Australian Politics Forum - Hundreds of muslims show solidarity with Oslo Jews

polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons Reply #60 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 10:09am Crucial question that FD - it will surely make all the difference to whether we commend them or mock and ridicule them.
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49042 At my desk.	Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons Reply #61 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 10:31am Kind of ironic after most of this thread was about the cynicism of it.
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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons Reply #62 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 10:55am Ironic that you find the difference between a symbolic line and a symbolic ring somehow significant? How so?
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Soren

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #63 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 12:29pm

What is significant is that 1300 Muslims were claimed to have formed a protective ring. Then it turns out that there were only 2-300 Muslims present. Of these only 20 formed a line.

We were not informed about this spectacular climb-down by Muslims who were very happy to go along with the evidently false 1300 strong protective ring wheeze. The lack of honesty and credibility is significant.

Once again.

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freediver

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #64 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 12:46pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 4^th, 2015 at 10:55am:

Ironic that you find the difference between a symbolic line and a symbolic ring somehow significant? How so?

The basic errors of fact in the reporting are significant and add to the cynical exploitation of the gesture by the Muslim protestors. If they wanted to make people cynical about the stance of the muslim community on this sort of thing they have nailed it.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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|dev|null

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #65 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 1:08pm

Bobby. wrote on Mar 4^th, 2015 at 6:32am:

SweetLambo wrote on Feb 28^th, 2015 at 1:32pm:

I knew it. It reminds me of that bogus #IllRideWithYou bullshit that was created by a racist bigot and the entire story that started it was fabricated.

Typical muslims. Cheesy

You change your name once a week -

now you're a messenger of God -

are you on any medication?

Perhaps he's one of Soren's patients, undertaking net therapy? Grin

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"Pens and books are the weapons that defeat terrorism." - Malala Yousefzai, 2013.

"we will never ever solve violence while we grasp for overly simplistic solutions."
Freediver, 2007.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #66 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 2:43pm

What is not in dispute is that hundreds - possibly up to 1000 or more - muslims turned up to the synagogue to show their solidarity with jews. The only source that is peddling blatant untruths is Soren's neo-nazi blogger that claimed only 20 turned up.

And the only people who think its significant which of those hundreds of muslims went and posed for that one particular symbolic photo-op that we've seen - are those so desperate to find a negative spin on anything muslims do. People like Soren and FD.

But for everyone else, the only significant story here is that up to 1000 muslims turned up to demonstrate their solidarity with jews

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons Reply #67 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 2:46pm Soren wrote on Mar 4^th, 2015 at 12:29pm: Then it turns out that there were only 2-300 Muslims present. It didn't "turn out" to be that at all. Far-right critics with an agenda claiming 2-300 vs mainstream newswires AFP and AP claiming over 1000... I know who I'll go with.
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Soren

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #68 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 5:52pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 4^th, 2015 at 2:43pm:

What is not in dispute is that hundreds - possibly up to 1000 or more - muslims turned up to the synagogue to show their solidarity with jews.

Far-right critics with an agenda claiming 2-300 vs mainstream newswires AFP and AP claiming over 1000...

I know who I'll go with

That is precisely what is disputed - and the art of elision and sleight of hand.

Yes, up to 1000 or 1300 PEOPLE turned up. But most of the were not Muslims but Norwegians. The 2-300 Muslim among them looked on as 20 Muslims formed not a ring - there weren't enough willing Muslims to form a ring - but a line in front.

The news from Norway?

As the small mainly elderly Jewish congregation filed out of the synagogue after Shabbat prayers, a group of young Muslims, many of them teenage girls wearing headscarves, formed a symbolic ring outside the building to roaring applause from a crowd of more than 1,000 people.

A group of Muslims - a crowd of people. Not "more than 1000 Muslims."

The Huffington Post and Reuters misrepresented the 'more than 1000 people' as 'more than 1000 Muslims' because there was a group of Muslims. I am a little surprised (not) that suddenly you are all for Big Media when they make a mistake in your favour. Huff Post (owned by AOL), Reuters (founder's father was a German - waddaya call them? - er....

rabbi

). Oh-oh.

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 4^th, 2015 at 2:43pm:

I know who I'll go with

Don't let the brovvers catch you, gandy.

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« Last Edit: Mar 4^th, 2015 at 6:02pm by Soren »

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polite_gandalf

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #69 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 9:40pm

Soren wrote on Mar 4^th, 2015 at 5:52pm:

Yes, up to 1000 or 1300 PEOPLE turned up. But most of the were not Muslims but Norwegians.

You're just peddling blatant untruths Soren. The claim that "most" of the crowd was non-muslim comes from 1. a red-neck with an agenda who claims he was there 2. a distortion of a Norwegian police statement that there were "many" (not - not "most") ethnic Norwegians present. And besides, who says muslims have to be identifiable by the colour of their skin? The organiser was himself an ethnic Norwegian convert.

I offer you a more balanced clarification:

Quote:

Naustdal said he did not know the exact number of Muslims who stood behind the police barrier in the outer ring, but that it was “in the hundreds.”

Ervin Kohn, the president of the 1,400-strong Jewish community, told The Times of Israel Monday, “How do you distinguish between a Muslim and a non-Muslim?”

Should they have had somebody walking around and “counting brown faces? That’s racism,” he said.

Read more: Misinformation mars Oslo interfaith 'peace ring' | The Times of Israel http://www.timesofisrael.com/misinformation-mars-oslo-interfaith-peace-ring/#ixzz3TPqo5MaX
Follow us: @timesofisrael on Twitter | timesofisrael on Facebook

Its a reasonable question raised by the Jewish leader no? How do you distinguish who, in a large group of people, is muslim and who is not?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Soren

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #70 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 10:47pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 4^th, 2015 at 9:40pm:

Soren wrote on Mar 4^th, 2015 at 5:52pm:

Yes, up to 1000 or 1300 PEOPLE turned up. But most of the were not Muslims but Norwegians.

You're just peddling blatant untruths Soren. The claim that "most" of the crowd was non-muslim comes from 1. a red-neck with an agenda who claims he was there 2. a distortion of a Norwegian police statement that there were "many" (not - not "most") ethnic Norwegians present. And besides, who says muslims have to be identifiable by the colour of their skin? The organiser was himself an ethnic Norwegian convert.

I offer you a more balanced clarification:

Quote:

Naustdal said he did not know the exact number of Muslims who stood behind the police barrier in the outer ring, but that it was “in the hundreds.”

Ervin Kohn, the president of the 1,400-strong Jewish community, told The Times of Israel Monday, “How do you distinguish between a Muslim and a non-Muslim?”

Should they have had somebody walking around and “counting brown faces? That’s racism,” he said.

Read more: Misinformation mars Oslo interfaith 'peace ring' | The Times of Israel http://www.timesofisrael.com/misinformation-mars-oslo-interfaith-peace-ring/#ixzz3TPqo5MaX
Follow us: @timesofisrael on Twitter | timesofisrael on Facebook

Its a reasonable question raised by the Jewish leader no? How do you distinguish who, in a large group of people, is muslim and who is not?

Funny.

In Norway - Denmark, Sweden, Finland, Iceland - the stats mean that if you are white, fair skinned and blue eyed you are a native Scandinavian. If you are Muslims you are not white, blonde and blue eyed. You are a tinted Somali, North African or Middle Easterner, Indian or SE Asian.

Just because two white guys converted to Islam in the last 10 years doe not invalidate the stats.

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MumboJumbo

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #71 - Mar 4^th, 2015 at 11:13pm

Soren wrote on Mar 4^th, 2015 at 10:47pm:

In Norway - Denmark, Sweden, Finland, Iceland - the stats mean that if you are white, fair skinned and blue eyed you are a native Scandinavian. If you are Muslims you are not white, blonde and blue eyed. You are a tinted Somali, North African or Middle Easterner, Indian or SE Asian.

Soren, you're confusing religion with race. While there may be a significant correlation between the two, it isn't accurate to say the black guy's a muslim because he's black.

Look at it this way -- some white people convert; or if you prefer, some black people leave.

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See Profile For Update wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:58pm:

Why the bugger did I get stuck on a planet chalked full of imbeciles?

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polite_gandalf

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #72 - Mar 5^th, 2015 at 5:10am

Soren wrote on Mar 4^th, 2015 at 10:47pm:

In Norway - Denmark, Sweden, Finland, Iceland - the stats mean that if you are white, fair skinned and blue eyed you are a native Scandinavian. If you are Muslims you are not white, blonde and blue eyed.

And yet the very organizer of the demonstration was a white native who converted. You don't have a fogging clue what colour skin the muslims who turned up on that particular night had.

The only significant fact to come out of this discussion is that there is only one side peddling blatant lies - and its your neo-nazi bloggers claiming that only 20 muslims turned up.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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freediver

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #73 - Mar 5^th, 2015 at 7:52am

What this really shows is just how desperate Muslims and their apologists are to find a positive Islam news story to somehow offset the endless stream of Muslims behaving badly. That we have Muslims like Gandalf now insisting that the actual facts, including how many Muslims turned up, do not matter, just shows how much they are willing to abandon in the interests of spin and misrepresenting the threat posed by Islam.

Quote:

What is not in dispute is that hundreds - possibly up to 1000 or more - muslims turned up to the synagogue to show their solidarity with jews. The only source that is peddling blatant untruths is Soren's neo-nazi blogger that claimed only 20 turned up.

And of course your article claiming that over 1000 turned up and formed a ring around the Synagog.

Quote:

And the only people who think its significant which of those hundreds of muslims went and posed for that one particular symbolic photo-op that we've seen - are those so desperate to find a negative spin on anything muslims do. People like Soren and FD.

Actually it was the chanting about Islamophobia that took my interest. That it was compounded by more untruths just adds to my cynicism. Muslims just don't even comprehend solidarity with non-Muslims, which is why they cannot comprehend why people might baulk at them turning up to a Synagog after Muslims slaughtered Jews, and more Muslims turned out en masse to mourn one of the terrorists, then declaring that the real problem is people's "irrational fear" of Islam. The mind boggles at just how out of touch these people are.

Quote:

But for everyone else, the only significant story here is that up to 1000 muslims

Your thread title still says over 1000.

Quote:

turned up to demonstrate their solidarity with jews

And to tell the Jews they are irrational to fear Islam in response to Muslims slaughtering Jews in the name of Islam, and a far greater number of Muslims turned up to ourne the terrorist than to forma protective ring.

Quote:

You're just peddling blatant untruths Soren.

Unlike Gandalf, who who knows what version of the truth he is going with, even if it is the wrong one. 1300 Muslims form a ring, to a few Muslims line up out the front. It's all the same. The facts don't matter, only the gesture, even if they stuffed that up too.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: British muslims protest Charlie Hebdo cartoons
Reply #74 - Mar 5^th, 2015 at 11:49am

freediver wrote on Mar 5^th, 2015 at 7:52am:

That we have Muslims like Gandalf now insisting that the actual facts, including how many Muslims turned up, do not matter

The facts do matter - like the fact that there were a lot more than 20 that turned up to demonstrate their solidarity with the jews. How many of those made the symbolic ring for that particular photo-op does not matter.

freediver wrote on Mar 5^th, 2015 at 7:52am:

And of course your article claiming that over 1000 turned up and formed a ring around the Synagog.

The times of Israel article I posted explains why they decided to use just a few people to form a symbolic line in front of the synagogue, and confirming what was obvious from the beginning - that there were a lot more muslims there ready to form the ring than the few who are seen forming that symbolic line.

freediver wrote on Mar 5^th, 2015 at 7:52am:

And to tell the Jews they are irrational to fear Islam in response to Muslims slaughtering Jews in the name of Islam

The actual jews there certainly didn't share any of this cynicism, and indeed expressed only gratitude at the gesture. Self haters do you think? Battered wife syndrome?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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