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freediver

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'balance'
Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:07pm

There are some very strange views regarding balance being promoted here. Despite having a dedicated board for the discussion of Islam, run by a Muslim, certain members have a problem with all the discussion here focusing on Islam.

For example here we have John Smith complaining that I have started 1000 threads on the mistreatment of women in Islam, and no threads at all on the mistreatement of women outside of Islam.

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1453237432/255#267

He claims that he is here more often than I am and has been keeping such careful track of what I do that he knows what topics I don't start threads on. He also claimed I was "spreading crap" about Islam, telling lies etc, but could not produce a single example. He suggested he would be happy if I started as many about voting rights in the vatican as I do about Islam.

He appears to have now conceded the point on thread count (or at least, changed the topic again) and moved on to making it about honesty, particularly when it comes to motivation. Despite this, he is unable to give a coherent explanation for his motivation in taking such an unusual stance on the issue, insisting repeatedly that he has already explained it (this might be a reference to him whining about thread count, accusations of lies etc, but he has not clarified).

Apparently motivated by the above thread, Bobby started this thread:

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1454193623

According to the thread title, it is about comparing Muslims to Christians. In an apparent attempt to correct this imbalance, Bobby tried to insist that criticism of Islam should be outside the scope of the thread.

Of course, there is also Brian, who has gone quiet lately. He often insisted that we do not even have the right (or the ability) to criticise other countries or religions.

We have also had Aussie lately insisting that "sovereign rights" of foreign countries takes precedent over individual rights. This precludes any kind of interference or "telling them how to live," even in such extreme cases as Nazis gassing Jews.

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1379233325/1320#1320

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Karnal Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 95921 Gender:	Re: 'balance' Reply #1 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:08pm How did we establish democracy in Iraq, FD?
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Aussie

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Re: 'balance'
Reply #2 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:28pm

Quote:

We have also had Aussie lately insisting that "sovereign rights" of foreign countries takes precedent over individual rights. This precludes any kind of interference or "telling them how to live," even in such extreme cases as Nazis gassing Jews.

Where did I say the words "telling them how to live?"

And:

How did we establish democracy in Iraq, FD?

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Bobby.

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Re: 'balance'
Reply #3 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:29pm

FD,
Quote:

According to the thread title, it is about comparing Muslims to Christians. In an apparent attempt to correct this imbalance, Bobby tried to insist that criticism of Islam should be outside the scope of the thread.

It's only one thread -
there are 100 others about Muslims directly.

In any case if someone can prove that Muslims are before the present Royal commission into child molesting
then they are free to bring that forth.

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Its time Gold Member Offline Boot libs out Posts: 25639 Gender:	Re: 'balance' Reply #4 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:29pm Karnal wrote on Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:08pm: How did we establish democracy in Iraq, FD? Touch'e
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Yadda

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Re: 'balance'
Reply #5 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:40pm

Karnal wrote on Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:08pm:

How did we establish democracy in Iraq, FD?

We [Western powers] didn't establish democracy in Iraq.

Because a system of governing a society of people, like democracy, would always, always, be rejected by a people like the Iraqis.       [....mosque attending moslems]

"How did we establish democracy in Iraq, FD?"

The US got lured into Iraq [to depose Sadam Hussein].

Pre the 2003 invasion by the US and its allies, Iraqi exiles in the US convinced the Bush administration that the Iraqi people would welcome the US as their liberators.

And those Iraqi exiles encouraged the Bush administration by assuring them that that if the US deposed Sadam Hussein, then the Iraqi people would eagerly seize the opportunity to embrace liberalism and democracy.    [ < ------ which was a BIG FAT lie, perpetrated upon the Bush administration.]

The facts on the ground in Iraq were, that many political factions in Iraq pre 2003 hated Sadam Hussein's regime, but were powerless to start even an insurgency [.....because Sadam Hussein's regime were so brutal towards any prospective opposition.].

The Bush administration were extremely naive, and got 'played', by those political factions in Iraq who wanted Sadam Hussein's regime removed, and were happy to encourage the US to spend the US treasure and US blood, to accomplish that outcome.

The Bush administration got 'played' by a foreign culture, because the US accepted what they were told [by those in Iraq who opposed Sadam Hussein], as being true, and 'obvious',    ....and because the Bush administration were completely oblivious to the culture of deceit [towards all 'outsiders'] which pervades ISLAMIC culture.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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freediver

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Re: 'balance'
Reply #6 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:43pm

Here you go Aussie. Why do you always seem to forget your own opinion?

Aussie wrote on Jan 29^th, 2016 at 7:51pm:

Quote:

First of all I think it is fairly natural to care about anyone being subjugated, and the sort of oppression faced by women in Muslim countries, and the middle east in particular, is pretty grinding.

Therein lies the problem. We are sticking our nose into the cultures of another World....and that is grinding, freediver. It is none of our bloody business. I'm not here to impose my beliefs on Eskimo culture either. What gives us the right to tell the people of other Sovereign States how they must live?

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Aussie

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Re: 'balance'
Reply #7 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:46pm

freediver wrote on Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:43pm:

Here you go Aussie. Why do you always seem to forget your own opinion?

Aussie wrote on Jan 29^th, 2016 at 7:51pm:

Quote:

First of all I think it is fairly natural to care about anyone being subjugated, and the sort of oppression faced by women in Muslim countries, and the middle east in particular, is pretty grinding.

Therein lies the problem. We are sticking our nose into the cultures of another World....and that is grinding, freediver. It is none of our bloody business. I'm not here to impose my beliefs on Eskimo culture either. What gives us the right to tell the people of other Sovereign States how they must live?

Oh I see. You did not understand that I meant physical or actual imposition.

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Lord Herbert

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Re: 'balance'
Reply #8 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:58pm

Here comes the tumbrel on its way to the market-place where the broad blade of the guillotine glints in the early morning sun, and the mob is about to go insane with blood-lust for these wretched miscreants.

The names of The Guilty are read out to the accompaniment of drum-rolls

Aussie

John Smith

Bobby

Brian ....

... and may God have mercy upon their souls.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49091 At my desk.	Re: 'balance' Reply #9 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:59pm I get it Aussie. Nazis have a sovereign right to gas Jews. We have no right to intervene. Individual rights are meaningless. It's the states that have the rights, to do whatever they want.
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Karnal Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 95921 Gender:	Re: 'balance' Reply #10 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 2:01pm Y’s saying we didn’t, FD. Are you going to accept this?
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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 105372 Melbourne Gender:	Re: 'balance' Reply #11 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 2:02pm freediver wrote on Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:59pm: I get it Aussie. Nazis have a sovereign right to gas Jews. We have no right to intervene. Individual rights are meaningless. It's the states that have the rights, to do whatever they want. And the Nuremberg trial rules didn't help the poor people of Rwanda.
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Aussie

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Re: 'balance'
Reply #12 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 2:06pm

freediver wrote on Jan 31^st, 2016 at 1:59pm:

I get it Aussie. Nazis have a sovereign right to gas Jews. We have no right to intervene. Individual rights are meaningless. It's the states that have the rights, to do whatever they want.

I said that if gassing Jews was made legal in Germany (and I asked you and received the usual no answer ~ if you thought that was even remotely likely) we could not intervene without breaching German sovereignty. Is that not what I said, freediver?

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49091 At my desk.	Re: 'balance' Reply #13 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 2:10pm You also said we had not right Aussie. Do you need me to quote you again?
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Aussie Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 38770 Gender:	Re: 'balance' Reply #14 - Jan 31^st, 2016 at 2:15pm freediver wrote on Jan 31^st, 2016 at 2:10pm: You also said we had not right Aussie. Do you need me to quote you again? I would not at all be surprised that I said we had no right......without breaching sovereignty, did I not?
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