Australian Politics Forum - Baden Clay wins appeal.

Aussie

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Re: Baden Clay wins appeal.
Reply #270 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 6:46pm

Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 6:33pm:

red baron wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 6:25pm:

The scenario I'm running, is to clear the mud from the water that Lawyerspeak has put there.

And demonstrate that it is as clear as the hand on the end of your arm that Baden Clay had great motivation and opportunity to Murder his wife..,.,which he clearly did.

I reckon Qld ought get you to run the High Court appeal. It'll be over in a flash. Makes it much cheaper for us.

Insurance or otherwise.......no evidence of cause of death........she probably (angry about being so poor she had to downgrade her insurance which probably included a superannuation component) in an argument over money, clawed him....he reacted......no intent......she died somehow.....he panics.......dumps her.............lies like a pig in poo as most pigs in poo are likely to do......manslaughter.

Read the Court of Appeal decision. Given the state of the evidence, there was more than one likely explanation of what occurred. One was 'murder.' Others equally available on the evidence...........include manslaughter. If you really wanted to push the evidentiary envelope (as Baden Clay himself did).....he had nothing to do with her death. She wandered off after a domestic in which she clawed him.........fell down an embankment (use you own imagination) and died. (I hasten to add that he did not say that..............but......it is open on the evidence if you ignore his story....which could well be the pig lying in schitt.)

Evidence. Beyond reasonable doubt.

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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 139959 Gender:	Re: Baden Clay wins appeal. Reply #271 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 6:49pm red baron wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 6:30pm: Hi Gregg, would much prefer that you stuck to the facts old stick. ... Just been going back through your posts and they read like Days of our lives. Please elaborate.
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cods

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Re: Baden Clay wins appeal.
Reply #272 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 7:28pm

red baron wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 6:08pm:

Do you believe in Coincidence?..If you break that word up...it reads...Co - incide.

Like this piece from the summary of the Appeal:

Leaves from different species of plants were found about Mrs BadenClay’s body. A botanist gave evidence that they included four species – crepe myrtle, cat’s claw creeper, fishbone fern and lilly pilly – which he was able to identify in the Baden-Clays ’ garden, but not in the immediate vicinity of the Kholo Creek site where the body was found. Some leaves of the cat’s claw creeper, the fern and the crepe myrtle were entwined in her hair. The crepe myrtle leaves were fallen leaves, the fern leaves were a mix of live and fallen leaves, and one of the cat’s claw creeper leaves appeared to have been pulled from a live plant. Cat’s claw creeper was growing about the carport of the Baden-Clay home, while leaf litter from the crepe myrtle and fern were found in the carport and the patio area of the house near its back door.

I men let's face it, it reads like it has been lifted from a CSI episode, only there's nothing cute about the outcome of this episode.

if you read the report from Dr Gordon Guymer the botanist who looked at every leaf and twig and where it came from..that was found in the car on the tyres and on the body....I think you will be surprised at how he deduced everything.... it appears to me to be very thorough ...

again the blood found in the car... the car was 2 months old.. and no one recalled Allison being injured whilst in the car.. especially the back where she never ever sat..

I hope you are reading the whole thing.. I would be interested to see if anyone elses reads things the same way..

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cods

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Re: Baden Clay wins appeal.
Reply #273 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 7:38pm

Quote:

I reckon Qld ought get you to run the High Court appeal. It'll be over in a flash. Makes it much cheaper for us.

oh I think we all know who would fast forward every trial.. Grin

Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 6:46pm:

Insurance or otherwise.......no evidence of cause of death........she probably (angry about being so poor she had to downgrade her insurance which probably included a superannuation component) in an argument over money, clawed him....he reacted......no intent......she died somehow.....he panics.......dumps her.............lies like a pig in poo as most pigs in poo are likely to do......manslaughter.

Read the Court of Appeal decision. Given the state of the evidence, there was more than one likely explanation of what occurred. One was 'murder.' Others equally available on the evidence...........include manslaughter. If you really wanted to push the evidentiary envelope (as Baden Clay himself did).....he had nothing to do with her death. She wandered off after a domestic in which she clawed him.........fell down an embankment (use you own imagination) and died. (I hasten to add that he did not say that..............but......it is open on the evidence if you ignore his story....which could well be the pig lying in schitt.)

Evidence. Beyond reasonable doubt

when you only have one persons VERSION of what really happened at the scene of the crime...

where does reasonable begin and end??

by the time the trial gets under way he/she has had plenty of time to come up with all sorts of versions of what went on....who landed the first blow...

stands to reason...

no one claims this guy meant to kill her .. but as has been proved he is a very selfish individual who was very used to getting his own way.. and used to people thinking he was a great business man.... as we know he was in fact a big failure.....

yes he could well have panicked...being that much in debt and such a HUGE EGO ....

I bet he was also very very ANGRY...he wanted his wife not to go to the conference.. and she said she was going... even got her hair done and everything...
spending money they didnt have...

he knew his world was burning and he was going to lose everything...

it wouldnt have taken much for him to explode....I dont think...and how dare she fight back.. what a hide.

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Alinta

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Re: Baden Clay wins appeal.
Reply #274 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 8:10pm

cods wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 7:38pm:

Quote:

I reckon Qld ought get you to run the High Court appeal. It'll be over in a flash. Makes it much cheaper for us.

oh I think we all know who would fast forward every trial.. Grin

Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 6:46pm:

Insurance or otherwise.......no evidence of cause of death........she probably (angry about being so poor she had to downgrade her insurance which probably included a superannuation component) in an argument over money, clawed him....he reacted......no intent......she died somehow.....he panics.......dumps her.............lies like a pig in poo as most pigs in poo are likely to do......manslaughter.

Read the Court of Appeal decision. Given the state of the evidence, there was more than one likely explanation of what occurred. One was 'murder.' Others equally available on the evidence...........include manslaughter. If you really wanted to push the evidentiary envelope (as Baden Clay himself did).....he had nothing to do with her death. She wandered off after a domestic in which she clawed him.........fell down an embankment (use you own imagination) and died. (I hasten to add that he did not say that..............but......it is open on the evidence if you ignore his story....which could well be the pig lying in schitt.)

Evidence. Beyond reasonable doubt

when you only have one persons VERSION of what really happened at the scene of the crime...

where does reasonable begin and end??

by the time the trial gets under way he/she has had plenty of time to come up with all sorts of versions of what went on....who landed the first blow...

stands to reason...

no one claims this guy meant to kill her but as has been proved he is a very selfish individual who was very used to getting his own way.. and used to people thinking he was a great business man.... as we know he was in fact a big failure.....

yes he could well have panicked...being that much in debt and such a HUGE EGO ....

I bet he was also very very ANGRY...he wanted his wife not to go to the conference.. and she said she was going... even got her hair done and everything...
spending money they didnt have...

he knew his world was burning and he was going to lose everything...

it wouldnt have taken much for him to explode....I dont think...and how dare she fight back.. what a hide.

.......and this is why the court of Appeal downgraded murder to manslaughter Cods.

proof that he meant (in law, intent) to kill her =murder

proof that he killed her but didn't mean to kill her (in law, no intent) = manslaughter

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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 139959 Gender:	Re: Baden Clay wins appeal. Reply #275 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 8:12pm cods wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 7:38pm: I think Bullshit.
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Aussie

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Re: Baden Clay wins appeal.
Reply #276 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 8:20pm

Quote:

no one claims this guy meant to kill her ..

What do they claim, then? What do you claim given you finally admit there was no evidence he meant to kill her?

You said you would read every word of the decision of the Court of Appeal. Have you? If you have, why is it you have not been able to rip apart my various alternate explanations for what happened ~ so far as we know?

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Aussie

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Re: Baden Clay wins appeal.
Reply #277 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 8:27pm

This one:

Quote:

by the time the trial gets under way he/she has had plenty of time to come up with all sorts of versions of what went on....who landed the first blow...

.....also warrants comment. Baden-Clay's story has never wavered, never changed in one iota from the moment he was first fronted by the Cops............way before the Trial. He has been totally consistent in every respect the whole duration, not once refusing to answer any question (which would have been my advice to him when he was being questioned by the Cops) even under hostile cross examination under oath in Court at the hands of a very experienced Prosecutor.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Baden Clay wins appeal.
Reply #278 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 8:55pm

Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 8:27pm:

This one:

Quote:

by the time the trial gets under way he/she has had plenty of time to come up with all sorts of versions of what went on....who landed the first blow...

.....also warrants comment. Baden-Clay's story has never wavered, never changed in one iota from the moment he was first fronted by the Cops............way before the Trial. He has been totally consistent in every respect the whole duration, not once refusing to answer any question (which would have been my advice to him when he was being questioned by the Cops) even under hostile cross examination under oath in Court at the hands of a very experienced Prosecutor.

Did you get that from ACA?

CSI?

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Aussie

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Re: Baden Clay wins appeal.
Reply #279 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:00pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 8:55pm:

Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 8:27pm:

This one:

Quote:

by the time the trial gets under way he/she has had plenty of time to come up with all sorts of versions of what went on....who landed the first blow...

.....also warrants comment. Baden-Clay's story has never wavered, never changed in one iota from the moment he was first fronted by the Cops............way before the Trial. He has been totally consistent in every respect the whole duration, not once refusing to answer any question (which would have been my advice to him when he was being questioned by the Cops) even under hostile cross examination under oath in Court at the hands of a very experienced Prosecutor.

Did you get that from ACA?

CSI?

No......just the evidence presented at his Trial, and the transcripts I've been able to read.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Baden Clay wins appeal.
Reply #280 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:03pm

Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:00pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 8:55pm:

Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 8:27pm:

This one:

Quote:

by the time the trial gets under way he/she has had plenty of time to come up with all sorts of versions of what went on....who landed the first blow...

.....also warrants comment. Baden-Clay's story has never wavered, never changed in one iota from the moment he was first fronted by the Cops............way before the Trial. He has been totally consistent in every respect the whole duration, not once refusing to answer any question (which would have been my advice to him when he was being questioned by the Cops) even under hostile cross examination under oath in Court at the hands of a very experienced Prosecutor.

Did you get that from ACA?

CSI?

No......just the evidence presented at his Trial, and the transcripts I've been able to read.

"evidence"?

Hmmm, not good enough. Sorry.

Unless you have something from Tracy Grimshaw, there's no way we can take you seriously.

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Aussie Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 38869 Gender:	Re: Baden Clay wins appeal. Reply #281 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:05pm You've had a 'long lunch' haven't you.
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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 139959 Gender:	Re: Baden Clay wins appeal. Reply #282 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:07pm Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:05pm: You've had a 'long lunch' haven't you. If you don't have anything from ACA or 60 Minutes, you can't be taken seriously. Sorry.
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Aussie Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 38869 Gender:	Re: Baden Clay wins appeal. Reply #283 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:10pm greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:07pm: Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:05pm: You've had a 'long lunch' haven't you. If you don't have anything from ACA or 60 Minutes, you can't be taken seriously. Sorry. I'll take that as a 'yes.'
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greggerypeccary

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Re: Baden Clay wins appeal.
Reply #284 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:11pm

Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:10pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:07pm:

Aussie wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:05pm:

You've had a 'long lunch' haven't you.

If you don't have anything from ACA or 60 Minutes, you can't be taken seriously.

Sorry.

I'll take that as a 'yes.'

Your white flag has been accepted.

When you've listened to some talk-back radio, get back to me.

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