Australian Politics Forum - Top Companies That Pay No Tax

Bam

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #165 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:43am

Swagman wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:20am:

stunspore wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 10:39am:

Sad, Swag, just simply sad. If all you have are companies that provide jobs but no additional tax, might as well say the same for government jobs. Government provides jobs, workers pay tax, etc etc.

Companies might provide jobs - but it's the workers who pay the tax from that. Those wages are entitled to the worker. Companies are there to make a profit and that profit must be taxed - because in the end companies benefit from government services - from security, roads, telecommunications, lawful environment etc. They don't pay for those directly always.

The same could be said for the car industries that were closed down.

In either case since they don't pay tax, no point reducing company tax - zero is still zero.

A one year snap shot is bull schitt.

No, it's not. The numbers do not lie.

What's rubbish are some of the conclusions that are being drawn from one year's figures.

I have highlighted Qantas as an example; they claimed a large loss in that financial year. Qantas though are doing nothing incorrect. They used the rules to claim a large paper loss (they wrote down the value of their aircraft). They generally make a profit and pay taxes.

What the figures reveal though are a large number of large companies that paid no tax in that financial year: 579 out of 1539, or 37.6%, about three-eighths. Why so many?

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Bam Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21905 Gender:	Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax Reply #166 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:49am mariacostel wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:36am: NOBODY gets to pay for getting to work - not even companies. So cars and petrol don't cost anything? You have totally lost the plot.
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Kiron22

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #167 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:51am

Why bothering debating? Maria, Armchair and Aqua are professional sycophants. They love gulping down the **** of billionare corporations while hating everyone they deem below them.

Funny they claim they are nationalist, while they hate Australians, hate Australia's environment and hate Australia's social construct.

If these idiots had the power to sell Australia to Saudi Arabia for $50, they would.

pathetic petite bourgeoisie the lot of them.

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mariacostel

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #168 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:00pm

Bam wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:43am:

Swagman wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:20am:

stunspore wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 10:39am:

Sad, Swag, just simply sad. If all you have are companies that provide jobs but no additional tax, might as well say the same for government jobs. Government provides jobs, workers pay tax, etc etc.

Companies might provide jobs - but it's the workers who pay the tax from that. Those wages are entitled to the worker. Companies are there to make a profit and that profit must be taxed - because in the end companies benefit from government services - from security, roads, telecommunications, lawful environment etc. They don't pay for those directly always.

The same could be said for the car industries that were closed down.

In either case since they don't pay tax, no point reducing company tax - zero is still zero.

A one year snap shot is bull schitt.

No, it's not. The numbers do not lie.

What's rubbish are some of the conclusions that are being drawn from one year's figures.

I have highlighted Qantas as an example; they claimed a large loss in that financial year. Qantas though are doing nothing incorrect. They used the rules to claim a large paper loss (they wrote down the value of their aircraft). They generally make a profit and pay taxes.

What the figures reveal though are a large number of large companies that paid no tax in that financial year: 579 out of 1539, or 37.6%, about three-eighths. Why so many?

Loss making. Loss carry-overs. Distributions of all profits via distributions and salaries prior to tax assessment.

It's not that hard to work out.

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Bias_2012

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #169 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:00pm

Bam wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:43am:

What the figures reveal though are a large number of large companies that paid no tax in that financial year: 579 out of 1539, or 37.6%, about three-eighths. Why so many?

Seems we would all like to know the answer instead of guessing. Publication every year with a little more information attached to each company would reveal the truth of the matter i reckon. It would save us the tedious job of googling each company each year

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Our Lives Are Governed By The Feast & Famine Variable

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mariacostel

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #170 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:01pm

Bam wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:49am:

mariacostel wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:36am:

NOBODY gets to pay for getting to work - not even companies.

So cars and petrol don't cost anything? Roll Eyes

You have totally lost the plot.

Not the point. If NO ONE GETS IT, including companies, then it doesn't count and is irrelevant.

But you still seem clueless to the utter difference between employees and companies.

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mariacostel

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #171 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:02pm

Kiron22 wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:51am:

Why bothering debating? Maria, Armchair and Aqua are professional sycophants. They love gulping down the **** of billionare corporations while hating everyone they deem below them.

Funny they claim they are nationalist, while they hate Australians, hate Australia's environment and hate Australia's social construct.

If these idiots had the power to sell Australia to Saudi Arabia for $50, they would.

pathetic petite bourgeoisie the lot of them.

KGB lover. Democracy hater.

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #172 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:02pm

Microsoft went to Ireland instead of Australia for business.

Company tax rate-
Australia 30%
Ireland 12.5%
It sounds like Ireland have listened to nobel prize winning economist Milton Friedman which resulted in them attracting companies that socialists drive from Australia.

The socialist leftists in this forum are economic illiterates, companies are moving out of Australia because of our high company tax rates.
If we want to attract more business we have to lower our company tax rates to compete with Ireland and Singapore

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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mariacostel

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #173 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:03pm

Bias_2012 wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:00pm:

Bam wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:43am:

What the figures reveal though are a large number of large companies that paid no tax in that financial year: 579 out of 1539, or 37.6%, about three-eighths. Why so many?

Seems we would all like to know the answer instead of guessing. Publication every year with a little more information attached to each company would reveal the truth of the matter i reckon. It would save us the tedious job of googling each company each year

Google any you wish to find out more about. What you will find in every case is legitimacy.

Your understanding of tax matters is not required for it to be legal.

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Kiron22

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #174 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:06pm

mariacostel wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:02pm:

KGB lover. Democracy hater.

Keep em coming.

I don't despise my fellow man and spend all day on an internet forum telling anonymous people how awesome I am and abusing working class people. Grin

Go call up and cry to Alan Jones again about how the communists have taken over now that Turnbull is prime minister and Tony Abbott is a modern Jesus.

Oh wait, you would hate Jesus as well, because he was a Proto-Socialist.

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Bam

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #175 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:07pm

mariacostel wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:34am:

Bam wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 10:59am:

mariacostel wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 10:32am:

Bam wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 8:36am:

crocodile wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 7:52am:

Just a side note. Andrew, on his blog has been kind enough to post more of his thoughts on corporate taxation. He wholeheartedly agrees that the majority of the burden of corporate tax falls on labour rather than the owners of capital by a margin of 2/3 to 1/3. His only concern is capturing the foreign dividends. Easily fixed through legislation.

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/1467-8462.12127/full

Seriously, the corporate tax rate of 30% is hurting and we are slowly losing to more competitive jurisdictions.

I am not at all convinced by the argument that it's somehow hurting. It's time for some perspective.

For the 1539 large companies listed:

The total amount of revenue was $1,629,023,186,711.
The total taxable income was $169,906,851,714. (10.43% of revenue).
The total tax paid was $39,862,816,070 (23.46% of taxable income and 2.45% of revenue).

How many PAYE taxpayers are paying no more than 2.45% of their gross income in tax? Not many. Most pay more than that.

It's not just taxes though. Spending needs to be considered. Some of these large corporations receive some form of government assistance. The mining industry alone receives more than $2 billion a year in rebates for diesel fuel. After the various forms of corporate welfare are considered, the corporations are not actually contributing much tax revenue at all.

If we want to consider cutting the corporate tax rate, it must be funded by corresponding deep cuts to corporate welfare so the Budget is not left worse off. The PAYE taxpayer already carries the largest tax burden in Federal taxation. They shouldn't be expected to carry more of it so companies can pay less.

What a stupid comparison. What PAYE taxpayer has to contribute a single dollar towards earning their income? NONE.

What company contributes labour towards making profit? NONE. Not a single one.

You really should stop posting red herrings, they do not advance your cause.

Look idiot-features, EMPLOYEES are nothing like companies. they have no deductions because they contribute not one cent to the input costs of earning their wage. NOT ONE CENT. Companies have massive input costs to earning their profit/income which is - surprise surprise - why they have large deductions.

companies and employees are NOTHING alike.

So? Where did I say that?

And again ... you repeat ad nauseam this non sequitur: an irrelevant point that in no way addresses any of the points raised.

Oh, and a personal attack too. You're a goldmine for fallacy bingo.

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Kiron22

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #176 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:08pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:02pm:

Microsoft went to Ireland instead of Australia for business.

Company tax rate-
Australia 30%
Ireland 12.5%
It sounds like Ireland have listened to nobel prize winning economist Milton Friedman which resulted in them attracting companies that socialists drive from Australia.

The socialist leftists in this forum are economic illiterates, companies are moving out of Australia because of our high company tax rates.
If we want to attract more business we have to lower our company tax rates to compete with Ireland and Singapore

YES, LETS FOLLOW IRELAND, THEIR WONDERFUL ECONOMY IS THE ENVY OF THE WORLD Grin

WHAT NEXT HONDURAS? PINOCHET'S CHILE? Grin

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Swagman

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #177 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:22pm

Bam wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:43am:

Swagman wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:20am:

stunspore wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 10:39am:

Sad, Swag, just simply sad. If all you have are companies that provide jobs but no additional tax, might as well say the same for government jobs. Government provides jobs, workers pay tax, etc etc.

Companies might provide jobs - but it's the workers who pay the tax from that. Those wages are entitled to the worker. Companies are there to make a profit and that profit must be taxed - because in the end companies benefit from government services - from security, roads, telecommunications, lawful environment etc. They don't pay for those directly always.

The same could be said for the car industries that were closed down.

In either case since they don't pay tax, no point reducing company tax - zero is still zero.

A one year snap shot is bull schitt.

No, it's not. The numbers do not lie.

What's rubbish are some of the conclusions that are being drawn from one year's figures.

So it's not "bull schitt" just "rubbish" ? Cheesy

Bam wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:43am:

I have highlighted Qantas as an example; they claimed a large loss in that financial year. Qantas though are doing nothing incorrect. They used the rules to claim a large paper loss (they wrote down the value of their aircraft). They generally make a profit and pay taxes.

.....don't just single Qantas out. Companies have to make profits otherwise they go to the wall. Qantas rationalised (to much criticism by the resident economic illiterates) and turned its financial position around. If it continued to make massive losses it would've gone under.

Bam wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 11:43am:

What the figures reveal though are a large number of large companies that paid no tax in that financial year: 579 out of 1539, or 37.6%, about three-eighths. Why so many?

6 years of Labour government didn't help... Cheesy

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mariacostel Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 7344 Sydney Gender:	Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax Reply #178 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 12:26pm Love the experts frothing at the mouth by the sight of companies not making a profit. $170B paid in company taxes last year... but that's not enough, right? Some of you people are beyond retarded.
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crocodile

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Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #179 - Dec 19^th, 2015 at 2:10pm

Bias_2012 wrote on Dec 19^th, 2015 at 9:30am:

Re: Top Companies That Pay No Tax
Reply #119 - Yesterday at 10:09pm Quote
Bias_2012 wrote Yesterday at 9:20pm:
crocodile wrote Yesterday at 8:55pm:
And you've fogged your glasses. Where did I say it was a mine or even describe any of its operations.

You and maria then, your answers were way off but you're forgiven because Kelly O'Dywer wouldn't have a clue either

There is nothing wrong with any of my answers. Even if the said corporation was not for profit it does not stop previous losses being brought forward. O'Dwyer is also ugly. Nice jugs though. - crocodile

No, there are no losses, Queensland Alumina Ltd doesn't work like that, it's a Cost-Toll operation. Each partner pays just enough to keep the plant going, 80% for Rio Tinto Alcan and 20% for Rusal. Technically and in reality, QAL is not subject to taxation at all, quite simply it's not a profit and loss company, only the partners are taxed if they sell alumina for a profit in Oz, but nearly all of it is shipped overseas where funny figures and different ownership takes place making it impossible for the ATO to tax profits from the eventual sale of that alumina

This really just highlights the absurdity of the list. Who is going to delve into the operations of each and every corporation on the list just to find out whether or not it is a tolling company. The list purports to disclose tax paid in the financial year with absolutely no insights shown as to why. The inference to the casual reader by being called a name and shame list is that they are cheats. It is dishonest, dangerous and only good as a political football.

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Very funny Scotty, now beam down my clothes.

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