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Poll Poll
Question: Who are the guilty parties?

100% the Management    
  6 (40.0%)
100% the mother (father not there)    
  3 (20.0%)
50 / 50 the mum and Management    
  3 (20.0%)
80% fault of the Management    
  0 (0.0%)
80% fault of the mother    
  1 (6.7%)
90% fault of the Management    
  1 (6.7%)
90% fault of the mother    
  1 (6.7%)
100% fault of the kid    
  0 (0.0%)




Total votes: 15
« Created by: Lord Herbert on: Jun 3rd, 2016 at 9:09pm »

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Gorilla shot after rescuing child (Read 47824 times)
mothra
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #165 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:30pm
 
I thought the mid got "through" the barrier. Not "over" it?

I was imagining a hedge.

I could be wrong though.
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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.
 
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Andrei.Hicks
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #166 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:34pm
 
If you actually watch the full video on live leak (not the cut versions on mainstream media) you would also probably be alarmed for the safety of the child as well.
I know I was.

He drags him with force at speed through the enclosure and under the water at times.

A tranquiliser would take 15 mins to kick in, they didn't have 15 mins.

Its a sad story all round but I think the right option was taken.
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #167 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:34pm
 
Quote:
where you could drive through
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capitosinora
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #168 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:36pm
 
Stupid cops didn't realise that the gorilla wanted to save the boy.


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GOD BLESS AMERICA
 
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greggerypeccary
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #169 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:38pm
 
Aussie wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:34pm:
Quote:
where you could drive through


Yes.

All that was between you and the lions, was the car door.

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Mistress Nicole
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #170 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:40pm
 
This is from my FB newsfeed:

Quote:
Amanda O'Donoughue
Yesterday at 10:55am ·
I am going to try to clear up a few things that have been weighing on me about Harambe and the Cinci Zoo since I read the news this afternoon.
I have worked with Gorillas as a zookeeper while in my twenties (before children) and they are my favorite animal (out of dozens) that I have ever worked closely with. I am gonna go ahead and list a few facts, thoughts and opinions for those of you that aren't familiar with the species itself, or how a zoo operates in emergency situations.

Now Gorillas are considered 'gentle giants' at least when compared with their more aggressive cousins the chimpanzee, but a 400+ pound male in his prime is as strong as roughly 10 adult humans. What can you bench press? OK, now multiply that number by ten. An adult male silverback gorilla has one job, to protect his group. He does this by bluffing or intimidating anything that he feels threatened by.

Gorillas are considered a Class 1 mammal, the most dangerous class of mammals in the animal kingdom, again, merely due to their size and strength. They are grouped in with other apes, tigers, lions, bears, etc.
While working in an AZA accredited zoo with Apes, keepers DO NOT work in contact with them. Meaning they do NOT go in with these animals. There is always a welded mesh barrier between the animal and the humans.
In more recent decades, zoos have begun to redesign enclosures, removing all obvious caging and attempting to create a seamless view of the animals for the visitor to enjoy watching animals in a more natural looking habitat. *this is great until little children begin falling into exhibits* which of course can happen to anyone, especially in a crowded zoo-like setting.

I have watched this video over again, and with the silverback's postering, and tight lips, it's pretty much the stuff of any keeper's nightmares, and I have had MANY while working with them. This job is not for the complacent. Gorillas are kind, curious, and sometimes silly, but they are also very large, very strong animals. I always brought my OCD to work with me. checking and rechecking locks to make sure my animals and I remained separated before entering to clean.

I keep hearing that the Gorilla was trying to protect the boy. I do not find this to be true. Harambe reaches for the boys hands and arms, but only to position the child better for his own displaying purposes.
Males do very elaborate displays when highly agitated, slamming and dragging things about. Typically they would drag large branches, barrels and heavy weighted balls around to make as much noise as possible. Not in an effort to hurt anyone or anything (usually) but just to intimidate. It was clear to me that he was reacting to the screams coming from the gathering crowd.

Harambe was most likely not going to separate himself from that child without seriously hurting him first (again due to mere size and strength, not malicious intent) Why didn't they use treats? well, they attempted to call them off exhibit (which animals hate), the females in the group came in, but Harambe did not. What better treat for a captive animal than a real live kid!
They didn't use Tranquilizers for a few reasons, A. Harambe would've taken too long to become immobilized, and could have really injured the child in the process as the drugs used may not work quickly enough depending on the stress of the situation and the dose B. Harambe would've have drowned in the moat if immobilized in the water, and possibly fallen on the boy trapping him and drowning him as well.
Many zoos have the protocol to call on their expertly trained dart team in the event of an animal escape or in the event that a human is trapped with a dangerous animal. They will evaluate the scene as quickly and as safely as possible, and will make the most informed decision as how they will handle the animal.
I can't point fingers at anyone in this situation, but we need to really evaluate the safety of the animal enclosures from the visitor side. Not impeding that view is a tough one, but there should be no way that someone can find themselves inside of an animal's exhibit.
I know one thing for sure, those keepers lost a beautiful, and I mean gorgeous silverback and friend. I feel their loss with them this week. As educators and conservators of endangered species, all we can do is shine a light on the beauty and majesty of these animals in hopes to spark a love and a need to keep them from vanishing from our planet. Child killers, they are not. It's unfortunate for the conservation of the species, and the loss of revenue a beautiful zoo such as Cinci will lose. tragedy all around.

*me working (very carefully) with a 400+ pound silverback circa 2009
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #171 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:46pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:38pm:
Aussie wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:34pm:
Quote:
where you could drive through


Yes.

All that was between you and the lions, was the car door.



And the window, and what sort of half wit would leave a window open?  Plenty ~ I'm sure there have been.
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Bobby.
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #172 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:48pm
 
Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:19pm:
Bobby. wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:06pm:
Aussie wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 6:25pm:
Quote:
A paying customer wandered off into a restricted area.

Hardly a criminal offence.


There are some serious questions about safety for those customers, especially for those who have no appreciation of the potential danger.  The kid ought never have been physically able to breach the enclosure.



Quite correct - haven't the zoo designers ever heard of chicken wire?


http://www.chickenwirenetting.com/chickenwire-images/ss_chicken_wire_hexagonal_h...

Someone needs to do time in jail for the error they made in designing the enclosure.


The barrier is said to be only 1 metre high.

An electrified fence with a mild shock is probably what is needed to keep people standing at a safe distance from these dangerous animals.

And again - where were the zoo's CCTV cameras, and who was monitoring the crowd?





Yes but a small child cannot pass through chicken wire.

...

It would have been so simple to improve the safety.
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mothra
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #173 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:50pm
 
Aussie wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:46pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:38pm:
Aussie wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:34pm:
Quote:
where you could drive through


Yes.

All that was between you and the lions, was the car door.



And the window, and what sort of half wit would leave a window open?  Plenty ~ I'm sure there have been.




We we t to a drive through safari park when I was a kid and my idjot brother got out of the car, ran to the boot and back then got ba k in.

Left the door open while he did the bolt too.
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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.
 
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greggerypeccary
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #174 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:55pm
 
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Lord Herbert
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #175 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:58pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:21pm:
Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:19pm:
Bobby. wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:06pm:
Aussie wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 6:25pm:
Quote:
A paying customer wandered off into a restricted area.

Hardly a criminal offence.


There are some serious questions about safety for those customers, especially for those who have no appreciation of the potential danger.  The kid ought never have been physically able to breach the enclosure.



Quite correct - haven't the zoo designers ever heard of chicken wire?


http://www.chickenwirenetting.com/chickenwire-images/ss_chicken_wire_hexagonal_h...

Someone needs to do time in jail for the error they made in designing the enclosure.


The barrier is said to be only 1 metre high.

An electrified fence with a mild shock is probably what is needed to keep people standing at a safe distance from these dangerous animals.

And again - where were the zoo's CCTV cameras, and who was monitoring the crowd?



I've visited lots of zoos, in lots of countries.

From memory, 1 metre high fences are quite common.

There used to be a lion park, here in Perth, where you could drive through the enclosure with no barriers between you and the lions.


I've been to Whipsnade zoo in the late '50's. Like a Safari Park. Much more humane.
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Lord Herbert
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #176 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 9:06pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:38pm:
Aussie wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:34pm:
Quote:
where you could drive through


Yes.

All that was between you and the lions, was the car door.



And the problem with this are the idiots who want to wind down the windows for a 'better shot' with their cameras.
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #177 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 9:07pm
 
Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 9:06pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:38pm:
Aussie wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:34pm:
Quote:
where you could drive through


Yes.

All that was between you and the lions, was the car door.



And the problem with this are the idiots who want to wind down the windows for a 'better shot' with their cameras.


Yeas, and they get what they deserve.
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innocentbystander.
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #178 - Jun 1st, 2016 at 9:08pm
 
capitosinora wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 8:36pm:
Stupid cops didn't realise that the gorilla wanted to save the boy.






Yes and he also wanted to return the boy to his parents in a clean condition.
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Re: Gorilla shot after rescuing child
Reply #179 - Jun 2nd, 2016 at 3:09am
 
GordyL wrote on May 29th, 2016 at 2:17pm:
Wrong call I reckon. 

They should have tried a tranquilizer fist while having it covered with a rifle.

They should also chuck the parents in with the lions for being such idiots.

http://www.smh.com.au/environment/animals/us-zoo-shoots-dead-gorilla-to-save-boy...


Yeah. I love being dragged around like a water-skier caught up in his line, too. That boy must have been very brave for keeping calm, and even trying to calm the gorilla, even during his own ordeal. I think the zookeepers chose the right option. A tranquiliser might have stopped the gorilla running amok. But not after the likelihood of taking it out on the child.
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