Australian Politics Forum - Lying Abbott

John Smith

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Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable
Reply #45 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:06pm

Swagman wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 2:59pm:

Really.....all zero of them

zero? what about the changes to tax concessions on super , changes to how you claim car expenses .. they're two of the top of my head, I'm sure there were many more Cheesy

Swagman wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 2:59pm:

Yes they managed to boot 2 Prime Ministers

just think how much more they could have accomplished of Rudd wasn't busy being a snake in the grass

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Bam

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Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable
Reply #46 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:18pm

Swagman wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 11:48am:

Bam wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 10:54am:

Swagman wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 9:53am:

Labor sustain Medicare with debt when in Govt.

Is compounding debt sustainable?

This argument is inaccurate. The reality is different. All government expenditure is funded out of consolidated revenue with appropriation bills in accordance with the Constitution. Consolidated revenue includes government bonds (the so-called "debt") but these bonds are not the main source of government revenue.

It is therefore inaccurate to point at one area of expenditure and say "that is funded with debt" while ignoring two realities: (1) debt isn't the main source of government revenue, and (2) all government expenditure is funded out of the same source of funds.

It doesn't matter what expenditure item you want to add to the equation, spending more than one earns on them is unsustainable.

So let's increase taxes then, that will fix the budget. We don't even need to increase the headline tax rates. Abolishing a large pile of expensive tax loopholes could bring the budget to surplus without difficulty. We could also cut $20 billion of wasteful spending as well to strengthen the budget further. But the abolition of tax loopholes must be looked at as a source of revenue.

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Perpetual budget deficits are unsustainable.

Tell that to the grave of Menzies, who had no budget surpluses in his entire time as Prime Minister.

Which government is the only government that had budget surpluses during the entire term of government? Whitlam.

Which government first stated that budget surpluses were a desirable aim? Whitlam.

Since the Liberals first won office in 1949, what percentage of budgets for both major parties have been in surplus? About 26 per cent for both sides of politics.

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Bam

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Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable
Reply #47 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:23pm

John Smith wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:06pm:

just think how much more they could have accomplished of Rudd wasn't busy being a snake in the grass

Or how much more could have been accomplished if Rudd had called a double dissolution election early in 2010 when he was still popular. It was his backdown over the ETS that started the slide.

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John Smith

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Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable
Reply #48 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:33pm

Bam wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:23pm:

John Smith wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:06pm:

just think how much more they could have accomplished of Rudd wasn't busy being a snake in the grass

Or how much more could have been accomplished if Rudd had called a double dissolution election early in 2010 when he was still popular. It was his backdown over the ETS that started the slide.

I agree ... that was the beginning of the end for Rudd ... if he'd called a DD Abbott would be history and labor wouldn't have had all the infighting that they ended up having

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable
Reply #49 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:37pm

John Smith wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:33pm:

Bam wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:23pm:

John Smith wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:06pm:

just think how much more they could have accomplished of Rudd wasn't busy being a snake in the grass

Or how much more could have been accomplished if Rudd had called a double dissolution election early in 2010 when he was still popular. It was his backdown over the ETS that started the slide.

I agree ... that was the beginning of the end for Rudd ... if he'd called a DD Abbott would be history and labor wouldn't have had all the infighting that they ended up having

The ALP's infighting ran much deeper than that.
It wouldn't have spelled the end for Rudd when it did but if you read the memoirs of any number of that front bench he was on borrowed time.
He was intolerable to 90% of his colleagues.

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Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 75137 Gender:	Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable Reply #50 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:39pm Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 3:37pm: He was intolerable to 90% of his colleagues. he may have been, but winning two elections would have, for a few years at least, made him untouchable.
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Ex Dame Pansi Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 24168	Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable Reply #51 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 4:07pm Of course Medicare is affordable. Abbott wouldn't have spent all that money on those (useless) fighter jets and submarines if the nation's health portfolio was to become unsustainable. Abbott wouldn't be that irresponsible, surely.
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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable
Reply #52 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 4:15pm

The national defence budget has nothing to do with it.

You may not have noticed but western countries are subject to huge threats recently from radical extremism with volatile countries just to the north of Australia.

This is far from the time to reduce military spending.
We have a fight on our hands against the scourge of radical Islam.

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Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 75137 Gender:	Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable Reply #53 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 4:43pm Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 4:15pm: You may not have noticed but western countries are subject to huge threats recently from radical extremism with volatile countries just to the north of Australia. you may not have noticed but thats one war you can't win simply by having the bigger toys ....
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longweekend58 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 45675 Gender:	Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable Reply #54 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 6:10pm St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 12:03pm: Actually, some were but a LOT were put in by Howard. other than family tax benefit, they were all in place BEFORE howard try and get something right. you already look stooopid.
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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable Reply #55 - Jan 18^th, 2015 at 10:50pm Super tax concessions — put in by Howard Asset millionaires on the Age Pension — Howard. Private health care rebate — Howard. Want me to go on? Oh, Too many tax cuts to the rich — Costello Robbing education, health, infrastructure budgets to show bigger surpluses? John & Pete’
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longweekend58

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Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable
Reply #56 - Jan 19^th, 2015 at 7:55am

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 18^th, 2015 at 10:50pm:

Super tax concessions — put in by Howard

RUBBISH.

Asset millionaires on the Age Pension — Howard.

WRONG

Private health care rebate — Howard.

Give you that one/

Want me to go on?

Oh,

Too many tax cuts to the rich — Costello

NOT AT ALL. the rich got no more than everyone else

Robbing education, health, infrastructure budgets to show bigger surpluses? John & Pete’

JUST YOUR usual drivel and wrong.

hey! you got one thing right!!!!

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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St George of the Garden

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Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable
Reply #57 - Jan 19^th, 2015 at 8:00am

.That is one more thing than you then Cheesy

But everything I stated is true.

Howard used the once in a century boom revenue not for ANY constructive purpose other than being re-elected. What I said above was true.

The rich got huge tax cuts, those on low incomes a few $. The stuff about asset mllionaires on Age Pension, the health care rebate etc etc—all Howard and Costello.

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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable Reply #58 - Jan 19^th, 2015 at 8:01am Next financial year the cost of the concessionary tax on super will cost $50Bn, more than the Old Age and Disability pensions combined. Time to reduce this to 9.25%, the rate of award super.
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St George of the Garden

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Re: Lying Abbott - Medicare is affordable
Reply #59 - Jan 19^th, 2015 at 8:30am

Some worthwhile savings:

Quote:

Freedom of information documents reported by Sean Parnell in the Australian this week – and now available on the department’s website – revealed the Health Department’s “strategic policy group” had advised the government could save as much as $15bn a year from cutting “low value” drugs and therapies.

Duckett has suggested savings of $1bn a year are available from reducing inefficiency in public hospitals, $500m a year from workforce reform in public hospitals, or $400m to $500m a year from adopting benchmark pricing for generic pharmaceuticals.

The Australian Council of Social Service suggests saving $6.6bn a year from abolishing the private health insurance rebate, although given the Coalition’s strong ideological support for private health that would appear unlikely. It says another $400m a year could be saved from scrapping the Medicare safety net, which helps families with out-of-hospital expenses over a certain threshold and largely benefits the better off.

http://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2015/jan/16/as-sussan-ley-tries-to-pat...

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