:

So nothing to say about the revolution going on that was inspired by the atheist Ocalam?

You and HB have presented no academic articles, are you trying to pass off wikipedia and frontpagemag as academic which would get laughed out of any academic institution, fair dinkum this just proves you and HB would be lucky to have half a brain between the pair of you.

Everything i have said is backed up in this BBC documentary that talks to Kurdish people fairly recently instead of your 15 plus year old webpages of dubious sources.

Do they mention something about all enemy neighbors claiming they are a one party atheist state,is there over a dozen references to Abdullah Ocalan, how many muslims do you see 1 or 2.

They give a lot of credit to the atheist Ocalam in that BBC documentary who you claim has returned to his islamic roots,go edit his wiki page set things right brian,islamise it.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdullah_Ocalan

How many muslims did you see in that video brian, the one who left islam to become christian does not count. Roll Eyes

What an effort from a Kurdish atheist in a Turkish jail,Brian will tell us the PKK are terrorists and the Turks never did anything wrong to the Kurds, destroying a few thousand Kurdish villages was really no harm done by the Turks was it brian.

brian your articles are old and do not reflect the reality of 2014 in Rojava, have you got any sources that are current from credible sources or are you stuck in the past like most muslims?

There is a revolution going on in Rojava which was inspired by the atheist Abdullah Ocalam, the Kurds are the only people with religious and social,political freedom, the kurds are the only people in the middle east who don't punish muslims for apostasy, they thank the atheist Ocalam for this it had nothing to do with Islam.

Muslims hate atheists, it might explain why the muslim neighbors of the Kurds attack them-
Quote:

The atheist who does good deeds is worse than a muslim who kills his mother and takes care of dogs.

The creator of man is Allah, who created the heavens and earth, and created all things.man has to acknowledge this reality.It is also the matter of common sense that the creator of this universe is the one who deserves to be worshipped,obeyed,feared,hoped and loved.
This means one who does not acknowledge this truth is an atheist and denier,and is ignorant and corrupt,his intellect is less than human
islamqa.info/en/10300

You claimed to be atheist brian, i guess Munajid is right your intellect is less than human. Roll Eyes

Sunni Islam preaches atheists are less than human, if sunni Islam is the majority as you claim then why is Ocalam so popular with all Kurds?

Does an Arab kurd wear an Ocalam badge in that BBC video?

If muslims are the majority as you claim then why are very few muslims in modern videos with the Kurds?

Is there a muslim apostate who converted to christianity in that video, what does he say about Islam and communism?

Do Kurdish christians wear hijabs in that video?

The atheist Ocalam has brought human rights and secular democracy to all the Kurds,what he has achieved is greater than what Mossadegh achieved in Iran when Time magazine named him man of the year.

There is now hope in the middle east, it took an atheist to bring genuine freedom and secular democracy to the Kurdish people who have a long history of being persecuted by their muslim neighbors.

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96434	Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10 Reply #85 - Nov 30^th, 2014 at 9:40am Baron, you could always try the old boy tactic of pretending you never said Kurds aren’t Muslims. That could work.
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Baronvonrort

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #86 - Nov 30^th, 2014 at 10:22am

Karnal wrote on Nov 30^th, 2014 at 9:40am:

Baron, you could always try the old boy tactic of pretending you never said Kurds aren’t Muslims.

That could work.

I could try brians logic in claiming the atheist who inspired this change Abdullah Ocalan is actually muslim despite the fact his wiki page and everyone else says he is atheist.

That flawed BS from brian would increase the number of muslims by redefining atheists as actually being muslim.

The numbers i have seen put muslims in the minority, that BBC documentary even talks to muslim apostates who have converted to christianity.

Karnal do you think Abdullah Ocalan is a muslim like Brian claimed or is he atheist like his wiki page states?

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Brian Ross

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #87 - Nov 30^th, 2014 at 11:37am

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 30^th, 2014 at 8:59am:

brian your articles are old and do not reflect the reality of 2014 in Rojava, have you got any sources that are current from credible sources or are you stuck in the past like most muslims?

Baron, do you think a massed conversion has taken place amongst the Kurds and they have all abandoned Islam? Really?

You are fighting a rearguard action on this. You have not presented any credible evidence that the majority of Kurds are not Muslims, Baron.

Hijabs, female equality, these are all circumstantial. Show us a factual article which states that the majority of Kurds are not Muslims, please.

Otherwise, all you're doing is embarrassing yourself. Roll Eyes

Oh, look another article on the religious affiliations of the Kurds:
Quote:

Who are the Iraqi Kurds?
[...]
Nearly all Iraqi Kurds consider themselves Sunni Muslims. In our survey, 98% of Kurds in Iraq identified themselves as Sunnis and only 2% identified as Shias. (A small minority of Iraqi Kurds, including Yazidis, are not Muslims.) But being a Kurd does not necessarily mean alignment with a particular religious sect. In neighboring Iran, according to our data, Kurds were split about evenly between Sunnis and Shias.
[...]
These three major religious and ethnic groupings in Iraq – Shia Arabs, Sunni Arabs and Sunni Kurds – share certain core religious beliefs. For example, each group professes near universal belief in God (Allah) and the Prophet Muhammad, and more than nine-in-ten members of each group say they fast during the Islamic holy month of Ramadan. Though there are some important distinctions in belief and practice between Sunni and Shia Muslims, the religious differences between Sunni Arabs and Sunni Kurds are comparatively small. For example, while Shia Arabs are united in their belief that visiting the shrines of Muslim saints is acceptable (98%). Fewer Sunni Arabs (71%) and Sunni Kurds (59%) support this practice.

[Source]

Oh, look, another academic citation that shows the majority of Kurds are Muslim. I can't include the quoted tabulated breakdown by province 'cause the formatting is crap but it's there, Baron. It's only for Turkey and Iran but it gives a lot of information and not all Kurds as you know, live in Iraq.

Ah, and look, another article!
Quote:

RELIGION

The Kurds at first resisted the Islamic invasion during the seventh century AD . They gave in after the Islamic victory near the modern-day Iraqi city of Sulaimaniya in AD 643. Most Kurds are now Sunni Muslims (a branch of Islam). About one-fifth are Shi'ite Muslims, most of whom live in Iran.

Many Kurds belong to Sufi (Islam mystic) brotherhoods. They meet to chant and dance together to worship Allah. The Sufi brotherhoods are very important in Kurdish village life. There are about 1 million Kurdish 'Alawis (a secretive faith based on and distinct from Islam) in Turkey, and 40,000 to 70,000 Yazidis mostly in Armenia and Azerbaijan. Yazidism is a small religion that combines aspects of Islam, Judaism, and Christianity. A very few Kurds are Christian.

[Source]

Here is an article from Global Security about religion in Iraq, which mentions the Kurds:
Quote:

Religious Structures

While a precise statistical breakdown is impossible to ascertain because of likely inaccuracies in the latest census (conducted in 1997), according to best estimates, 97 percent of the population of 22 million persons are Muslim. Shi'a Muslims--predominantly Arab, but also including Turkomen, Faili Kurds, and other groups--constitute a 60 to 65 percent majority. Sunni Muslims make up 32 to 37 percent of the population (approximately 18 to 20 percent are Sunni Kurds, 12 to 15 percent Sunni Arabs, and the remainder Sunni Turkomen). The remaining approximately 3 percent of the overall population consist of Christians (Assyrians, Chaldeans, Roman Catholics, and Armenians), Yazidis, Mandaeans, and a small number of Jews.

The Sunni population of Iraq is predominately Hanafi, while the Shi'i population is predominantly Ja'fari. Kurdish Muslims are mostly of the Sunni branch, but mainly follow the Shafi'i school of Sunni Islam, which distinguishes them from the majority of the Iraqi Arab Sunni Muslim population, which is primarily of the Hanafi school of Sunni Islam. There is also a strong Sufi mystic following among the Kurds. Sufism contributes to a less orthodox practice of Islam among much of the Kurdish population.

[Source]

Bugger me, here is another article:
Quote:

Religions in Kurdistan
[...]
ISLAM

Nearly three fifths of the Kurds, almost all Kurmanji-speakers, are today at least nominally Sunni Muslims of Shafiite rite. There are also some followers of mainstream Shiitem Islam among the Kurds, particularly in and around the cities of Kirmashan, to Hamadan and Bijar in southern and eastern Kurdistan and the Khurasan. These Siite Kurds number around half a million.

[Source]

They all seem to be agreeing, Baron - the majority of Kurds are Muslim.

How is out there on your limb? Roll Eyes

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Brian Ross

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #88 - Nov 30^th, 2014 at 11:39am

Karnal wrote on Nov 30^th, 2014 at 9:40am:

Baron, you could always try the old boy tactic of pretending you never said Kurds aren’t Muslims.

That could work.

Ah, yes. He could. It won't work though.

At the moment he's trying to divert and distract the main question by rabbiting on about the leader of the PKK - which it should be noted does not represent the majority of Kurds, anywhere. Roll Eyes

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Islamic state- Selling Yazidi sex slaves for $10
Reply #89 - Nov 30^th, 2014 at 11:44am

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 30^th, 2014 at 11:39am:

Karnal wrote on Nov 30^th, 2014 at 9:40am:

Baron, you could always try the old boy tactic of pretending you never said Kurds aren’t Muslims.

That could work.

Ah, yes. He could. It won't work though.

At the moment he's trying to divert and distract the main question by rabbiting on about the leader of the PKK - which it should be noted does not represent the majority of Kurds, anywhere. Roll Eyes

How many times does Ocalan get the credit for the Rojava revolution in the BBC documentary brian?

Do arab kurds wear Ocalan badges in that video?

Do you have anything current on the Kurds or are all your links outdated to the reality of 2014?

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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