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Is Saudi Arabia Islamic? (Read 13203 times)
Sir James
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #30 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:48pm
 
ISIS is SUNNI

Wahhabism (Arabic: وهابية‎, Wahhābiya(h)) or Wahhabi mission[1] (;[2] Arabic: الدعوة الوهابية‎, ad-Da'wa al-Wahhābiya(h) ) is a religious movement or branch of Sunni Islam.

Adherents often object to the term Wahhabi or Wahhabism as derogatory, and prefer to be called Salafi or muwahhid.

Wahhabism is named after an eighteenth-century preacher and scholar, Muhammad ibn Abd al-Wahhab (1703–1792).[16] He started a revivalist movement in the remote, sparsely populated region of Najd,[17] advocating a purging of practices such as the popular "cult of saints", and shrine and tomb visitation, widespread among Muslims, but which he considered idolatry (shirk), impurities and innovations in Islam (Bid'ah).




It sounds like this dude wanted to clean islam up a bit from the mindless drones and cultish pagan practices borrowed from the pagan religions of the day when islam was invented.


At the end of the day.

Wahhabi
Sheite
Sunni (ISIS)
Muslim forum Apologists
ALL Muslims
Whatever brand of islamic psychotic behavior you subscribe too.

All follow the same evil book that promotes Terrorism, Violence, Murder and Hatred of all non believers in black and white easy to understand text. The evil bile book of filth the qur'an.

ALL Muslims  no matter what brand of islamic psychotic behavior call the same fictitious book their holy book.

Muslims babbling on online about different names for muslims like we give a shyte still can't re-write their bile terrorist handbook of filth they call a holy book. The qur'an.

Because simply when we talk about muslims we are talking about them and their qur'an which is what they believe is holy.

No one ever listens to a person that believes Bigotry Terrorism , Pedophilia is cool and Holy in order to see if their perception of them is wrong Grin Grin Grin.

Common sense dictates no one listens to a person that calls terrorism holy and bigotry and murder holy. Maybe converse to take the piss at their amazement that they think people do listen to them.

The intellectually impaired ones that do will fit right in of course. Which just creates the whole problem because intellectually impaired people can be made to do anything. In this case commit terrorist acts by other intellectually impaired people that follow a a book written by a man so he could go raping and pillaging. He would be probably laughing at them in his grave right now.

What a shame we have islam screwing every country over into a shyte hole that it touches. This stuff isn't from a god that created this world. These people cannot stand to see others be happy. Sick fecks.


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« Last Edit: Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:05pm by Sir James »  

matty = muslim with a mat collection, invented by the intellectual giants with an IQ of 81 or below.  Yeah its such a gotcha , I know. Roll Eyes
 
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Karnal
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #31 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:28pm
 
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:30pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:00pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 12:22pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 11:41am:
Most of the Iranians I’ve met are avowed secularists, if not atheist Marxists. 


Would you be open to the idea of limiting immigration to Australia to people who are avowed secularists?



What would this do? Our public and corporate sectors are secularist. We have anti-descrimination legislation. Equal Opportunity Employment, secularist civil and corporate law. Our constitution, even though it references God, is avowedly secularist.

How would you assess the beliefs of those immigrating? Ask them a series of questions they could lie to? And what do you do wiith tthe Bible Belt crowd and Catholics? A similar campaign once existed to ban Catholics because they held allegiance to a foreign leader, the pope.

A similar plan.once existed to ban communists. Of course this was impossible to do, but that didn’t stop ASIO and Immigration officials from having this as their primary reason for being. We even.encouraged anti-communist troublemakers to come to Australia from places like Croatia. ASIO then.pointed them towards the supposedly communist Serbians to start a fight.

The cold war was a hoot.

So again, what would your plan.achieve, and how could you make it work?


Well we screen for a lot of things, I don't have all the answers but I like the objective.



Why do you like the objective? What purpose does it serve?
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Sir James
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #32 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:38pm
 
GordyL wrote on Apr 2nd, 2016 at 6:36pm:
If one wanted to observe Islam in it's purest form, in living every day practice, is Saudi Arabia a good place to do so?



If you want to see the hypocrisy of islam as opposed to it purist form and in its purist form when it suits go to saudi arabia.

Purist form would be defined by Islams doctrine. That doctrine is in the book called the qur'an. Today if you want to see that in full play in its purist form go do a weekend ISIS camp. There is nothing ISIS does that opposes that book the qur'an. That statement cannot be refuted by any muslim that follows the qur'an.

- So for purity go do a weekend ISIS camp.

- For islamic hypocrisy and barbaric purity when it suits go to saudi arabia.

The richer the muslim the greater the hypocrisy.

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matty = muslim with a mat collection, invented by the intellectual giants with an IQ of 81 or below.  Yeah its such a gotcha , I know. Roll Eyes
 
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GordyL
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #33 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:44pm
 
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:28pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:30pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:00pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 12:22pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 11:41am:
Most of the Iranians I’ve met are avowed secularists, if not atheist Marxists. 


Would you be open to the idea of limiting immigration to Australia to people who are avowed secularists?



What would this do? Our public and corporate sectors are secularist. We have anti-descrimination legislation. Equal Opportunity Employment, secularist civil and corporate law. Our constitution, even though it references God, is avowedly secularist.

How would you assess the beliefs of those immigrating? Ask them a series of questions they could lie to? And what do you do wiith tthe Bible Belt crowd and Catholics? A similar campaign once existed to ban Catholics because they held allegiance to a foreign leader, the pope.

A similar plan.once existed to ban communists. Of course this was impossible to do, but that didn’t stop ASIO and Immigration officials from having this as their primary reason for being. We even.encouraged anti-communist troublemakers to come to Australia from places like Croatia. ASIO then.pointed them towards the supposedly communist Serbians to start a fight.

The cold war was a hoot.

So again, what would your plan.achieve, and how could you make it work?


Well we screen for a lot of things, I don't have all the answers but I like the objective.



Why do you like the objective? What purpose does it serve?


Makes sense doesn't it? 

If someone is happy with a theocracy but wants to move to Australia for a better standard of living, wouldn't it be better to get the candidate who wants a better standard of living PLUS wants to live in a secular country?


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Fuzzball
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #34 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 3:09pm
 
GordyL wrote on Apr 2nd, 2016 at 6:36pm:
If one wanted to observe Islam in it's purest form, in living every day practice, is Saudi Arabia a good place to do so?



Mecca is a city in Saudi Arabia, the birthplace of Muhammad and the annual pilgrimage The Hajj. Therefore SA is pretty influential in the Islamic world. A corrupt government which enforces strict laws, yet the very wealthy governing class frequently visit world capitals partaking of alcohol and call-girls, and gorging themselves on the most expensive banquets, buying the most expensive property, vehicles, etc.

Hypocrisy and savagery at its most blatant.

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Frank
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #35 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 3:23pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 10:07am:
Most sunnis reject the wahabist ideology. Make what you will of that.



But that doesn't mean that the Saudis are not Muslims. They are. They are VERY, VERY Muslim. Everything in Saudi Arabia is impeccably Islamic. They are the Calvinists of Islam.

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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #36 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 5:33pm
 
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 12:22pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 11:41am:
Most of the Iranians I’ve met are avowed secularists, if not atheist Marxists. 


Would you be open to the idea of limiting immigration to Australia to people who are avowed secularists?

Kind of logical really, a Pakistani Sunni Islamists can get more than enough of that back home.



EXCLUSIVE: First gay bar opens in Tehran

The unthinkable has happened: an American gay bar called "The Pink Cucumber" has just opened in the centre of Tehran. As an emissary from the European Union's Ministry of Truth I had the honor to take part in a recent cultural visit to Iran to study this phenomenon. I am happy to share my experiences with the most korrekt komrades of the glorious Kube.

...

My first visit was to the offices of prime minister Rouhani. The prime minister stressed that his government wanted to show the world how Iran respects the ideas and preferences of other cultures. In his exact words:

We proclaim to have a religion of tolerance and peace. The world would call us filthy hypocrits if we would try to deny these homosexual immigrants their rights. I would of course smother my own son in goat's blood if he ever became gay, but to other cultures we must show respect for their particular values.

Later that day I visited the neighbourhood where The Pink Cucumber is located, a rowdy part of Tehran called Sandersville, filled with American-style burger restaurants and European cafés. My tour guide for the day was no other than Grand Ayatollah Khamenei. The ayatollah explains:

When the first Trump refugees from the West came, we opened our arms to them. They came to live here in the center of Tehran and called this part of town 'Sandersville'. After a while they started to cause problems: the cultural differences were too great to overcome. Scarcely clad young maidens, overt homosexuals, drunk people - and this in the middle of a conservative Muslim community. Everyone with common sense could see that this would cause problems.

We pass some young Swedish-looking boys making cat calls to a local girl in a niqab. They surround her, but when they see our cameras they quickly run away. The girl is safe... for now.

The Grand Ayatollah continues: "Me and my colleagues of the religious police tried to object, but an organisation called the Council of American Iranian Relations defamed us in the press and started legal procedures. In the end we backed down." He added that in his opinion this "council" is sponsored by dark foreign powers, but he has become powerless against them.

Walking through Sandersville we passed piss-drunk Brits vomiting in the gutter, fat Americans chomping down burgers, and young German women flashing their boobs at us. Local women, veiled from head to toes, walk past all the mayhem, trying to continue life as usual - but they are clearly ill at ease in the midst of all this decadent display.

When we reach The Pink Cucumber, a protest action of members of the former Religious Police and the Etela'at (secret police) is just being dispersed by the regular police officers. Amidst shouts of "free speech for religious fascists" and "killing infidels is culture too," the riot police move in and swipe the street brutally. After a while, only the sounds of "Waterloo" by ABBA are heard in the street, coming from the bar. Through the window, we can see naked men dancing on a table.

When I ask Mr. Khamenei if he is not sad to see his Iran change so quickly, he answers, "We must follow the leadership of our Prophet. We must accept these foreign people, even if it harms our own way of life. We cannot ask the Western world to be tolerant towards us if we show no tolerance towards their opinions. Violence against homosexuals cannot happen in Iran. We would make complete fools of ourselves if we would start killing people of a different sexual orientation, and then say that we follow a religion of peace. Nobody would ever take us seriously again."

But as he looked away, I could not help notice a single tear rolling down his cheek.
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Karnal
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #37 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:35pm
 
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:44pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:28pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:30pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:00pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 12:22pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 11:41am:
Most of the Iranians I’ve met are avowed secularists, if not atheist Marxists. 


Would you be open to the idea of limiting immigration to Australia to people who are avowed secularists?



What would this do? Our public and corporate sectors are secularist. We have anti-descrimination legislation. Equal Opportunity Employment, secularist civil and corporate law. Our constitution, even though it references God, is avowedly secularist.

How would you assess the beliefs of those immigrating? Ask them a series of questions they could lie to? And what do you do wiith tthe Bible Belt crowd and Catholics? A similar campaign once existed to ban Catholics because they held allegiance to a foreign leader, the pope.

A similar plan.once existed to ban communists. Of course this was impossible to do, but that didn’t stop ASIO and Immigration officials from having this as their primary reason for being. We even.encouraged anti-communist troublemakers to come to Australia from places like Croatia. ASIO then.pointed them towards the supposedly communist Serbians to start a fight.

The cold war was a hoot.

So again, what would your plan.achieve, and how could you make it work?


Well we screen for a lot of things, I don't have all the answers but I like the objective.



Why do you like the objective? What purpose does it serve?


Makes sense doesn't it? 

If someone is happy with a theocracy but wants to move to Australia for a better standard of living, wouldn't it be better to get the candidate who wants a better standard of living PLUS wants to live in a secular country?




Do you think people move to Australia in the hope that it will become an Islamic caliphate?

And do you think there are so many with this intention that we need to  weed them out by asking everyone who comes to Australia, "have you ever had a yearning to live in a theocracy?"

But why stop there? We could screen for all sorts of beliefs, religious and political views.  "Do you believe in a beard tax?"

"Do you believe women should be kept indoors during menstration?"

"Do you think political leaders should be circumcised prior to taking their oath of office?"

A simple yes or no will suffice.
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Frank
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #38 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:44pm
 
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:35pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:44pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:28pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:30pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:00pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 12:22pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 11:41am:
Most of the Iranians I’ve met are avowed secularists, if not atheist Marxists. 


Would you be open to the idea of limiting immigration to Australia to people who are avowed secularists?



What would this do? Our public and corporate sectors are secularist. We have anti-descrimination legislation. Equal Opportunity Employment, secularist civil and corporate law. Our constitution, even though it references God, is avowedly secularist.

How would you assess the beliefs of those immigrating? Ask them a series of questions they could lie to? And what do you do wiith tthe Bible Belt crowd and Catholics? A similar campaign once existed to ban Catholics because they held allegiance to a foreign leader, the pope.

A similar plan.once existed to ban communists. Of course this was impossible to do, but that didn’t stop ASIO and Immigration officials from having this as their primary reason for being. We even.encouraged anti-communist troublemakers to come to Australia from places like Croatia. ASIO then.pointed them towards the supposedly communist Serbians to start a fight.

The cold war was a hoot.

So again, what would your plan.achieve, and how could you make it work?


Well we screen for a lot of things, I don't have all the answers but I like the objective.



Why do you like the objective? What purpose does it serve?


Makes sense doesn't it? 

If someone is happy with a theocracy but wants to move to Australia for a better standard of living, wouldn't it be better to get the candidate who wants a better standard of living PLUS wants to live in a secular country?




Do you think people move to Australia in the hope that it will become an Islamic caliphate?



The evidence is that Muslims moving to the West do not leave behind their aspirations for a caliphate, for sharia, they do not leave the idea of an Islamic Ummah behind them. SO as the number of Muslims grows in any country, the agitation for sharia, caliphate, Islamic laws and customs grows.

There is nothing unexpected about this. Previous waives of migrants had no religio-polititical identities. The Greeks and Italians and the Vietnamese or even the Chinese are not bringing a distinctive religio-political identity and idea of social organisation. Muslims do. 
To be a Muslim is to be consciously distinct from Christians, Jews. Hindus, atheists, idolaters.


The Greeks and Italians and Vietnamese didn't want you to become Greek, Italian, etc.
Islam is an intolerant religion. It demands submission, one way or another. 






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GordyL
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #39 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:50pm
 
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:35pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:44pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:28pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:30pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:00pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 12:22pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 11:41am:
Most of the Iranians I’ve met are avowed secularists, if not atheist Marxists. 


Would you be open to the idea of limiting immigration to Australia to people who are avowed secularists?



What would this do? Our public and corporate sectors are secularist. We have anti-descrimination legislation. Equal Opportunity Employment, secularist civil and corporate law. Our constitution, even though it references God, is avowedly secularist.

How would you assess the beliefs of those immigrating? Ask them a series of questions they could lie to? And what do you do wiith tthe Bible Belt crowd and Catholics? A similar campaign once existed to ban Catholics because they held allegiance to a foreign leader, the pope.

A similar plan.once existed to ban communists. Of course this was impossible to do, but that didn’t stop ASIO and Immigration officials from having this as their primary reason for being. We even.encouraged anti-communist troublemakers to come to Australia from places like Croatia. ASIO then.pointed them towards the supposedly communist Serbians to start a fight.

The cold war was a hoot.

So again, what would your plan.achieve, and how could you make it work?


Well we screen for a lot of things, I don't have all the answers but I like the objective.



Why do you like the objective? What purpose does it serve?


Makes sense doesn't it? 

If someone is happy with a theocracy but wants to move to Australia for a better standard of living, wouldn't it be better to get the candidate who wants a better standard of living PLUS wants to live in a secular country?




Do you think people move to Australia in the hope that it will become an Islamic caliphate?

And do you think there are so many with this intention that we need to  weed them out by asking everyone who comes to Australia, "have you ever had a yearning to live in a theocracy?"

But why stop there? We could screen for all sorts of beliefs, religious and political views.  "Do you believe in a beard tax?"

"Do you believe women should be kept indoors during menstration?"

"Do you think political leaders should be circumcised prior to taking their oath of office?"

A simple yes or no will suffice.


You've just taken a nice turn into the land of the slippery slope fallacy.

I was talking about secularism in Govt, nothing more.

What would be wrong with a nicely worded clause on any immigration form/citizen test pointing out that Australia is committed to a secular Govt and expects all immigrants to support secularism in Govt institutions?


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Karnal
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #40 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 7:42pm
 
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:50pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:35pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:44pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:28pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:30pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:00pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 12:22pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 11:41am:
Most of the Iranians I’ve met are avowed secularists, if not atheist Marxists. 


Would you be open to the idea of limiting immigration to Australia to people who are avowed secularists?



What would this do? Our public and corporate sectors are secularist. We have anti-descrimination legislation. Equal Opportunity Employment, secularist civil and corporate law. Our constitution, even though it references God, is avowedly secularist.

How would you assess the beliefs of those immigrating? Ask them a series of questions they could lie to? And what do you do wiith tthe Bible Belt crowd and Catholics? A similar campaign once existed to ban Catholics because they held allegiance to a foreign leader, the pope.

A similar plan.once existed to ban communists. Of course this was impossible to do, but that didn’t stop ASIO and Immigration officials from having this as their primary reason for being. We even.encouraged anti-communist troublemakers to come to Australia from places like Croatia. ASIO then.pointed them towards the supposedly communist Serbians to start a fight.

The cold war was a hoot.

So again, what would your plan.achieve, and how could you make it work?


Well we screen for a lot of things, I don't have all the answers but I like the objective.



Why do you like the objective? What purpose does it serve?


Makes sense doesn't it? 

If someone is happy with a theocracy but wants to move to Australia for a better standard of living, wouldn't it be better to get the candidate who wants a better standard of living PLUS wants to live in a secular country?




Do you think people move to Australia in the hope that it will become an Islamic caliphate?

And do you think there are so many with this intention that we need to  weed them out by asking everyone who comes to Australia, "have you ever had a yearning to live in a theocracy?"

But why stop there? We could screen for all sorts of beliefs, religious and political views.  "Do you believe in a beard tax?"

"Do you believe women should be kept indoors during menstration?"

"Do you think political leaders should be circumcised prior to taking their oath of office?"

A simple yes or no will suffice.


You've just taken a nice turn into the land of the slippery slope fallacy.

I was talking about secularism in Govt, nothing more.

What would be wrong with a nicely worded clause on any immigration form/citizen test pointing out that Australia is committed to a secular Govt and expects all immigrants to support secularism in Govt institutions?




Good idea, Gordy. That’ll weed them out, shurely.

If they don’t tick the box -

DENIED.
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #41 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 7:43pm
 
Frank wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:44pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:35pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:44pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:28pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:30pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:00pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 12:22pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 11:41am:
Most of the Iranians I’ve met are avowed secularists, if not atheist Marxists. 


Would you be open to the idea of limiting immigration to Australia to people who are avowed secularists?



What would this do? Our public and corporate sectors are secularist. We have anti-descrimination legislation. Equal Opportunity Employment, secularist civil and corporate law. Our constitution, even though it references God, is avowedly secularist.

How would you assess the beliefs of those immigrating? Ask them a series of questions they could lie to? And what do you do wiith tthe Bible Belt crowd and Catholics? A similar campaign once existed to ban Catholics because they held allegiance to a foreign leader, the pope.

A similar plan.once existed to ban communists. Of course this was impossible to do, but that didn’t stop ASIO and Immigration officials from having this as their primary reason for being. We even.encouraged anti-communist troublemakers to come to Australia from places like Croatia. ASIO then.pointed them towards the supposedly communist Serbians to start a fight.

The cold war was a hoot.

So again, what would your plan.achieve, and how could you make it work?


Well we screen for a lot of things, I don't have all the answers but I like the objective.



Why do you like the objective? What purpose does it serve?


Makes sense doesn't it? 

If someone is happy with a theocracy but wants to move to Australia for a better standard of living, wouldn't it be better to get the candidate who wants a better standard of living PLUS wants to live in a secular country?




Do you think people move to Australia in the hope that it will become an Islamic caliphate?



The evidence is that Muslims moving to the West do not leave behind their aspirations for a caliphate, for sharia, they do not leave the idea of an Islamic Ummah behind them. SO as the number of Muslims grows in any country, the agitation for sharia, caliphate, Islamic laws and customs grows.

There is nothing unexpected about this. Previous waives of migrants had no religio-polititical identities. The Greeks and Italians and the Vietnamese or even the Chinese are not bringing a distinctive religio-political identity and idea of social organisation. Muslims do. 
To be a Muslim is to be consciously distinct from Christians, Jews. Hindus, atheists, idolaters.


The Greeks and Italians and Vietnamese didn't want you to become Greek, Italian, etc.
Islam is an intolerant religion. It demands submission, one way or another. 





What evidence, Frank?
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #42 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 8:02pm
 
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 7:42pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:50pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:35pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:44pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:28pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:30pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:00pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 12:22pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 11:41am:
Most of the Iranians I’ve met are avowed secularists, if not atheist Marxists. 


Would you be open to the idea of limiting immigration to Australia to people who are avowed secularists?



What would this do? Our public and corporate sectors are secularist. We have anti-descrimination legislation. Equal Opportunity Employment, secularist civil and corporate law. Our constitution, even though it references God, is avowedly secularist.

How would you assess the beliefs of those immigrating? Ask them a series of questions they could lie to? And what do you do wiith tthe Bible Belt crowd and Catholics? A similar campaign once existed to ban Catholics because they held allegiance to a foreign leader, the pope.

A similar plan.once existed to ban communists. Of course this was impossible to do, but that didn’t stop ASIO and Immigration officials from having this as their primary reason for being. We even.encouraged anti-communist troublemakers to come to Australia from places like Croatia. ASIO then.pointed them towards the supposedly communist Serbians to start a fight.

The cold war was a hoot.

So again, what would your plan.achieve, and how could you make it work?


Well we screen for a lot of things, I don't have all the answers but I like the objective.



Why do you like the objective? What purpose does it serve?


Makes sense doesn't it? 

If someone is happy with a theocracy but wants to move to Australia for a better standard of living, wouldn't it be better to get the candidate who wants a better standard of living PLUS wants to live in a secular country?




Do you think people move to Australia in the hope that it will become an Islamic caliphate?

And do you think there are so many with this intention that we need to  weed them out by asking everyone who comes to Australia, "have you ever had a yearning to live in a theocracy?"

But why stop there? We could screen for all sorts of beliefs, religious and political views.  "Do you believe in a beard tax?"

"Do you believe women should be kept indoors during menstration?"

"Do you think political leaders should be circumcised prior to taking their oath of office?"

A simple yes or no will suffice.


You've just taken a nice turn into the land of the slippery slope fallacy.

I was talking about secularism in Govt, nothing more.

What would be wrong with a nicely worded clause on any immigration form/citizen test pointing out that Australia is committed to a secular Govt and expects all immigrants to support secularism in Govt institutions?




Good idea, Gordy. That’ll weed them out, shurely.

If they don’t tick the box -

DENIED.


So what's wrong with trying?  If you tick the box then show up at the HuT meeting, onya bike
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Baronvonrort
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #43 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 8:19pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 10:07am:
Most sunnis reject the wahabist ideology. Make what you will of that.


What did Muhammad Wahhab do that is unislamic, is it nothing zip zilch?

What exactly do they reject?
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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.
 
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Karnal
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Re: Is Saudi Arabia Islamic?
Reply #44 - Apr 3rd, 2016 at 8:40pm
 
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 8:02pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 7:42pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:50pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 6:35pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:44pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 2:28pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:30pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 1:00pm:
GordyL wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 12:22pm:
Karnal wrote on Apr 3rd, 2016 at 11:41am:
Most of the Iranians I’ve met are avowed secularists, if not atheist Marxists. 


Would you be open to the idea of limiting immigration to Australia to people who are avowed secularists?



What would this do? Our public and corporate sectors are secularist. We have anti-descrimination legislation. Equal Opportunity Employment, secularist civil and corporate law. Our constitution, even though it references God, is avowedly secularist.

How would you assess the beliefs of those immigrating? Ask them a series of questions they could lie to? And what do you do wiith tthe Bible Belt crowd and Catholics? A similar campaign once existed to ban Catholics because they held allegiance to a foreign leader, the pope.

A similar plan.once existed to ban communists. Of course this was impossible to do, but that didn’t stop ASIO and Immigration officials from having this as their primary reason for being. We even.encouraged anti-communist troublemakers to come to Australia from places like Croatia. ASIO then.pointed them towards the supposedly communist Serbians to start a fight.

The cold war was a hoot.

So again, what would your plan.achieve, and how could you make it work?


Well we screen for a lot of things, I don't have all the answers but I like the objective.



Why do you like the objective? What purpose does it serve?


Makes sense doesn't it? 

If someone is happy with a theocracy but wants to move to Australia for a better standard of living, wouldn't it be better to get the candidate who wants a better standard of living PLUS wants to live in a secular country?




Do you think people move to Australia in the hope that it will become an Islamic caliphate?

And do you think there are so many with this intention that we need to  weed them out by asking everyone who comes to Australia, "have you ever had a yearning to live in a theocracy?"

But why stop there? We could screen for all sorts of beliefs, religious and political views.  "Do you believe in a beard tax?"

"Do you believe women should be kept indoors during menstration?"

"Do you think political leaders should be circumcised prior to taking their oath of office?"

A simple yes or no will suffice.


You've just taken a nice turn into the land of the slippery slope fallacy.

I was talking about secularism in Govt, nothing more.

What would be wrong with a nicely worded clause on any immigration form/citizen test pointing out that Australia is committed to a secular Govt and expects all immigrants to support secularism in Govt institutions?




Good idea, Gordy. That’ll weed them out, shurely.

If they don’t tick the box -

DENIED.


So what's wrong with trying?  If you tick the box then show up at the HuT meeting, onya bike


Because it’s not trying anything, Gordy. You know this.

These sorts of boxes on forms are no more than pointless buraucracy.

Do you think these sorts of questions are not covered in an application for citizenship?

And do you know the amount of forms and assessments required to immigrate to Australia? Skilled migration takes at least 7 years. Spousal visas take at least 5. Language tests, skills tests, insurance, bonds, tens of thousands of dollars. Australia is one of the hardest countries in the world to move to. Even the tourist visas are hard to get.

And have you seen a longer customs form? I haven’t.

So sure, lets add one more question everyone will happily tick.
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