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The Idiot premier of NSW (Read 6627 times)
Dnarever
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #15 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 2:21pm  
Armchair_Politician wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 1:16pm:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:05am:
cods wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 8:54am:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 7:51pm:
The Idiot premier of NSW:  has told the NRL to take the law into their own hands.

Quote:
NSW Premier Mike Baird said the NRL needed to take a stronger stance against Kenny-Dowall and said he would be talking to the organisation.

"The sooner we tell everyone in NSW and across the country that violence against women is not acceptable — there's no blurring of the lines here," he said.

"It is outrageous. Yes, we have to ensure that this has in fact taken place and everyone is entitled to due process, but I think we need to see some stronger messages coming from the NRL."


What is it with conservatives and having the hanging before the trial ?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-19/roosters-stand-shaun-kenny-dowall-down/663...



she took an AVO out what does that suggest????????????????????????????????????????????..

maybe to simpletons nothing... Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

oh thats right they need to be in hospital or dead..

and in the mean time the perp goes on playing footy and being paid zillions..

its only another silly female after all.... and dont most of them deserve what they get????????? Angry


So you think that anyone accused of anything should just lose their job.

This is not about the charges which should be dealt with appropriately by the courts and police.

This is about the NRL at the Premiers insistence choosing to pre-empt that process and producing penalties outside the legal system. Have a think about what could happen if the NRL penalise him for a criminal offence and then the courts find him innocent ?

Is the premier going to offer to pay the compensation bill ?


I know personally of a teacher accused of inappropriately intimate dealings with a number of their students who was stood down from their teaching job and immediately ordered to go home from school when the allegations were brought to the attention of the school principal. That teacher wasn't even allowed to clean out their desk - the deputy principal did that under the supervision of the Police schools liaison officer and took the personal effects to the teachers' house. They're suspended on full pay pending the outcome of the court case. In some cases, it just isn't possible to allow someone to continue their job in the face of serious accusations whether or not they're innocent. The rights of others have to take precedence.


Yes but obviously very different and done for very valid reasons relating to genuine risk.
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Grappler Deep State Feller
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #16 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 4:46pm  
cods wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:03am:
Armchair_Politician wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 8:35am:
Jumping the gun a bit there, Mike. He may very well be guilty, but he hasn't been found guilty yet.



I guess AVOs are dished out for nothing these days...its strange really if you report a cop for say.. being rude or disrespectful he can be stood down there and then pending...and in some cases without pay.......

yet our FOOTY STARS are treated with silk gloves in some cases....

havent you notice the NRL is pretty soft on these guys... in fact most clubs go to any length to keep it from getting out.......so much is covered up...if they are tossed by a club they are picked up by another.. no worries...their lives go on.. regardless.....

sorry for you guys but DV is a huge problem with our so called STARS.. this hasnt just started as a one off.. like the Brett Stewart case...



How does an accusation like this impact on his work, other than public image for the game, that will actually be tarnished as a Star Chamber if there is nothing to this accusation.

It is high time this kind of thing was put into proper perspective and action based on a claim for a civil 'order' without any proof of violence stopped in entirety.

I dread to think how many men have been victimised in this way, by being assaulted by police, violated by courts, and punished in their work - and all over an application in a civil matter that requires no violence or offence to have been done.

You all really need to think about how terribly dangerous it is to both blithely accept that the 'courts' here - notorious for their lack of upholding the Law - should be handed the opportunity to inflict sanction on a person not proven to have done any wrong, even by the current and historical standards of 'guilt by accusation' - AND for you to actually support, promote and uphold these very things = give aid and comfort to unfounded accusation on whim and conviction by accusation.

Put simply - the court has NO right whatsoever to impose a sanction on any person not found to have committed a genuine offence - and creating a situation wherein a person accused without reason can then be place in the danger of being again accused and then created into a 'criminal' when no genuine offence has taken place, is itself a breach of Law and a crime against the citizenry, a violation of fundamental Right, and a Crime Agaisnt Humanity when directed at a specified group within a society.

Show Me The Proof Positive Of Violence Before You Take ANY Action Whatsoever - otherwise you yourself are in breach of the Law that requires proof before sanction and proof beyond any reasonable doubt, and not just some pie-in-the-sky Sentio Ergo Est!

Never forget - a Jew was considered a criminal in Nazi Germany by virtue of being a Jew - and any action taken against a 'certified criminal' by a German was perfectly in order.

Anyone else see the parallel - or do you prefer to continue to stay asleep while the foundations of civilisation are stolen from under your feet?
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« Last Edit: Jul 20th, 2015 at 4:54pm by Grappler Deep State Feller »  
“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Grappler Deep State Feller
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #17 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 4:52pm  
Swagman wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 8:26am:
hmm I don't think Baird or the NRL should be making assumptions before the evidence is put before the courts.

They should have learned from Brett Stewart.


It's not as if his accuser will be playing on an opposing team and might cop a coat hanger or something....

Yes - your position is sound in Law - and should be the yardstick by which all such things are handled.
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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longweekend58
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #18 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 5:44pm  
Dnarever wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 7:51pm:
The Idiot premier of NSW:  has told the NRL to take the law into their own hands.

Quote:
NSW Premier Mike Baird said the NRL needed to take a stronger stance against Kenny-Dowall and said he would be talking to the organisation.

"The sooner we tell everyone in NSW and across the country that violence against women is not acceptable — there's no blurring of the lines here," he said.

"It is outrageous. Yes, we have to ensure that this has in fact taken place and everyone is entitled to due process, but I think we need to see some stronger messages coming from the NRL."


What is it with conservatives and having the hanging before the trial ?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-19/roosters-stand-shaun-kenny-dowall-down/663...



clearly you missed the bit about due process in his comments.  nice of you to ignore the truth all for a good headline.  and you dare to criticise the daily telegraph!
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #19 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 5:55pm  
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 5:44pm:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 7:51pm:
The Idiot premier of NSW:  has told the NRL to take the law into their own hands.

Quote:
NSW Premier Mike Baird said the NRL needed to take a stronger stance against Kenny-Dowall and said he would be talking to the organisation.

"The sooner we tell everyone in NSW and across the country that violence against women is not acceptable — there's no blurring of the lines here," he said.

"It is outrageous. Yes, we have to ensure that this has in fact taken place and everyone is entitled to due process, but I think we need to see some stronger messages coming from the NRL."


What is it with conservatives and having the hanging before the trial ?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-19/roosters-stand-shaun-kenny-dowall-down/663...



clearly you missed the bit about due process in his comments.  nice of you to ignore the truth all for a good headline.  and you dare to criticise the daily telegraph!


.....and you missed the
BUT
which immediately followed.
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longweekend58
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #20 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:05pm  
Aussie wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 5:55pm:
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 5:44pm:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 7:51pm:
The Idiot premier of NSW:  has told the NRL to take the law into their own hands.

Quote:
NSW Premier Mike Baird said the NRL needed to take a stronger stance against Kenny-Dowall and said he would be talking to the organisation.

"The sooner we tell everyone in NSW and across the country that violence against women is not acceptable — there's no blurring of the lines here," he said.

"It is outrageous. Yes, we have to ensure that this has in fact taken place and everyone is entitled to due process, but I think we need to see some stronger messages coming from the NRL."


What is it with conservatives and having the hanging before the trial ?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-19/roosters-stand-shaun-kenny-dowall-down/663...



clearly you missed the bit about due process in his comments.  nice of you to ignore the truth all for a good headline.  and you dare to criticise the daily telegraph!


.....and you missed the
BUT
which immediately followed.


and you missed what came after that 'BUT'.  a MESSAGE, not an arrest.

lawyer, my arse. you dont even understand the basic concepts of english nevermind law.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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Grappler Deep State Feller
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #21 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:10pm  
... here we go again....   Roll Eyes  ... I try to inject some lengthy dissertation on the ins and outs of the issues here and their dire impact on Rights and Law and the Rule thereof .. and try to offer a perspective in alignment with Law and not law as prescribed by self-interested politicians who feel that the Law is just theirs for the manipulating ....  and we get back to the same old bitch session while Roma burns under our feet.......   Embarrassed   Roll Eyes
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #22 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:23pm  
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:05pm:
Aussie wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 5:55pm:
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 5:44pm:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 7:51pm:
The Idiot premier of NSW:  has told the NRL to take the law into their own hands.

Quote:
NSW Premier Mike Baird said the NRL needed to take a stronger stance against Kenny-Dowall and said he would be talking to the organisation.

"The sooner we tell everyone in NSW and across the country that violence against women is not acceptable — there's no blurring of the lines here," he said.

"It is outrageous. Yes, we have to ensure that this has in fact taken place and everyone is entitled to due process, but I think we need to see some stronger messages coming from the NRL."


What is it with conservatives and having the hanging before the trial ?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-19/roosters-stand-shaun-kenny-dowall-down/663...



clearly you missed the bit about due process in his comments.  nice of you to ignore the truth all for a good headline.  and you dare to criticise the daily telegraph!


.....and you missed the
BUT
which immediately followed.


and you missed what came after that 'BUT'.  a MESSAGE, not an arrest.

lawyer, my arse. you dont even understand the basic concepts of english nevermind law.


You would not know Law if it bit you in the arse.   I'm over you and your insults.  I might even get to the 'reporting stage.'

What 'message' do you think Baird was referring to?
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longweekend58
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #23 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:40pm  
Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:10pm:
... here we go again....   Roll Eyes  ... I try to inject some lengthy dissertation on the ins and outs of the issues here and their dire impact on Rights and Law and the Rule thereof .. and try to offer a perspective in alignment with Law and not law as prescribed by self-interested politicians who feel that the Law is just theirs for the manipulating ....  and we get back to the same old bitch session while Roma burns under our feet.......   Embarrassed   Roll Eyes


It would probably help your cause if you could articulate it rationally and clearly. You venture out into your paranoid fantasies so foten, we cannot tell when you are lucid - as perhaps you cannot tell either.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #24 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:47pm  
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:40pm:
Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:10pm:
... here we go again....   Roll Eyes  ... I try to inject some lengthy dissertation on the ins and outs of the issues here and their dire impact on Rights and Law and the Rule thereof .. and try to offer a perspective in alignment with Law and not law as prescribed by self-interested politicians who feel that the Law is just theirs for the manipulating ....  and we get back to the same old bitch session while Roma burns under our feet.......   Embarrassed   Roll Eyes


It would probably help your cause if you could articulate it rationally and clearly. You venture out into your paranoid fantasies so foten, we cannot tell when you are lucid - as perhaps you cannot tell either.


Again with the personal insults.  (Tell you what melielongtime, I'd back Grappler to outwrite anyone here on something fictitious....which is what 'you' have produced......fiction, based on fiction.)

I've read Grappler since he began on this issue ages ago, and he not only has a sold grasp of the legal practicalities, he also has been able to logically address the dilemma presented by 'domestic violence.'  On the other hand, I've seen nothing from you (as is usual) so perhaps you ought just say nothing and avoid further embarrassment.
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #25 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:55pm  
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 5:44pm:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 7:51pm:
The Idiot premier of NSW:  has told the NRL to take the law into their own hands.

Quote:
NSW Premier Mike Baird said the NRL needed to take a stronger stance against Kenny-Dowall and said he would be talking to the organisation.

"The sooner we tell everyone in NSW and across the country that violence against women is not acceptable — there's no blurring of the lines here," he said.

"It is outrageous. Yes, we have to ensure that this has in fact taken place and everyone is entitled to due process, but I think we need to see some stronger messages coming from the NRL."


What is it with conservatives and having the hanging before the trial ?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-19/roosters-stand-shaun-kenny-dowall-down/663...



clearly you missed the bit about due process in his comments.  nice of you to ignore the truth all for a good headline.  and you dare to criticise the daily telegraph!


No I didn't miss it at all. It is really bizarre that he goes in boots and all determined to undermine due process and to think that by making a weasel statement to attempt cover himself makes a difference.

Either he wants to instruct the NRL to take action prior to and outside of the legal process or he doesn't, he can't take both positions.
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cods
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #26 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 7:07pm  
Dnarever wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:05am:
cods wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 8:54am:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 7:51pm:
The Idiot premier of NSW:  has told the NRL to take the law into their own hands.

Quote:
NSW Premier Mike Baird said the NRL needed to take a stronger stance against Kenny-Dowall and said he would be talking to the organisation.

"The sooner we tell everyone in NSW and across the country that violence against women is not acceptable — there's no blurring of the lines here," he said.

"It is outrageous. Yes, we have to ensure that this has in fact taken place and everyone is entitled to due process, but I think we need to see some stronger messages coming from the NRL."


What is it with conservatives and having the hanging before the trial ?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-19/roosters-stand-shaun-kenny-dowall-down/663...



she took an AVO out what does that suggest????????????????????????????????????????????..

maybe to simpletons nothing... Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

oh thats right they need to be in hospital or dead..

and in the mean time the perp goes on playing footy and being paid zillions..

its only another silly female after all.... and dont most of them deserve what they get????????? Angry


So you think that anyone accused of anything should just lose their job.

This is not about the charges which should be dealt with appropriately by the courts and police.

This is about the NRL at the Premiers insistence choosing to pre-empt that process and producing penalties outside the legal system. Have a think about what could happen if the NRL penalise him for a criminal offence and then the courts find him innocent ?

Is the premier going to offer to pay the compensation bill ?



the Premier as is the PM has a right to his opinion   dont like the answer dont ask the question....

its funny I dont recall you breaking your heart over Gillards comments on Julian Assange..

Quote:
At one stage Ms Gillard labelled the actions of WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange "illegal". It was later downgraded to "grossly irresponsible".



of course all different I realise that.. Cool


the NRL as we all know has turned a blind eye and shut down any talk on what some of our STARS do...Mad Mondays are not for the faint hearted ..

its a given.. as I have said they get sacked from one club and other clubs line up to sign them up.....

your concern about them losing their job is so so...

what a shame they dont think like that???.. oh I might lose my job if I pizz in someones drink.... Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

the  fact is they dont HAVE to worry about their job.. most can do anything.. I am trying to think of any football player that has lost his livelihood over anything....and there has been some appalling behaviour over the years and its getting worse... now it even goes on overseas...

you do seem more concerned about the Premier than what this nice young man may have or may not have done.......an AVO usually is given out for a reason...


he is only facing 10 charges...n o news here..





Quote:
Quote:
Shaun Kenny-Dowall is expected to plead not guilty to domestic violence charges and could make his return to the NRL as early as this week as coach Trent Robinson defended his club's reputation with two stars to face court this week.

The Roosters brushed aside off-field woes as they wrapped up a clinical 24-0 win against the Warriors to further boast their premiership credentials. Kenny-Dowall was a late withdrawal after being stood down a day after charges were laid against him for allegedly assaulting his former partner.

     
He will face court on Thursday while teammate Michael Jennings will be in court on Monday after he was charged with offensive behaviour last month.

Roosters chief executive Brian Canavan said he expected Kenny-Dowall to plead not guilty to the 10 charges.

"He is struggling. it is a very serious matter," Canavan said. "He didn't play today mainly because of a welfare issue and also a team preparation issue. He wasn't in a position to train with the team yesterday. His own personal preparation, the team preparation and his own welfare, the decision was made this morning for him not to play.

"I have known him since he was 15 years of age. He deserves his opportunity to be explained and present his side of the story. That's all we're saying. We definitely don't condone anything to do with domestic violence.

"We understand he will plead not guilty. The NRL have been supportive of that and we as a club will support that process."

Robinson said Kenny-Dowall was "doing it tough".

"Not playing him today was a welfare decision from the club and the NRL," Robinson said.

"It's a difficult time. He is trying to come to terms with it and getting support through family and friends. We don't condone domestic violence. People have to understand that. We want to eradicate that out of our society. There is always due process. There are two sides to every




the roosters.. wow they sure can afford some big gun lawyers...to get their men out of trouble...

its all about the lawyer you know???...
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cods
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #27 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 7:09pm  
Aussie wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:47pm:
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:40pm:
Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:10pm:
... here we go again....   Roll Eyes  ... I try to inject some lengthy dissertation on the ins and outs of the issues here and their dire impact on Rights and Law and the Rule thereof .. and try to offer a perspective in alignment with Law and not law as prescribed by self-interested politicians who feel that the Law is just theirs for the manipulating ....  and we get back to the same old bitch session while Roma burns under our feet.......   Embarrassed   Roll Eyes


It would probably help your cause if you could articulate it rationally and clearly. You venture out into your paranoid fantasies so foten, we cannot tell when you are lucid - as perhaps you cannot tell either.


Again with the personal insults.  (Tell you what melielongtime, I'd back Grappler to outwrite anyone here on something fictitious....which is what 'you' have produced......fiction, based on fiction.)

I've read Grappler since he began on this issue ages ago, and he not only has a sold grasp of the legal practicalities, he also has been able to logically address the dilemma presented by 'domestic violence.'  On the other hand, I've seen nothing from you (as is usual) so perhaps you ought just say nothing and avoid further embarrassment.

Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin
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longweekend58
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #28 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 8:29pm  
Aussie wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:47pm:
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:40pm:
Grappler Deep State Feller wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 6:10pm:
... here we go again....   Roll Eyes  ... I try to inject some lengthy dissertation on the ins and outs of the issues here and their dire impact on Rights and Law and the Rule thereof .. and try to offer a perspective in alignment with Law and not law as prescribed by self-interested politicians who feel that the Law is just theirs for the manipulating ....  and we get back to the same old bitch session while Roma burns under our feet.......   Embarrassed   Roll Eyes


It would probably help your cause if you could articulate it rationally and clearly. You venture out into your paranoid fantasies so foten, we cannot tell when you are lucid - as perhaps you cannot tell either.


Again with the personal insults.  (Tell you what melielongtime, I'd back Grappler to outwrite anyone here on something fictitious....which is what 'you' have produced......fiction, based on fiction.)

I've read Grappler since he began on this issue ages ago, and he not only has a sold grasp of the legal practicalities, he also has been able to logically address the dilemma presented by 'domestic violence.'  On the other hand, I've seen nothing from you (as is usual) so perhaps you ought just say nothing and avoid further embarrassment.


you are asking me to take seriously the opinion of a wannabe lawyer as yourself on a poster who goes in and out of fantasy and delusion on a regular basis and where the line between serious posting and make-believe is difficult to determine?  his understanding of domestic violence is not good at all as he fixates on violence agains men instead of he problem in general.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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Re: The Idiot premier of NSW
Reply #29 - Jul 20th, 2015 at 8:33pm  
Armchair_Politician wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 1:16pm:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 9:05am:
cods wrote on Jul 20th, 2015 at 8:54am:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 19th, 2015 at 7:51pm:
The Idiot premier of NSW:  has told the NRL to take the law into their own hands.

Quote:
NSW Premier Mike Baird said the NRL needed to take a stronger stance against Kenny-Dowall and said he would be talking to the organisation.

"The sooner we tell everyone in NSW and across the country that violence against women is not acceptable — there's no blurring of the lines here," he said.

"It is outrageous. Yes, we have to ensure that this has in fact taken place and everyone is entitled to due process, but I think we need to see some stronger messages coming from the NRL."


What is it with conservatives and having the hanging before the trial ?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-19/roosters-stand-shaun-kenny-dowall-down/663...



she took an AVO out what does that suggest????????????????????????????????????????????..

maybe to simpletons nothing... Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

oh thats right they need to be in hospital or dead..

and in the mean time the perp goes on playing footy and being paid zillions..

its only another silly female after all.... and dont most of them deserve what they get????????? Angry


So you think that anyone accused of anything should just lose their job.

This is not about the charges which should be dealt with appropriately by the courts and police.

This is about the NRL at the Premiers insistence choosing to pre-empt that process and producing penalties outside the legal system. Have a think about what could happen if the NRL penalise him for a criminal offence and then the courts find him innocent ?

Is the premier going to offer to pay the compensation bill ?


I know personally of a teacher accused of inappropriately intimate dealings with a number of their students who was stood down from their teaching job and immediately ordered to go home from school when the allegations were brought to the attention of the school principal. That teacher wasn't even allowed to clean out their desk - the deputy principal did that under the supervision of the Police schools liaison officer and took the personal effects to the teachers' house. They're suspended on full pay pending the outcome of the court case. In some cases, it just isn't possible to allow someone to continue their job in the face of serious accusations whether or not they're innocent. The rights of others have to take precedence.


why? why should ANYONE'S rights supersede those of another?  I am always uncomfortable with stories like this with a teacher suspended on a childs word. There should always be at least some prima facie evidence that supports the claim.  Sometimes teachers have been sacked over claimed events that were not even possible (eg teacher in another state etc).
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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