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When is a religion a cult? (Read 14781 times)
Sir James
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #150 - Apr 13th, 2016 at 10:06pm
 
boxy wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 10:03pm:
"The difference between a cult and a religion.
In a cult, there is a person at the top who knows it's a scam.
In a religion, that person is dead."


Incorrect.
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matty = muslim with a mat collection, invented by the intellectual giants with an IQ of 81 or below.  Yeah its such a gotcha , I know. Roll Eyes
 
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Karnal
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #151 - Apr 13th, 2016 at 10:28pm
 
boxy wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 10:03pm:
"The difference between a cult and a religion.
In a cult, there is a person at the top who knows it's a scam.
In a religion, that person is dead."


Ah.
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Bobby.
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #152 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 7:17am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 8:14pm:
Bobby. wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 5:53pm:
Talking to Gandalf is like talking to a brick wall -


Only when the only purpose of the question is to ridicule.



OK then - do you believe in the virgin Mary?



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polite_gandalf
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #153 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 10:10am
 
Valkie wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 5:52pm:
The thread has been lost in a plethora of insults and misdirection.

The question was
Is Islam a Cult or Religion?

Too many times the real question is lost in rhetoric and tautology.



Do you think so?

Funny, I would have said that the very question "is [religion x] a cult or religion" itself is meaningless rhetoric and tautology.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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polite_gandalf
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #154 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 10:11am
 
Bobby. wrote on Apr 14th, 2016 at 7:17am:
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 8:14pm:
Bobby. wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 5:53pm:
Talking to Gandalf is like talking to a brick wall -


Only when the only purpose of the question is to ridicule.



OK then - do you believe in the virgin Mary?





What is the point of this question bobby? Try and be honest.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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John_Taverner
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #155 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 10:51am
 
All religions are cults. Cult comes from the same root as "culture". It has only been in recent times that cult in English was used in a pejorative way. Historians still speak about the Cult of Juno, Hermes or whatever. It just means religion. 

Et Voila! Le culte de Jésus:

http://www.mariedenazareth.com/qui-est-marie/le-culte-de-jesus

Le culte Musulman:

http://www.lecfcm.fr/

That's how the word used to be used in English (and still is to some extent)
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« Last Edit: Apr 14th, 2016 at 11:00am by John_Taverner »  
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Karnal
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #156 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 11:08am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 14th, 2016 at 10:11am:
Bobby. wrote on Apr 14th, 2016 at 7:17am:
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 8:14pm:
Bobby. wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 5:53pm:
Talking to Gandalf is like talking to a brick wall -


Only when the only purpose of the question is to ridicule.



OK then - do you believe in the virgin Mary?





What is the point of this question bobby? Try and be honest.


Bobbie likes the bit about having the decency to jerk off the person you're cornholing.
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Sir James
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #157 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 11:26am
 
Bobbie is wondering what the cult members response will be.

The cult members seem scared of his questions.
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matty = muslim with a mat collection, invented by the intellectual giants with an IQ of 81 or below.  Yeah its such a gotcha , I know. Roll Eyes
 
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Karnal
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #158 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 12:15pm
 
John_Taverner wrote on Apr 14th, 2016 at 10:51am:
All religions are cults. Cult comes from the same root as "culture". It has only been in recent times that cult in English was used in a pejorative way. Historians still speak about the Cult of Juno, Hermes or whatever. It just means religion. 

Et Voila! Le culte de Jésus:

http://www.mariedenazareth.com/qui-est-marie/le-culte-de-jesus

Le culte Musulman:

http://www.lecfcm.fr/

That's how the word used to be used in English (and still is to some extent)


Good point, JT, but things changed in the 1970s after a spate of cult atrocities. The end of the peace and love era of the 1960s is generally put down to the murders of the Manson gang, a hippie/LSD cult.

The focus on cults came about after the Jonestown massacre, a mass suicide orchestrated by Jim Jones, the leader of a Christian cult that had received government funds and favours.

Cults became popular in the 1970s as new recruiting processes and cold war "mind control" techniques were used to exploit people interested in religion. As the established churches lost their hold over the population, new movements arose. The 1960s saw a new interest in alternative religion. The post-war baby boom provided plenty of young, well-educated spiritual seekers, and these were rich pickings for charismatic cult leaders.

The Hare Krishnas, the Moonies, the Children of God and others used fanatical fundraising techniques. It was common to be approached by the Krishnas or the Moonies in airports and car parks. They both became multi-million dollar organizations with centres all over the world.

Initially, governments and law enforcement saw these movements as benign. After all, it's an individual's right to sell their souls or "swallow the Kool Aid", a reference to the cyanide-spiked cordial used at Jonestown in its mass-suicide.

This changed with Jonestown. Jim Jones' guards killed a US senator who had gone down to investigate rumours of people being held against their liberty. Cults like the Krishnas and Moonies were instantly held to account and started ramping up their own propaganda. The Krishnas wrote a pamphlet and press release saying "don't lump us in". Political favours granted to the Krishnas, the Moonies and the Church of Scientology (in the US) started to wane. Suddenly, politicians wanted nothing to do with organizations that could be seen to be cults.

These cults were a defining feature of the 1970s. They represented the dearth of organized religion and the paranoia associated with the height of the cold war. So this was where the counter-culture had ended up: intelligent young people from good families dropping out to join movements where they became little more than brainwashed drones.

And what about the worldly power of these cults? Think how obsessive the Chinese government is about eradicating the Falun Gong movement. Strangely, US politicians cultivated the cults of the 1970s, and why not? The Moonies, for example, could be told how to vote and bussed to the local polling station. Political donations came thick and fast - in cash. The Reverend Sun Myung Moon had connections to US politicians and high profile business leaders until his death in 2012. Scientology guru, Ron L Hubbard, left an organization to his protégé, David Miscavige, that is now a global, multi-billion dollar business.

Modern communications, tax laws, even modern transport has allowed cults to prosper. We're not talking about religion here - we're talking about hierarchical systems of fundraising and mass human control. We're talking about the dearth of organized religion and the sort of organizations that have arisen to fill the void.
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Sir James
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #159 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 1:59pm
 
The cult of mohammed, islam's  violence and abuse makes Jonestown look like a nice weekend away.

Maybe a big wall of text may nullify that FACT.
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matty = muslim with a mat collection, invented by the intellectual giants with an IQ of 81 or below.  Yeah its such a gotcha , I know. Roll Eyes
 
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Valkie
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #160 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 4:44pm
 
Quote:
Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #153 - Today at 10:10am Quote  Valkie wrote Yesterday at 5:52pm:
The thread has been lost in a plethora of insults and misdirection.

The question was
Is Islam a Cult or Religion?

Too many times the real question is lost in rhetoric and tautology.



Do you think so?

Funny, I would have said that the very question "is [religion x] a cult or religion" itself is meaningless rhetoric and tautology.


Perhaps somewhere in your confused mind, you have hit the nail on the head.
What I should have said was.
Is Islam an "Evil" Cult or a true Religion.

There, does that make it easier for you? Wink
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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU
 
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Bobby.
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #161 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 5:38pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 14th, 2016 at 10:11am:
Bobby. wrote on Apr 14th, 2016 at 7:17am:
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 8:14pm:
Bobby. wrote on Apr 13th, 2016 at 5:53pm:
Talking to Gandalf is like talking to a brick wall -


Only when the only purpose of the question is to ridicule.



OK then - do you believe in the virgin Mary?





What is the point of this question bobby? Try and be honest.



The virgin Mary is another myth from religion.
Since you believe in Mohammad flying
to heaven on a horse with wings
I just wondered if you believed in the virgin Mary too?
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polite_gandalf
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #162 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 5:42pm
 
Thanks Bobby, at least its clear now:

people who believe in religion are idiots - please prove to me you are an idiot Gandalf
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Bobby.
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #163 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 5:44pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 14th, 2016 at 5:42pm:
Thanks Bobby, at least its clear now:

people who believe in religion are idiots - please prove to me you are an idiot Gandalf



master Light believes in the virgin Mary -

are you calling him an idiot?
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polite_gandalf
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Re: When is a religion a cult?
Reply #164 - Apr 14th, 2016 at 5:49pm
 
I was paraphrasing you Bobby, not me.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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