Australian Politics Forum - Milne wrong and using dead for political gain

Happy Lucky Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1030 Gender:	Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain Reply #45 - Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:21pm Milne made no comment about the people stacked like sardines below decks who couldn't get out because they were trapped. That's why so many died- greedy people smuggling criminals.
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longweekend58

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #46 - Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:58pm

Happy Lucky wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:21pm:

Milne made no comment about the people stacked like sardines below decks who couldn't get out because they were trapped. That's why so many died- greedy people smuggling criminals.

Milne onlky makes sense when she is quiet. When she starts to talk she sounds awful and makes even less sense. what 'dignity' is there in Europe adopting policies that encourages boats to come over and tens of thousands die as a result? There is no dignity in an untimely death.

Milne is a fool. Not even Bob Brown would have been quite so foolish.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain Reply #47 - Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:58pm longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:19pm: stopping to boats has saved thousands of lives Rubbish. For that to be true there would have to be a net reduction in asylum seeker deaths by sea globally. There has in fact been a net increase since the boats "stopped".
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longweekend58

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #48 - Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 7:10pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:58pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:19pm:

stopping to boats has saved thousands of lives

Rubbish. For that to be true there would have to be a net reduction in asylum seeker deaths by sea globally. There has in fact been a net increase since the boats "stopped".

ah... so the 'gandalf the fool' logic style is to add up deaths on the other side of the world and blame Abbott for them. Interesting.

in OUR locale, ie the one where we can effect change, the boats have stopped. I am sure the success of this policy and the saving of thousands of lives is a difficult thing for you to swallow.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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mothra

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #49 - Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 8:27pm

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 7:10pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:58pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:19pm:

stopping to boats has saved thousands of lives

Rubbish. For that to be true there would have to be a net reduction in asylum seeker deaths by sea globally. There has in fact been a net increase since the boats "stopped".

ah... so the 'gandalf the fool' logic style is to add up deaths on the other side of the world and blame Abbott for them. Interesting.

in OUR locale, ie the one where we can effect change, the boats have stopped. I am sure the success of this policy and the saving of thousands of lives is a difficult thing for you to swallow.

You contradict yourself. You say "the boats have stopped" in "our locale" and this is somehow saving "thousands" of lives while admitting to Ddeaths on the other side of the world".

How are we saving lives if lives are still being lost? The only thing that's changed is the location.

Furthermore, it could be reasonably argued that turning back the boats puts MORE lives at risk than intercepting the boats and helping them reach shore .. or taking the passengers on board a safer vessel. All turning the boats back is achieving, in a very real sense, is more time at sea therefore a higher risk of drowning.

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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.

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Dnarever

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #50 - Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 8:43pm

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:17pm:

Dnarever wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 10:29am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 10:17am:

Dnarever wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 9:43am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 9:05am:

Still waiting for your post showing what you think is a "snide comment"...

You don't get comprehension do you.

You still sidestep the question about balance.

Keep in mind that this is not using the Bolt loop hole of claiming it is an opinion piece - this is supposedly a news story that just happens to be 70% comprised of the writers personal commentary in opposition to the actual story.

What's wrong with the article? Nothing stated is anything less than fact. Milne actually said what she is quoted as saying. What the Abbott government has been claimed to have done in the article, actually happened.

The comments about what Abbott has done is not relevant to the story and is only used to misleadingly mock the quote from Milne by relating it to a different area.

The report is meant to be on what Milne had said not about the writers opinion on a different matter, that would be an opinion piece, this is not presented as an opinion it is meant to be a report on the event not an opportunity to use her statement against her politically.

Her statement is both prefaced and followed by unrelated commentary undermining what she had said.

You are not going to tell me that you see no bias in the article are you ?

getting a tad desperate now, aren't you? there were no factual errors in the article nor any bias. You just dont like the story because it makes you look silly.

How does it make anyone except the smelograph look silly ?

I had nothing to do with the article, I don't even think that she is right.

The fact here is that the leader of a political party has made some type of statement that the paper decided to cover, the article produced in the guise of news is mainly about the view of the writer and deliberately sets out to not report on the actual news but to dominate the story with the writers own political view on the topic.

They have not reported Milne's statement but clearly set out to undermine her opinion.

This is disgraceful reporting. Either provide the news or produce opinion but don't do one while pretending to be doing the other.

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Karnal

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #51 - Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 9:04pm

John Smith wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 2:51pm:

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 1:25pm:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 8:07am:

Not only is Milne wrong about the Abbott government "punishing refugees", not only is she wrong about the Abbott government's policy being "cruel", she is clearly using the dead for her own political gain in an attempt to score some very cheap points. If we'd followed her lead, we could very well have seen that tragedy occur somewhere between Darwin and Bali by now and the 1,200 dead on Labor/Green's watch would likely be far higher than it is now. Milne should hang her head in shame.

exactly the same thing John Smith did...

Maybe Milne is writing on this forum under the NIC John Smith?

or is it they are both politically shameless... Angry

only a lib would make asylum seekers a political issue, then complain when it is used politically

I'm also not sure how anyone who supports Abbott could even contemplate calling anyone else shameless ... the only thing that makes sense is that there must be a lot of people that don't own mirrors

Mechanic just supports good government and sound policy, JS. He’s not biased.

Like Grendel, Armchair, Longy and Happy. They just want what’s best for Australia.

Politics don’t come into it.

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Karnal Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 96313 Gender:	Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain Reply #52 - Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 9:07pm polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 4:44pm: Grendel wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 1:14pm: Milne's an idiot, Hanson-Dumb is and the rest of the parliamentary Greens aren't much better. profound. Let’s not bring politics into this, G. Grendel’s still in mourning.
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Karnal

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #53 - Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 9:10pm

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:13pm:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 8:02am:

GREENS leader Senator Christine Milne has praised European authorities for respecting the dignity of 800 dead boat people.

Despite the Abbott government ending the people smuggling trade in Australian waters and therefore saving many lives, Milne said the European approach contrasted with Australia’s cruelty.

“The reporting talks about the tragedy as people drown ... they don’t talk about ‘illegals’ ... and they don’t talk about punishing refugees,” Milne told reporters in Hobart as crews continued recovering the bodies of dead people-smuggling victims. The 800 people, mostly from Africa and the Middle East, drowned when their boat capsized off the Italian coast on Sunday. UN spokeswoman Carlotta Sami described the tragedy as “the worst massacre ever seen in the Mediterranean”.

“The response by Sicilian authorities shows that Europeans respect the dignity of boat people,” Senator Milne said. “They talk about offering help and assistance.”

An estimated 1000 asylum seekers drowned trying to reach Australia after the Labor government relaxed previously successful border protection policies in 2008.

Following the deaths of 200 asylum seekers in 2011, Greens senator Sarah Hanson-Young, whose party backed Labor’s policy switch, said: “Tragedies happen, accidents happen.”

The Abbott government restored people-smuggling deterrents after being elected in 2013. There were no confirmed deaths of asylum seekers attempting to reach Australia for the entire following year.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/no-talk-of-illegals-in-europe-says-gre...

what 'dignity' is there in 800 dead people lead to do so by slack immigration policies? there is no dignity in drowning. Milne is an idiot.

Exactly. These leftards are appalling, Longy. People are dying and they want to bring politics into it.

M0rons.

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Dnarever

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #54 - Apr 23^rd, 2015 at 6:38am

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 7:10pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:58pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:19pm:

stopping to boats has saved thousands of lives

Rubbish. For that to be true there would have to be a net reduction in asylum seeker deaths by sea globally. There has in fact been a net increase since the boats "stopped".

ah... so the 'gandalf the fool' logic style is to add up deaths on the other side of the world and blame Abbott for them. Interesting.

in OUR locale, ie the one where we can effect change, the boats have stopped. I am sure the success of this policy and the saving of thousands of lives is a difficult thing for you to swallow.

So you don't believe that the people who didn't come here also didn't try to go somewhere else instead ?

Does not seem to leave them many options.

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Dnarever

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #55 - Apr 23^rd, 2015 at 6:39am

Karnal wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 9:07pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 4:44pm:

Grendel wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 1:14pm:

Milne's an idiot, Hanson-Dumb is and the rest of the parliamentary Greens aren't much better.
Roll Eyes

profound.

Let’s not bring politics into this, G. Grendel’s still in mourning.

Yes early morning even.

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Armchair_Politician

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #56 - Apr 23^rd, 2015 at 7:04am

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 7:10pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:58pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:19pm:

stopping to boats has saved thousands of lives

Rubbish. For that to be true there would have to be a net reduction in asylum seeker deaths by sea globally. There has in fact been a net increase since the boats "stopped".

ah... so the 'gandalf the fool' logic style is to add up deaths on the other side of the world and blame Abbott for them. Interesting.

in OUR locale, ie the one where we can effect change, the boats have stopped. I am sure the success of this policy and the saving of thousands of lives is a difficult thing for you to swallow.

Just quit while you're well ahead of these fruit loops. It's like arguing with the nutters from the anti-vaccination brigade. One of them honestly believes the vaccines don't actually contain vaccines but that they really contain RFID tracking devices that enable the government to keep tabs on every one of us - at least those of us dumb enough not to see the "vaccination" program for the covert conspiracy that it really is!!! Grin

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longweekend58

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #57 - Apr 23^rd, 2015 at 9:21am

mothra wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 8:27pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 7:10pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:58pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:19pm:

stopping to boats has saved thousands of lives

Rubbish. For that to be true there would have to be a net reduction in asylum seeker deaths by sea globally. There has in fact been a net increase since the boats "stopped".

ah... so the 'gandalf the fool' logic style is to add up deaths on the other side of the world and blame Abbott for them. Interesting.

in OUR locale, ie the one where we can effect change, the boats have stopped. I am sure the success of this policy and the saving of thousands of lives is a difficult thing for you to swallow.

You contradict yourself. You say "the boats have stopped" in "our locale" and this is somehow saving "thousands" of lives while admitting to Ddeaths on the other side of the world".

How are we saving lives if lives are still being lost? The only thing that's changed is the location.

Furthermore, it could be reasonably argued that turning back the boats puts MORE lives at risk than intercepting the boats and helping them reach shore .. or taking the passengers on board a safer vessel. All turning the boats back is achieving, in a very real sense, is more time at sea therefore a higher risk of drowning.

that is a truly stupid post. The logic is non-existent.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #58 - Apr 23^rd, 2015 at 9:22am

Dnarever wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 8:43pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:17pm:

Dnarever wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 10:29am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 10:17am:

Dnarever wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 9:43am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 9:05am:

Still waiting for your post showing what you think is a "snide comment"...

You don't get comprehension do you.

You still sidestep the question about balance.

Keep in mind that this is not using the Bolt loop hole of claiming it is an opinion piece - this is supposedly a news story that just happens to be 70% comprised of the writers personal commentary in opposition to the actual story.

What's wrong with the article? Nothing stated is anything less than fact. Milne actually said what she is quoted as saying. What the Abbott government has been claimed to have done in the article, actually happened.

The comments about what Abbott has done is not relevant to the story and is only used to misleadingly mock the quote from Milne by relating it to a different area.

The report is meant to be on what Milne had said not about the writers opinion on a different matter, that would be an opinion piece, this is not presented as an opinion it is meant to be a report on the event not an opportunity to use her statement against her politically.

Her statement is both prefaced and followed by unrelated commentary undermining what she had said.

You are not going to tell me that you see no bias in the article are you ?

getting a tad desperate now, aren't you? there were no factual errors in the article nor any bias. You just dont like the story because it makes you look silly.

How does it make anyone except the smelograph look silly ?

I had nothing to do with the article, I don't even think that she is right.

The fact here is that the leader of a political party has made some type of statement that the paper decided to cover, the article produced in the guise of news is mainly about the view of the writer and deliberately sets out to not report on the actual news but to dominate the story with the writers own political view on the topic.

They have not reported Milne's statement but clearly set out to undermine her opinion.

This is disgraceful reporting. Either provide the news or produce opinion but don't do one while pretending to be doing the other.

not disgraceful at all. it is of course embarrassing to people like you to hear someone praising a people and their policies which kill thousands of people a year. But your embarrassment does not make the article bad - merely uneasy to read.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Milne wrong and using dead for political gain
Reply #59 - Apr 23^rd, 2015 at 9:24am

Armchair_Politician wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2015 at 7:04am:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 7:10pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:58pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 22^nd, 2015 at 5:19pm:

stopping to boats has saved thousands of lives

Rubbish. For that to be true there would have to be a net reduction in asylum seeker deaths by sea globally. There has in fact been a net increase since the boats "stopped".

ah... so the 'gandalf the fool' logic style is to add up deaths on the other side of the world and blame Abbott for them. Interesting.

in OUR locale, ie the one where we can effect change, the boats have stopped. I am sure the success of this policy and the saving of thousands of lives is a difficult thing for you to swallow.

Just quit while you're well ahead of these fruit loops. It's like arguing with the nutters from the anti-vaccination brigade. One of them honestly believes the vaccines don't actually contain vaccines but that they really contain RFID tracking devices that enable the government to keep tabs on every one of us - at least those of us dumb enough not to see the "vaccination" program for the covert conspiracy that it really is!!! Grin

the anti-vaccination crowd are awesome! now they are comparing vaccinations with rape. That kind of analogy is not helping their cause.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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