Australian Politics Forum - did Muhammed err?

polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: did Muhammed err? Reply #210 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:02pm freediver wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 12:46pm: but as far as Muslims know Muhammed never did anything wrong Now goodness me where did you get that assumption? Everything I have said on this matter should alert you to the opposite being concluded.
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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96334	Re: did Muhammed err? Reply #211 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:02pm freediver wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 12:46pm: So the 'eternal example' thing is overstated, but as far as Muslims know Muhammed never did anything wrong, except for that one time where Muhammed said God admonished him for not having enough sex? Who says that?
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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: did Muhammed err? Reply #212 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:04pm The same guy who said that gays should be executed for flaunting mardi-gras style. I guess...
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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96334	Re: did Muhammed err? Reply #213 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:08pm polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:04pm: The same guy who said that gays should be executed for flaunting mardi-gras style. I guess... Is this another one of those porkies, do you think? Do you think FD's trying to set Muhammed up as some kind of Muslim deity?
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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: did Muhammed err? Reply #214 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:27pm If you mean - does FD twist my, and other muslim's words and outright make crap up to incriminate muslims - the answer is yes. Just look at the wiki. And yes, he does seem to genuinely believe that muslims see Muhammad as a deity. This required some expert navigation around all my explanations clearly indicating the contrary.
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Karnal

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Re: did Muhammed err?
Reply #215 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:39pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:27pm:

And yes, he does seem to genuinely believe that muslims see Muhammad as a deity. This required some expert navigation around all my explanations clearly indicating the contrary.

Okay. So FD was being stupid and not mendacious. No worries. But we both know FD will repeat this line again, despite being educated on the subject by a Muslim.

FD used to be really keen on extracting the views of Muslims. Now he just wants to make things up. FD seems to be degenerating further and further from the 2007 FD. He's come to mirror his old nemesis, Sprint. FD will be calling to castrate them next - if he hasn't already.

FD is a textbook study on the thin veneer of civilization. Humanist values, it seems, can decay if they're not regularly reinforced. Reason, justice, liberty, the pursuit of truth - all have been happily discarded in the quest for smear. No one demonstrates the idea that the Enlightenment is over more than FD. Once, questions were asked to search for answers.

Now, a question is just a question.

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« Last Edit: Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:48pm by Karnal »

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Pho Huc

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Re: did Muhammed err?
Reply #216 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:47pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:27pm:

And yes, he does seem to genuinely believe that muslims see Muhammad as a deity. This required some expert navigation around all my explanations clearly indicating the contrary.

Occupational hazard of being raised in the catholic faith. we cop the holy trinity of god/jesus/holy spirit who are all the same being according to our doctrine.
Some of us possible get confused between the catholic dogma and the Islamic dogma of Muhammad as a prophet. Gotta cut us some slack

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The law locks up the man who steals the goose from the common, but leaves the greater criminal loose who steals the common from the goose (convict saying)

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Karnal

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Re: did Muhammed err?
Reply #217 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 3:03pm

Pho Huc wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:47pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:27pm:

And yes, he does seem to genuinely believe that muslims see Muhammad as a deity. This required some expert navigation around all my explanations clearly indicating the contrary.

Occupational hazard of being raised in the catholic faith. we cop the holy trinity of god/jesus/holy spirit who are all the same being according to our doctrine.
Some of us possible get confused between the catholic dogma and the Islamic dogma of Muhammad as a prophet. Gotta cut us some slack

True, but the entire point of Islam is that God is one being, not three. Muslims make a good case that Jesus, a prophet, was turned into God himself. Their ban on images of Muhammed is an attempt to do away with all those plaster saints and phony rituals.

Unfortunately, Muslims have turned the ban of Muhammed's image into a dogma in itself - blasphemy. Forbid something, and it becomes fetishized. Plenty of Muslims get sexually attracted by the sight of skin through a burqa.

If you leave any dogma in place without question for a reasonable time, it will become a hanging offence to go against it. Over time, dogma becomes an internalized, instinctual reaction. It's taken FD 8 years to get to the level he's at now. Unblinking, unflinching anti- Muslim dogma past the point of any call to logic. FD is now incapable of this.

Just think, if it can take an educated liberal-thinking person like FD 8 years to get past the point of no return, imagine what it must do to communities over generations.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: did Muhammed err?
Reply #218 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 3:34pm

Karnal wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:39pm:

study on the thin veneer of civilization. Humanist values, it seems, can decay if they're not regularly reinforced. Reason, justice, liberty, the pursuit of truth - all have been happily discarded in the quest for smear

Whats really ironic is how FD's freeeeedom threatens actual freedom.

Its trully a sight to behold reading his stirring Churchillian 'fight them on the beaches' defence of freedom at all costs in the face of the muslim horde, only for him to show the greatest of indifference to (say) the prospect of the nation's parliament rubber stamping the stripping of citizenship on a ministerial whim, or making it a gaolable offense for journalists to report on a past ASIO operation. - And then claiming with a straight face that muslims pose the greatest threat to our freedoms.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: did Muhammed err?
Reply #219 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 3:36pm

Pho Huc wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:47pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:27pm:

And yes, he does seem to genuinely believe that muslims see Muhammad as a deity. This required some expert navigation around all my explanations clearly indicating the contrary.

Occupational hazard of being raised in the catholic faith. we cop the holy trinity of god/jesus/holy spirit who are all the same being according to our doctrine.
Some of us possible get confused between the catholic dogma and the Islamic dogma of Muhammad as a prophet. Gotta cut us some slack

Don't beat yourself up - you've come a long way: you used to call us "Muhammadens" - assuming that Muhammad was just the tinted man's version of Jesus.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Soren

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Re: did Muhammed err?
Reply #220 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 6:45pm

Karnal wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:39pm:

FD is a textbook study on the thin veneer of civilization. Humanist values, it seems, can decay if they're not regularly reinforced. Reason, justice, liberty, the pursuit of truth - all have been happily discarded in the quest for smear.

Any criticism of Islam will be presented as 'smear', 'racism', 'Islamophobia'

Whenever Islam inspire=s some atrocity, noticing the Islamic motivation is immediately painted as 'smear'.

Islamic State? No Islam to see here.

Iran, Saudi, Pakistan, Labia, Egypt, Tunesia etc? No Islam to see here either, move on, it's just individuals exercising their personal freedoms.

Caliphate, ummah, sharia, nioqab, hijab, Ramadan, hall cerfication, radicalised youths going off to jihad, jihad itself -nah, no Islam to see here either, all just Western constructs to smear Muslims who, of course, have nothing to do with Islam.

Attacking and killing cartoonists, writers in the nm of Islam and Mohmmed - no Islam to see hr either.

Islam's role MUST not be recognised, named, discussed under any cicumstances because that is smear, racist, Islamophobic smear. Not all 1.6 billion Muslims chop heads 24/7 -therefore no Islam to see her.

Islam is its own crazy, angry, irrational, reality-denying caricature - but of course, it has nothing to do with Islam.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: did Muhammed err?
Reply #221 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 7:04pm

Soren wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 6:45pm:

Islam's role MUST not be recognised, named, discussed under any cicumstances because that is smear, racist, Islamophobic smear. Not all 1.6 billion Muslims chop heads 24/7 -therefore no Islam to see her.

Soren would you at least be honest enough to admit that you take the attitude that Islam's role MUST not be recognised, named, discussed under any circumstances - when we are talking about the good deeds and good will shown by muslims - even if they cite Islam as their motivation for their good deeds?

Can you explain to me how this is not a double standard?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Karnal

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Re: did Muhammed err?
Reply #222 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 7:48pm

Soren wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 6:45pm:

Karnal wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 2:39pm:

FD is a textbook study on the thin veneer of civilization. Humanist values, it seems, can decay if they're not regularly reinforced. Reason, justice, liberty, the pursuit of truth - all have been happily discarded in the quest for smear.

Any criticism of Islam will be presented as 'smear', 'racism', 'Islamophobia'

Whenever Islam inspire=s some atrocity, noticing the Islamic motivation is immediately painted as 'smear'.

Islamic State? No Islam to see here.

Iran, Saudi, Pakistan, Labia, Egypt, Tunesia etc? No Islam to see here either, move on, it's just individuals exercising their personal freedoms.

Caliphate, ummah, sharia, nioqab, hijab, Ramadan, hall cerfication, radicalised youths going off to jihad, jihad itself -nah, no Islam to see here either, all just Western constructs to smear Muslims who, of course, have nothing to do with Islam.

Attacking and killing cartoonists, writers in the nm of Islam and Mohmmed - no Islam to see hr either.

Islam's role MUST not be recognised, named, discussed under any cicumstances because that is smear, racist, Islamophobic smear. Not all 1.6 billion Muslims chop heads 24/7 -therefore no Islam to see her.

Islam is its own crazy, angry, irrational, reality-denying caricature - but of course, it has nothing to do with Islam.

Even when it’s a lie? I’ve asked FD about this. He refuses to say.

You? Oh yes, you won’t say either.

Mind you, you’ve never been a very big fan of human rights, old boy. The Enlightenment? So passe. Tyranny is the new freedom, eh? Lies are the new truth. Do you know what you are, dear boy?

You’re a postmodernist. University of Balogney, innit.

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Karnal

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Re: did Muhammed err?
Reply #223 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 7:54pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 7:04pm:

Soren wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 6:45pm:

Islam's role MUST not be recognised, named, discussed under any cicumstances because that is smear, racist, Islamophobic smear. Not all 1.6 billion Muslims chop heads 24/7 -therefore no Islam to see her.

Soren would you at least be honest enough to admit that you take the attitude that Islam's role MUST not be recognised, named, discussed under any circumstances - when we are talking about the good deeds and good will shown by muslims - even if they cite Islam as their motivation for their good deeds?

Can you explain to me how this is not a double standard?

But, G. You do know Islam has nuffin’ to do wiv nuffin’, don’t you?

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Soren

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Re: did Muhammed err?
Reply #224 - Jul 20^th, 2015 at 7:54pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 7:04pm:

Soren wrote on Jul 20^th, 2015 at 6:45pm:

Islam's role MUST not be recognised, named, discussed under any cicumstances because that is smear, racist, Islamophobic smear. Not all 1.6 billion Muslims chop heads 24/7 -therefore no Islam to see her.

Soren would you at least be honest enough to admit that you take the attitude that Islam's role MUST not be recognised, named, discussed under any circumstances - when we are talking about the good deeds and good will shown by muslims - even if they cite Islam as their motivation for their good deeds?

Can you explain to me how this is not a double standard?

What is new in Islam as far as 'good deeds' are concerned, Gandy??

Nothing.

NOT

being a murderous, intolerant bastard demanding submission on pain of death is not an Islamic invention.

Islam has brought nothing that is new AND good.

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