Australian Politics Forum - Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys

moses

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #60 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 1:10pm

Karnal wrote:

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Thanks, Moses. It would appear that you disagree with my quotes on charity. You argue here that charity is conditional, a harsh word is preferable, and charity is not for God’s sake, but a form of divination between the righteous and the deceitful.

No worries.

I’ve been assisted by Muslims who were much poorer than me. I was put up in a house once by strangers in India when I missed my train. They were Kashmiris, their son found me at the station. I could easily have got a hotel room - I wanted to. But they offered me a meal and a bed and wanted nothing for it. Someone, of course, was required to sleep on the floor.

Who cheated who? I must make 30 times that family’s income. But charity, remember, is for God. When a stranger comes to your house, treat them as God. That family didn’t mark me as a rich foreigner out to rip them off. They saw me as someone to give freely to, in their own way.

And this, if you’re reading, old boy, is the difference between giving at the office and giving charity to God. It’s a value few of us have in our culture, but it’s the social glue in many places I’ve been.

Your example is not what I envisage as charity.

I don't believe that when I help an elderly woman with a trolley full of shopping through a door is charity, help a broken down motorist change a flat tyre is charity, turn my car around and tow a broken down motorist 50 or so klms to the nearest service station is charity, go out of my way to take someone to their destination, because they are unable to get there is charity, help someone with the building of a shed in their backyard is charity, mow my neighbours lawn as he is disposed is charity etc.etc.etc.

These are mundane doing the right thing by your fellow man deeds, as he / she is under a temporary inconvenience. I am simply doing the best I can to be a good bloke.

I refer to charity as helping someone in dire need e.g. they lose all their possessions in a disaster, a family member suffers a permanent debilitating medical condition, a death in the family, people who through no fault of their own find themselves in an absolutely devastating financial or physical position etc. etc. etc. I'm sure you get my drift.

The help provided to them is my definition of charity.

Yes when it comes to charity as I describe it, there are people who go out of their way to defraud the charity and steal from the genuine cases.

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Karnal

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #61 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 1:45pm

Good to see you think about charity, Moses. If you read the Muslim.quotes and gave them some thought, you’d see that these things are just what they were talking about, but with an exception - charity delivered with a harsh word is not charity.

I work part-time for a Christian charity. It’s not the charity’s fault, but many of the people who work there want to lord it over the people they are there to serve. I have heard no end of insults and abuse of people who made meek enquiries about help. I hear this from co-workers on a nightly basis when I work. The hostility towards the poor is deeply engrained, and these are the people we train and pay to work with the poor.

This is the charity the old boy provides when he gets out his cheque book at tax time.

If you read the ancient texts, and I include the Bible, the Koran and the Bhagavad Gita alike, all say that this sort of charity cancels out the goodness intended in the act of giving. Charity should be given freely - without condition or expectation - or it is not charity. If you give with harsh words, it is as if you gave a slap or blow, and God does not receieve it.

This is the lesson those Kashmiris taught me in practice, and yes, I think my own culture has a lot to learn.

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Soren

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #62 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 1:55pm

Karnal wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 11:54am:

And this, if you’re reading, old boy, is the difference between giving at the office and giving charity to God. It’s a value few of us have in our culture, but it’s the social glue in many places I’ve been.

Christian charity predates Muslim charity by centuries and is far more extensive.
Islam bring no improvement of any kind to the West. It is an agent of re-primitivisation and darkening and narrowing of intellectual, social, political, personal horizons everywhere.

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moses

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #63 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 1:59pm

Karnal wrote: Quote:

Good to see you think about charity, Moses. If you read the Muslim.quotes and gave them some thought, you’d see that these things are just what they were talking about, but with an exception - charity delivered with a harsh word is not charity.

I work part-time for a Christian charity. It’s not the charity’s fault, but many of the people who work there want to lord it over the people they are there to serve. I have heard no end of insults and abuse of people who made meek enquiries about help. I hear this from co-workers on a nightly basis when I work. The hostility towards the poor is deeply engrained, and these are the people we train and pay to work with the poor.

This is the charity the old boy provides when he gets out his cheque book at tax time.

If you read the ancient texts, and I include the Bible, the Koran and the Bhagavad Gita alike, all say that this sort of charity cancels out the goodness intended in the act of giving. Charity should be given freely - without condition or expectation - or it is not charity. If you give with harsh words, it is as if you gave a slap or blow, and God does not receieve it.

This is the lesson those Kashmiris taught me in practice, and yes, I think my own culture has a lot to learn.

I'm fairly sure we all know what charity is, I also reckon that we all know there are some hypocritical people out there.

I question the muslims commitment to charity based on the very deeds of muslims themselves.

I'm sick and tired of the lies and excuses, it's got nothing to do with islam, it's every body elses fault etc. etc..

When are muslims going to take responsibility for themselves and admit they are total failures?

When are apologists going to stop trying to fraudently tell us islam is no worse than any other belief?

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Karnal

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #64 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:15pm

moses wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 1:59pm:

Karnal wrote: Quote:

Good to see you think about charity, Moses. If you read the Muslim.quotes and gave them some thought, you’d see that these things are just what they were talking about, but with an exception - charity delivered with a harsh word is not charity.

I work part-time for a Christian charity. It’s not the charity’s fault, but many of the people who work there want to lord it over the people they are there to serve. I have heard no end of insults and abuse of people who made meek enquiries about help. I hear this from co-workers on a nightly basis when I work. The hostility towards the poor is deeply engrained, and these are the people we train and pay to work with the poor.

This is the charity the old boy provides when he gets out his cheque book at tax time.

If you read the ancient texts, and I include the Bible, the Koran and the Bhagavad Gita alike, all say that this sort of charity cancels out the goodness intended in the act of giving. Charity should be given freely - without condition or expectation - or it is not charity. If you give with harsh words, it is as if you gave a slap or blow, and God does not receieve it.

This is the lesson those Kashmiris taught me in practice, and yes, I think my own culture has a lot to learn.

I'm fairly sure we all know what charity is, I also reckon that we all know there are some hypocritical people out there.

I question the muslims commitment to charity based on the very deeds of muslims themselves.

I'm sick and tired of the lies and excuses, it's got nothing to do with islam, it's every body elses fault etc. etc..

When are muslims going to take responsibility for themselves and admit they are total failures?

When are apologists going to stop trying to fraudently tell us islam is no worse than any other belief?

No worries, Moses. You’re saying I should ignore my own experience with Muslim charity and stop defrauding you, presumably by agreeing with you about Muslims.

Allow me to give this a go. Can you tell me what experiences you’ve had with Muslim charity so I’ve got something to go on?

Please give me something to work with here, so I can ignore every experience I’ve ever had with Muslim strangers, Muslim neighbours, Muslim fellow students and co-workers.

What’s your experience?

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Karnal

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #65 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:16pm

Soren wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 1:55pm:

Karnal wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 11:54am:

And this, if you’re reading, old boy, is the difference between giving at the office and giving charity to God. It’s a value few of us have in our culture, but it’s the social glue in many places I’ve been.

Christian charity predates Muslim charity by centuries and is far more extensive.
Islam bring no improvement of any kind to the West. It is an agent of re-primitivisation and darkening and narrowing of intellectual, social, political, personal horizons everywhere.

I know, old boy. You said all that before.

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Soren

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #66 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:20pm

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 9^th, 2015 at 12:37am:

Soren wrote on Oct 8^th, 2015 at 11:50pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 8^th, 2015 at 10:16pm:

Soren wrote on Oct 7^th, 2015 at 8:48pm:

I do not care what they do, what means they choose - as long as they stay where they are. If they are not interested in adopting Western means, values, institutions, fine. But then stay the hell out of the West.

Yet, the West values freedom and tolerates changes, Soren. Well, most of the West which is liberal and democratic, unlike your version which is narrow and authoritarian... Roll Eyes

Quote:

To repeat - Islamic ways of living and doing things bring zero improvement to the West.

Really? Yet I believe and so do most other people, otherwise, Soren. Did you being any improvement to Australia when you migrated? I doubt it. You brought your narrow-minded, closed minded ways which only reinforced those views downunder. Roll Eyes

Thank goodness you are of the past, Soren, thank goodness! Cool

Don't talk about me, Brain.

Why ever not, Soren? You are the best counter-argument I have to everything you claim! Roll Eyes

Because I am a single person, not an increasing wave of culturally alien immigrants who are changing the demography of Western countries and with the demographic change comes the gradual re-primitivisation and darkening of the cultural, social, political and personal lives of the West.

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Secret Wars

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #67 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:21pm

Karnal wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:16pm:

Soren wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 1:55pm:

Karnal wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 11:54am:

And this, if you’re reading, old boy, is the difference between giving at the office and giving charity to God. It’s a value few of us have in our culture, but it’s the social glue in many places I’ve been.

Christian charity predates Muslim charity by centuries and is far more extensive.
Islam bring no improvement of any kind to the West. It is an agent of re-primitivisation and darkening and narrowing of intellectual, social, political, personal horizons everywhere.

I know, old boy. You said all that before.

Dear oh dear, you commenting on repetition? Dear oh bloody dear.

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Karnal

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #68 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:56pm

Soren wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:20pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 9^th, 2015 at 12:37am:

Soren wrote on Oct 8^th, 2015 at 11:50pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 8^th, 2015 at 10:16pm:

Soren wrote on Oct 7^th, 2015 at 8:48pm:

I do not care what they do, what means they choose - as long as they stay where they are. If they are not interested in adopting Western means, values, institutions, fine. But then stay the hell out of the West.

Yet, the West values freedom and tolerates changes, Soren. Well, most of the West which is liberal and democratic, unlike your version which is narrow and authoritarian... Roll Eyes

Quote:

To repeat - Islamic ways of living and doing things bring zero improvement to the West.

Really? Yet I believe and so do most other people, otherwise, Soren. Did you being any improvement to Australia when you migrated? I doubt it. You brought your narrow-minded, closed minded ways which only reinforced those views downunder. Roll Eyes

Thank goodness you are of the past, Soren, thank goodness! Cool

Don't talk about me, Brain.

Why ever not, Soren? You are the best counter-argument I have to everything you claim! Roll Eyes

Because I am a single person, not an increasing wave of culturally alien immigrants who are changing the demography of Western countries and with the demographic change comes the gradual re-primitivisation and darkening of the cultural, social, political and personal lives of the West.

Ah yes, old boy, but you’ll always be culturally alien to us, no?

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Soren Gold Member Offline Posts: 25654 Gender:	Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys Reply #69 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 3:27pm Karnal wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:56pm: Ah yes, old boy, but you’ll always be culturally alien to us, no? And who would not want to be culturally alien to a Pakistani Bügger like you, PB??
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Brian Ross

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #70 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 4:49pm

Soren wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:20pm:

Because I am a single person, not an increasing wave of culturally alien immigrants who are changing the demography of Western countries and with the demographic change comes the gradual re-primitivisation and darkening of the cultural, social, political and personal lives of the West.

And how are they doing that? By being different and challenging Europeans to live the way they claim they should live? Roll Eyes

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Karnal

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #71 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 5:25pm

Soren wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 3:27pm:

Karnal wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:56pm:

Ah yes, old boy, but you’ll always be culturally alien to us, no?

And who would not want to be culturally alien to a Pakistani Bügger like you, PB??

http://thepeoplescube.com/images/mohammed/Visualize_Peace.jpg

50,000 years, old boy. We invented a stick. What did you Huns bring?

A stollen.

Be it a stick or a stollen, you’ll always be welcome here.. After all, we’ll always need stool.

Remember, you’re free to smear it into the rich tapestry of our great little social experiment. Bombs away, old boy.

If you make a mess, you can always go home, no?

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« Last Edit: Oct 11^th, 2015 at 5:32pm by Karnal »

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Soren

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #72 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 6:06pm

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 4:49pm:

Soren wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:20pm:

Because I am a single person, not an increasing wave of culturally alien immigrants who are changing the demography of Western countries and with the demographic change comes the gradual re-primitivisation and darkening of the cultural, social, political and personal lives of the West.

And how are they doing that? By being different and challenging Europeans to live the way they claim they should live? Roll Eyes

Why the bloody hell are they leaving their Muslim lands, where they can live as fully formed Muslims, only to go to Kaffirland to hassle the Kaffirinto being like the countries the Muslims have just left??

You are completely unmoored, Brain: Muslims leave Muslim lands because they are shite'oles but badger Europeans to turn their own countries into the sh!t'oles the Muslims have just left.

Love and tolerance and idiotic BS.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #73 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 6:42pm

Soren wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 6:06pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 4:49pm:

Soren wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:20pm:

Because I am a single person, not an increasing wave of culturally alien immigrants who are changing the demography of Western countries and with the demographic change comes the gradual re-primitivisation and darkening of the cultural, social, political and personal lives of the West.

And how are they doing that? By being different and challenging Europeans to live the way they claim they should live? Roll Eyes

Why the bloody hell are they leaving their Muslim lands, where they can live as fully formed Muslims, only to go to Kaffirland to hassle the Kaffirinto being like the countries the Muslims have just left??

Only a tiny minority think like that, Soren, just as only a tiny minority think you do. Get used to it.

Perhaps the reason why they left Syria was 'cause people were trying to kill them? Nah! That's not a valid reason in your book, now is it? Roll Eyes

Quote:

You are completely unmoored, Brain: Muslims leave Muslim lands because they are shite'oles but badger Europeans to turn their own countries into the sh!t'oles the Muslims have just left.

Love and tolerance and idiotic BS.

Yes, it is, in your narrow, twisted little mind, Soren. In the minds of most other people it is call liberty and freedom and above all else, safety from loons, who unfortunately think just like you. Perhaps you should go to Syria and tell the followers of al Bagdadi where they are going wrong? Be a real education for you and them, I think, Soren! Roll Eyes

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Karnal

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Re: Putin For The Win Re:Middle Easturd Musseys
Reply #74 - Oct 11^th, 2015 at 7:05pm

Soren wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 6:06pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 4:49pm:

Soren wrote on Oct 11^th, 2015 at 2:20pm:

Because I am a single person, not an increasing wave of culturally alien immigrants who are changing the demography of Western countries and with the demographic change comes the gradual re-primitivisation and darkening of the cultural, social, political and personal lives of the West.

And how are they doing that? By being different and challenging Europeans to live the way they claim they should live? Roll Eyes

Why the bloody hell are they leaving their Muslim lands, where they can live as fully formed Muslims, only to go to Kaffirland to hassle the Kaffirinto being like the countries the Muslims have just left??

You are completely unmoored, Brain: Muslims leave Muslim lands because they are shite'oles but badger Europeans to turn their own countries into the sh!t'oles the Muslims have just left.

Love and tolerance and idiotic BS.

Why did you leave your jolly liebensraum, old chap? You’ve never said.

If you don’t mind my saying, people are talking. Why don’t you put all this scandallous chatter to rest?

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