Australian Politics Forum - Charged for defending your own home

innocentbystander. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 4723 Gender:	Re: Charged for defending your own home Reply #150 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 9:29am I believe that Professor Plum did it, in the conservatory, with the wrench.
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longweekend58

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Re: Charged for defending your own home
Reply #151 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 9:34am

GordyL wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:58am:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:50am:

GordyL wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:30am:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:00am:

GordyL wrote on Mar 27^th, 2016 at 7:23pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Mar 27^th, 2016 at 7:14pm:

red baron wrote on Mar 27^th, 2016 at 6:19pm:

If you encounter an intruder and if you have a massive fight in which you come out on top and the intruder on his back out cold. Just make sure you don't overlook 'that knife' in the intruder's hand which is in situ before you call the cavalry in. And make sure your prints aren't all over 'that intruder's' knife hey? Wink

This, from an ex-cop.

And then, some numbskull supports him.

Jesus - what's wrong with you people?

An intruder enters a home where a family is sleeping and the adult in the house is not trained or confident in combat. When they encounter the intruder in the dark pure fear takes over and they over react and kill him. Lights go on and discover he is unarmed.

Is it immoral to place a weapon in the intruders hand?

immoral, unethical, criminal and utterly stupid. so yes.

So there's a dead intruder on the ground.
Your children will be raised in foster care for 10 years.
You'd hold you head high and cop the 10 years?

A) you are not clever enough to fake the evidence especially since it was not planned. You will be caught and go to jail for a long time
B) reasonable self-defence does not mean killing someone unless they are intent on killing or seriously injuring you. most burglars when confronted... RUN.
your morals and ethics appear to be... well... missing.

What you're saying is that all people will react calmly and proportionally which is unreasonable.

Someone who's trained would be able to dial up the response exactly enough to meet the threat.

Someone who's never had a fight in their life may sh!t themselves and over react.

If someone walks into my house at 3am in the morning and I clock him once with the 3/4 baseball bat which lives behind my door and he dies, I'm not going to jail.

The latest update on the story is the dead guy was placed in a headlock on the street.

That is why the guy was arrested.

the law does understand this point. 'reasonable force' is not an easily measured concept. A trained martial arts person or self-defence expert will be judged much more harshly than joe public. but even joe public knows that stabbing someone 50 times is an overreaction to pretty much everything.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Charged for defending your own home
Reply #152 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 9:37am

John Smith wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 9:25am:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:02am:

and render your claim to self-defence, invalid.

may make your claim less believable, but I doubt it makes it invalid

if you fabricate your crime scene, investigators are highly likely to be dubious of any self-defence claim. true self-defence doesnt need 'help' liek this.

Red must have been a truly corrupt cop to have come up with this idea.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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John Smith

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Re: Charged for defending your own home
Reply #153 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 9:38am

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 9:37am:

John Smith wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 9:25am:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:02am:

and render your claim to self-defence, invalid.

may make your claim less believable, but I doubt it makes it invalid

if you fabricate your crime scene, investigators are highly likely to be dubious of any self-defence claim. true self-defence doesnt need 'help' liek this.

Red must have been a truly corrupt cop to have come up with this idea.

like I said, it may make it less believable, but it does not make it invalid.

DO you know the definition of invalid or do I need to put it up for you?

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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GordyL

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Re: Charged for defending your own home
Reply #154 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 9:46am

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:52am:

GordyL wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:37am:

More about the dead guy.

He had served more than 20 months before the Court of Criminal Appeal ruled his convictions should be quashed due to errors made by the trial judge.

Mr Slater had been convicted of a ram raid at Sandgate adult store Nauti & Nice in November, 2012, in which cash and a quantity of synthetic drugs were stolen.

He was acquitted on appeal and released from custody after the Crown conceded a number of errors were made in the trial, including the use of CCTV footage.

he sounds like someone who was going to get killed eventually anyhow. HOWEVER (and its a biggie) that in no way excuses killing a burglar who did not intend to kill or harm the inhabitants. note the idiot had no convictions for violence.

When someone finds an intruder in their house at 3am knowing precisely the intruders intentions is impossible.

If your children were sleeping in your house just about any action would be reasonable as you could say you were acting out of fear.

The things

NOT

to do is attempt to restrain a fleeing assailant, or assault them outside of you home after they've attempted to flee.

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BigOl64

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Re: Charged for defending your own home
Reply #155 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:02am

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:52am:

GordyL wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:37am:

More about the dead guy.

He had served more than 20 months before the Court of Criminal Appeal ruled his convictions should be quashed due to errors made by the trial judge.

Mr Slater had been convicted of a ram raid at Sandgate adult store Nauti & Nice in November, 2012, in which cash and a quantity of synthetic drugs were stolen.

He was acquitted on appeal and released from custody after the Crown conceded a number of errors were made in the trial, including the use of CCTV footage.

he sounds like someone who was going to get killed eventually anyhow. HOWEVER (and its a biggie) that in no way excuses killing a burglar who did not intend to kill or harm the inhabitants. note the idiot had no convictions for violence.

See this is where the law degree is a must, the average person, does not know this particular scum-bag's particulars, so may not be able to quickly apply the legally mandated force.

Isn't the law fun

The law will always show preference for the criminal over the victim, makes it easier the the judges to fkkk the victims one more time.

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ian

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Re: Charged for defending your own home
Reply #156 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:31am

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:11am:

ian wrote on Mar 27^th, 2016 at 11:00pm:

mothra wrote on Mar 27^th, 2016 at 10:55pm:

ian wrote on Mar 27^th, 2016 at 10:50pm:

I can guess. i would rather you explained your point.

It's not difficult Ian.

You said you would stab an unarmed person. You would then "lie and fabricate" about your actions to avoid consequences.

I'm saying you don't need to "lie and fabricate" if you don't kill an unarmed person.

Did you really need that explained to you?

What arent you understanding? The intruders life is forfeit.. The fact they were armed or unarmed is irrelevant. Im not going to jail. Im posting via a proxy here so Im being quite candid.

Quite the bloodlust there... You are just salivating over the opportunity to kill someone.

Imagine however that the 'intruder' is in fact someone who mistook your house for where they were going. drunk, wrong address or whatever.

would you kill them? because you would get a life sentence for that.

Its quite a laugh, you advising me on anything.

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ian Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 9451	Re: Charged for defending your own home Reply #157 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:36am Only an idiot or a naive fool would tell the truth if it made them liable to criminal charges. And only a coward would believe standing back and waiting for the police if your family is under threat is appropriate.
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Aussie Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 38863 Gender:	Re: Charged for defending your own home Reply #158 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:38am Waddayareckon cods? (Baden-Clay) Quote: Only an idiot or a naive fool would tell the truth if it made them liable to criminal charges.
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ian

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Re: Charged for defending your own home
Reply #159 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:39am

GordyL wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 9:46am:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:52am:

GordyL wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 8:37am:

More about the dead guy.

He had served more than 20 months before the Court of Criminal Appeal ruled his convictions should be quashed due to errors made by the trial judge.

Mr Slater had been convicted of a ram raid at Sandgate adult store Nauti & Nice in November, 2012, in which cash and a quantity of synthetic drugs were stolen.

He was acquitted on appeal and released from custody after the Crown conceded a number of errors were made in the trial, including the use of CCTV footage.

he sounds like someone who was going to get killed eventually anyhow. HOWEVER (and its a biggie) that in no way excuses killing a burglar who did not intend to kill or harm the inhabitants. note the idiot had no convictions for violence.

When someone finds an intruder in their house at 3am knowing precisely the intruders intentions is impossible.

If your children were sleeping in your house just about any action would be reasonable as you could say you were acting out of fear.

The things

NOT

to do is attempt to restrain a fleeing assailant, or assault them outside of you home after they've attempted to flee.

Yes, and the first and only thing to tell the police afterwards is " I was in fear of my families lives and my life"

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Ajax Gold Member Offline CO2 has never controlled temperature on Earth Posts: 10982 Australia Gender:	Re: Charged for defending your own home Reply #160 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:41am I read in another thread that the two occupants broke this guys neck. I think they should go to jail for manslaughter. It was unnecessary, two on one no weapons.
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ian Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 9451	Re: Charged for defending your own home Reply #161 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:44am Ajax wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:41am: It was unnecessary, two on one no weapons. Really? So when 2 police officers arrest a violent offender thats unnecassary?
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Ajax

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Re: Charged for defending your own home
Reply #162 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:47am

ian wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:44am:

Ajax wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:41am:

It was unnecessary, two on one no weapons.

Really? So when 2 police officers arrest a violent offender thats unnecassary?

If I found someone inside my house I would fight like a wild animal, if I do subdue him then I'm not going to kill him.

To break someones neck you must have the head lock way after he passes out.

Sounds like this person is more of a scum than the intruder to me.

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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ian

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Re: Charged for defending your own home
Reply #163 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:50am

Ajax wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:47am:

ian wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:44am:

Ajax wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:41am:

It was unnecessary, two on one no weapons.

Really? So when 2 police officers arrest a violent offender thats unnecassary?

If I found someone inside my house I would fight like a wild animal, if I do subdue him then I'm not going to kill him.

To break someones neck you must have the head lock way after he passes out.

Sounds like this person is more of a scum than the intruder to me.

answer the question.

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Ajax

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Re: Charged for defending your own home
Reply #164 - Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:54am

ian wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:44am:

Ajax wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 10:41am:

It was unnecessary, two on one no weapons.

Really? So when 2 police officers arrest a violent offender thats unnecassary?

Of course its necessary.

Police officers usually grapple they don't use punches and kicks or ashtrays and other improvised weapons otherwise they would subdue their attacker much quicker.

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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