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Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni (Read 9641 times)
Lord Herbert
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Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Dec 28th, 2014 at 8:32pm
 
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Brian Ross
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #1 - Dec 28th, 2014 at 8:35pm
 
Pickering's assumption is unfounded, Herbie.  There is no evidence to support his claim (as usual).   Roll Eyes
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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour.  Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Soren
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #2 - Dec 28th, 2014 at 11:42pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Dec 28th, 2014 at 8:35pm:
Pickering's assumption is unfounded, Herbie.  There is no evidence to support his claim (as usual).   Roll Eyes

Nor is there reason to doubt his insight.  Do you have any evidence to dispel his claims?
Brain? You know so much about Muslims. Tell us where he goes wrong.



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ian
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #3 - Dec 28th, 2014 at 11:47pm
 
The vast majority of Australians for what ever reason do not want Islamic immigration to this country, that is indeed a fact. Only a fool would argue otherwise. even asian Australians  dont want them, the bias does not run along ethnic lines, no one wants them here.
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Karnal
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #4 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 12:04am
 
ian wrote on Dec 28th, 2014 at 11:47pm:
The vast majority of Australians for what ever reason do not want Islamic immigration to this country, that is indeed a fact. Only a fool would argue otherwise. even asian Australians  dont want them, the bias does not run along ethnic lines, no one wants them here.


"The vast majority of Australians" don’t even know what a Muslim is.

Are they Christian Lebs? Armenians? Coptic Christians? Swarthy Arabs?

A certain poster here argues Kurds aren’t Muslims because they support Uncle. Another thinks Armenian terror groups are Muslims because they blow things up. Others say Malays are more Muslim because of certain fundamentalist beliefs, Indonesians don’t count because they don’t have the same beliefs, etc, etc, etc.

Jaquie Lambie was doing alright on her anti-Sharia crusade until they asked her what Sharia law really is.

Pause.

"...Well, it obviously involves terrorism".

Pause.

Australians may or may not like Muslims, but I doubt most could name any they personally know or have even rubbed shoulders with.

And how can you even tell people are Muslims?
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Soren
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #5 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 12:33am
 
Karnal wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 12:04am:
ian wrote on Dec 28th, 2014 at 11:47pm:
The vast majority of Australians for what ever reason do not want Islamic immigration to this country, that is indeed a fact. Only a fool would argue otherwise. even asian Australians  dont want them, the bias does not run along ethnic lines, no one wants them here.


"The vast majority of Australians" don’t even know what a Muslim is.

Are they Christian Lebs? Armenians? Coptic Christians? Swarthy Arabs?

A certain poster here argues Kurds aren’t Muslims because they support Uncle. Another thinks Armenian terror groups are Muslims because they blow things up. Others say Malays are more Muslim because of certain fundamentalist beliefs, Indonesians don’t count because they don’t have the same beliefs, etc, etc, etc.

Jaquie Lambie was doing alright on her anti-Sharia crusade until they asked her what Sharia law really is.

Pause.

"...Well, it obviously involves terrorism".

Pause.

Australians may or may not like Muslims, but I doubt most could name any they personally know or have even rubbed shoulders with.

And how can you even tell people are Muslims?



That's right, PB, people don't know what Muslim is but they opposite it coz they are like Jaquie. You MUST be an ignorant bogan if you oppose Islam.

Easy.



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Brian Ross
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #6 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 1:25am
 
When Mr.Pickering posts actual public opinion poll data to support his supposition, he'll be able to prove that his claim was correct.  What?  He hasn't?  How surprising!  Pickering, like Herbie, relies on people like Soren and Co., our usual gang of Islamophobes to shore up his position for him.

There is no proof at the present moment that Mr.Pickering claim that "Most Australians Now Anti-Muslim" is true.  Indeed, earlier this year, Newspoll reported on July 16, 2014 that:
Quote:
HIGHER migration levels are favoured by a fifth of Australians, in an exclusive Newspoll survey revealing robust support for the most multicultural society on earth.

Nearly half the people ­surveyed support Australia’s ­existing immigration intake, which settled 190,000 immigrants last year in the world’s largest per capita intake. Two-thirds were skilled migrants.

Twenty-two per cent favour an even higher intake, with support strongest among the young, those on high incomes and capital city-dwellers.

European, African and Asian migration enjoys the strongest public support, with 26 per cent of Australians desiring more ­migrants from Europe. Another 18 per cent want to see more Asian migrants, and 20 per cent support more immigration from Africa.

In contrast, just 14 per cent of Australians want to see more Muslim migrants, and 37 per cent favour a cut.

[Source]

Only approximately a third want a cut in Muslim immigration.

While only an indirect measure, it can be considered reasonably representative of Australian attitudes towards Muslims in general.

Roy Morgan OTOH, hasn't even asked a question which mentions Muslims since 2011.   Roll Eyes

Essential Research asked a question in their poll of Sep 2, 2014:

Quote:
Q.  When  a  family  applies  to  migrate  to  Australia,  should  it  be  possible  for  them  to  be  rejected  purely  on  the  basis  of  their  religion?
[...]
63%  believed  that  when  a  family  applies  to  migrate  to  Australia,  they  should  not  be  rejected  purely  on  the  basis  of  their  religion  and  21%  think  it  should  be  possible  to  reject  purely  based  on  religion. 
These  figures  are  similar  to  when  this  question  was  asked in 2011.

[Source]

Again, only an indirect indicator but one which positively shows that Australians think far more deeply about this issue than they are often given credit for.  Note also there has been no dramatic increase in three years since the question was last asked.

The Scanlon Foundation Poll, July 2014 reported:
Quote:
Questions on attitude to Christian, Buddhist and Muslim faith groups find that, as in past surveys, a very small proportion are negative towards Christian and Buddhist faiths (close to 5%), but a proportion almost
five times higher (close to 25%) towards Muslims.

[Source]

While 25% is relatively high, it still does not match what Mr.Pickering claimed!

So, where is Mr.Pickering pulling his claim from?  Why, of course from his own intolerant viewpoint.    Roll Eyes

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour.  Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Karnal
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #7 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 1:49am
 
Soren wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 12:33am:
Karnal wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 12:04am:
ian wrote on Dec 28th, 2014 at 11:47pm:
The vast majority of Australians for what ever reason do not want Islamic immigration to this country, that is indeed a fact. Only a fool would argue otherwise. even asian Australians  dont want them, the bias does not run along ethnic lines, no one wants them here.


"The vast majority of Australians" don’t even know what a Muslim is.

Are they Christian Lebs? Armenians? Coptic Christians? Swarthy Arabs?

A certain poster here argues Kurds aren’t Muslims because they support Uncle. Another thinks Armenian terror groups are Muslims because they blow things up. Others say Malays are more Muslim because of certain fundamentalist beliefs, Indonesians don’t count because they don’t have the same beliefs, etc, etc, etc.

Jaquie Lambie was doing alright on her anti-Sharia crusade until they asked her what Sharia law really is.

Pause.

"...Well, it obviously involves terrorism".

Pause.

Australians may or may not like Muslims, but I doubt most could name any they personally know or have even rubbed shoulders with.

And how can you even tell people are Muslims?



That's right, PB, people don't know what Muslim is but they opposite it coz they are like Jaquie. You MUST be an ignorant bogan if you oppose Islam.

Easy.



It’s easy to confuse Armenians Christians with Muslims innit, old boy.

You think Muslims are okay if they don’t get about in pyjamas and headscarves. Your key criteria for Muselness is dress sense.

Easy.
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Karnal
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #8 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 1:52am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 1:25am:
When Mr.Pickering posts actual public opinion poll data to support his supposition, he'll be able to prove that his claim was correct.  What?  He hasn't?  How surprising!  Pickering, like Herbie, relies on people like Soren and Co., our usual gang of Islamophobes to shore up his position for him.

There is no proof at the present moment that Mr.Pickering claim that "Most Australians Now Anti-Muslim" is true.  Indeed, earlier this year, Newspoll reported on July 16, 2014 that:
Quote:
HIGHER migration levels are favoured by a fifth of Australians, in an exclusive Newspoll survey revealing robust support for the most multicultural society on earth.

Nearly half the people ­surveyed support Australia’s ­existing immigration intake, which settled 190,000 immigrants last year in the world’s largest per capita intake. Two-thirds were skilled migrants.

Twenty-two per cent favour an even higher intake, with support strongest among the young, those on high incomes and capital city-dwellers.

European, African and Asian migration enjoys the strongest public support, with 26 per cent of Australians desiring more ­migrants from Europe. Another 18 per cent want to see more Asian migrants, and 20 per cent support more immigration from Africa.

In contrast, just 14 per cent of Australians want to see more Muslim migrants, and 37 per cent favour a cut.

[Source]

Only approximately a third want a cut in Muslim immigration.

While only an indirect measure, it can be considered reasonably representative of Australian attitudes towards Muslims in general.

Roy Morgan OTOH, hasn't even asked a question which mentions Muslims since 2011.   Roll Eyes

Essential Research asked a question in their poll of Sep 2, 2014:

Quote:
Q.  When  a  family  applies  to  migrate  to  Australia,  should  it  be  possible  for  them  to  be  rejected  purely  on  the  basis  of  their  religion?
[...]
63%  believed  that  when  a  family  applies  to  migrate  to  Australia,  they  should  not  be  rejected  purely  on  the  basis  of  their  religion  and  21%  think  it  should  be  possible  to  reject  purely  based  on  religion. 
These  figures  are  similar  to  when  this  question  was  asked in 2011.

[Source]

Again, only an indirect indicator but one which positively shows that Australians think far more deeply about this issue than they are often given credit for.  Note also there has been no dramatic increase in three years since the question was last asked.

The Scanlon Foundation Poll, July 2014 reported:
Quote:
Questions on attitude to Christian, Buddhist and Muslim faith groups find that, as in past surveys, a very small proportion are negative towards Christian and Buddhist faiths (close to 5%), but a proportion almost
five times higher (close to 25%) towards Muslims.

[Source]

While 25% is relatively high, it still does not match what Mr.Pickering claimed!

So, where is Mr.Pickering pulling his claim from?  Why, of course from his own intolerant viewpoint.    Roll Eyes



True, Brain, but it’s not ignorance, it’s insight.

You know, like Jaquie.
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ian
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #9 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 2:05am
 
funny, getting a 404 page not found on all your links Karnal. I sniff bullsh!t
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #10 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 8:50am
 
A journalist is supposed to be just that -- not a muck-raking bigot, liar and racist trying to unnecessarily  stir up hatred.

Here's what the business commentator for the SMH, Michael Pascoe said about Pickering in 2012.

"Pickering is commonly known as a cartoonist, but he's also an inveterate liar, a bankrupt conman with a seedy history of fleecing the gullible of millions of dollars while not paying his own bills.

"With various failed business ventures and numerous personal relationships of equal standard, for decades he has plied a grubby trade behind sundry stooges and partners, assisted by the odd sharp lawyer and hapless corporate and consumer regulators. He is not a nice man."

http://www.smh.com.au/business/larry-pickering--the-conman-stalking-gillard-2012...

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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
 
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #11 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 9:22am
 
ian wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 2:05am:
funny, getting a 404 page not found on all your links Karnal. I sniff bullsh!t


It wasn't Karnal who posted them, and they work fine for me.

Basically your arrogant claim has been exposed for the nonsense that it is - as usual.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Soren
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #12 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 10:11am
 


Nearly half of Australians are anti-Muslim: study
Updated 23 Feb 2011, 12:28pm

A decade-long national study has found that nearly 50 per cent of Australians identify themselves as having anti-Muslim attitudes.

Researchers from universities across the country polled thousands of people about their attitudes to different cultures and whether they had experienced racism.

The research found around one in 10 Australians identified themselves as prejudiced against other cultures.

About one-quarter of those surveyed said they had anti-Semitic or anti-Asian attitudes, while a slightly larger number were prejudiced against Aborigines.

Anti-Muslim sentiment was even higher, at 48.6 per cent.


http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-02-23/nearly-half-of-australians-are-anti-muslim...


WIth the Arab Spring, Syria, ISIL, London beheading, Canadian attacks, Sydney seige - do you think that people have been  warming to Islam since that survey was concluded?
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ian
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #13 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 11:36am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 9:22am:
ian wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 2:05am:
funny, getting a 404 page not found on all your links Karnal. I sniff bullsh!t


It wasn't Karnal who posted them, and they work fine for me.

Basically your arrogant claim has been exposed for the nonsense that it is - as usual.
still getting 404 on those links, seems its your claim thats being exposed as arrogant nonsense
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ian
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Re: Some interesting history here: Shia v Sunni
Reply #14 - Dec 29th, 2014 at 11:38am
 
Soren wrote on Dec 29th, 2014 at 10:11am:
Nearly half of Australians are anti-Muslim: study
Updated 23 Feb 2011, 12:28pm

A decade-long national study has found that nearly 50 per cent of Australians identify themselves as having anti-Muslim attitudes.

Researchers from universities across the country polled thousands of people about their attitudes to different cultures and whether they had experienced racism.

The research found around one in 10 Australians identified themselves as prejudiced against other cultures.

About one-quarter of those surveyed said they had anti-Semitic or anti-Asian attitudes, while a slightly larger number were prejudiced against Aborigines.

Anti-Muslim sentiment was even higher, at 48.6 per cent.


http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-02-23/nearly-half-of-australians-are-anti-muslim...


WIth the Arab Spring, Syria, ISIL, London beheading, Canadian attacks, Sydney seige - do you think that people have been  warming to Islam since that survey was concluded?

Thanks Soren, your link works. That survey was done in 2011, the number would be much higher now.
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