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a lot of people agree with Sonia (Read 9333 times)
John Smith
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #165 - Jul 24th, 2016 at 8:56pm
 
freediver wrote on Jul 24th, 2016 at 8:42pm:
Can you explain?



I did

freediver wrote on Jul 24th, 2016 at 8:42pm:
So you are happy to sit back and watch Muslims slaughter non Muslims in the middle east?



happy no, but I'd rather they kill each other than come here and try to kill me

freediver wrote on Jul 24th, 2016 at 8:42pm:
What about South East Asia?


what about it?

freediver wrote on Jul 24th, 2016 at 8:42pm:
No John, they were fleeing Muslims. Or getting forced out.


it's your story, I don't know and don't particularly care

freediver wrote on Jul 24th, 2016 at 8:42pm:
So if we left Israel to defend itself against the rest of the middle east without our support, you think the refugee problem would be confined to Israel?


What I know is that getting involved hasn't worked. I'm willing to try something different.

freediver wrote on Jul 24th, 2016 at 8:42pm:
You think they choose to get slaughtered?


no, but they can sit their like sheep or they can fight back.

freediver wrote on Jul 24th, 2016 at 8:42pm:
And you think sitting back and watching them get slaughtered counts as getting better?



yes .... I'd rather watch them get slaughtered than watch my neighbors, family and friends get slaughtered
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #166 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 7:31pm
 
freediver wrote on Jul 24th, 2016 at 8:42pm:
Quote:
Gee, I don't know .... could it be banning the Koran? after all, your question was 'Should we ban the Koran John?'


OK. I still don't see why you responded with this: not at all. I didn't call for anyone to be banned

Can you explain?


So this makes perfect sense to you John?
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John Smith
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #167 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 7:59pm
 
freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 7:31pm:
freediver wrote on Jul 24th, 2016 at 8:42pm:
Quote:
Gee, I don't know .... could it be banning the Koran? after all, your question was 'Should we ban the Koran John?'


OK. I still don't see why you responded with this: not at all. I didn't call for anyone to be banned

Can you explain?


So this makes perfect sense to you John?


Apart from the fact that I should have said 'anything' instead of 'anyone' , yes, it does.
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #168 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:20pm
 
Well that only took a page to resolve.

freediver wrote on Jul 23rd, 2016 at 5:45am:
John Smith wrote on Jul 22nd, 2016 at 7:48pm:
freediver wrote on Jul 22nd, 2016 at 7:46pm:
John Smith wrote on Jul 22nd, 2016 at 6:28pm:
freediver wrote on Jul 22nd, 2016 at 6:24pm:
John Smith wrote on Jul 21st, 2016 at 9:50pm:
freediver wrote on Jul 21st, 2016 at 9:46pm:
John Smith wrote on Jul 21st, 2016 at 9:38pm:
freediver wrote on Jul 21st, 2016 at 9:21pm:
Do people have the right to be bigots?


unfortuantely, yes they do


You think freedom of speech and freedom of thought is unfortunate? You should be celebrating it.


what's unfortunate is that for some people it seems to come with no responsibilities. The right to free speech shouldn't automatically include the right to abuse that right.


Can you give an example of such abuse? Would you say that the right to free speech does not come with the right to mock Muhammed?



behead the infidels
put her in a chaff bag and throw her out to sea

and I care as much about Muhammed as I do Felix the cat or frosty the snowman, actually less, the last two at least provide some entertainment for my kids



Should we ban the Koran John?



not at all. I didn't call for anyone to be banned


Who do you think I am talking about?



So, you think that 'behead the infidels' is an abuse of freedom of speech? Should Muslims be allowed to sell books that encourage people to kill infidels?
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John Smith
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #169 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:22pm
 
freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:20pm:
Well that only took a page to resolve.


I always thought you were a little slow

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:20pm:
So, you think that 'behead the infidels' is an abuse of freedom of speech?


yes

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:20pm:
Should Muslims be allowed to sell books that encourage people to kill infidels?


I'm wary of banning any books.
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #170 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:25pm
 
Quote:
I'm wary of banning any books.


I see you have thought this one through. How abut banning Muslims from reading it aloud?

Quote:
happy no, but I'd rather they kill each other than come here and try to kill me


What do you expect will happen when they are done killing each other?

Quote:
what about it?


It's also full of Muslims. If they started slaughtering each other in neighbouring countries, would you remain equally blase? What about in their own communities in Western Sydney?

Quote:
What I know is that getting involved hasn't worked. I'm willing to try something different.


And there are only two options?

Quote:
yes .... I'd rather watch them get slaughtered than watch my neighbors, family and friends get slaughtered


I guess you have no friends over there. Good for you.
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John Smith
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #171 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:30pm
 
freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:25pm:
I see you have thought this one through. How abut banning Muslims from reading it aloud?



depends on why ... if they're trying to convince someone to behead an infidel, they should be charged with conspiracy to commit murder ... if they're just reading scriptures as part of their bible study, then I don't have a problem with it

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:25pm:
What do you expect will happen when they are done killing each other?


they're all dead

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:25pm:
It's also full of Muslims.


they don't seem as intent to go out and enforce their beliefs on others

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:25pm:
What about in their own communities in Western Sydney?


I'd expect them to follow Australian law

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:25pm:
And there are only two options?


I've yet to see you suggest a third


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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #172 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:41pm
 
Quote:
depends on why ... if they're trying to convince someone to behead an infidel, they should be charged with conspiracy to commit murder ... if they're just reading scriptures as part of their bible study, then I don't have a problem with it


Even if they say exactly the same thing? What if it is a bit of both? What if one person is convinced, and the other thinks it is merely the word of Allah?

Quote:
they're all dead


Or they have gotten their poo together and they are coming after you.

Quote:
they don't seem as intent to go out and enforce their beliefs on others


They have not had Islam for as long.

Quote:
I'd expect them to follow Australian law


Do you think there are any international laws against slaughtering the infidel?

Quote:
I've yet to see you suggest a third


I've never considered it necessary. It takes an impressive effort at dumbing a topic down to only end up with two options. Congratulations.
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #173 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:54pm
 
freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:41pm:
Even if they say exactly the same thing? What if it is a bit of both? What if one person is convinced, and the other thinks it is merely the word of Allah?


I said it depends on the motives of the person reading, not how the person listening interprets it.

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:41pm:
Or they have gotten their poo together and they are coming after you.


if they got their poo together they won't be coming after anyone

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:41pm:
They have not had Islam for as long.


see, there's hope for them already

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:41pm:
Do you think there are any international laws against slaughtering the infidel?


probably not in every country

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 9:41pm:
I've never considered it necessary. It takes an impressive effort at dumbing a topic down to only end up with two options. Congratulations


I'm sure you think that sounds great, but you are avoiding offering any semblance of a solution.
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #174 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 10:00pm
 
Quote:
I said it depends on the motives of the person reading, not how the person listening interprets it.


So whether someone has a right to read a passage from the Koran out loud depends on their motivation for doing so?

Quote:
if they got their poo together they won't be coming after anyone


OK, they have half their poo together, only half of them are dead, and the other half are coming after you, once they finish off the Jews and Zoroastrians. Would that make you happy? Perhaps you think it could never happen?

Quote:
probably not in every country


Ah, so what countries do international laws apply to John?

Quote:
I'm sure you think that sounds great, but you are avoiding offering any semblance of a solution
.

True, I am merely pointing out the idiocy of your proposal.
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #175 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 11:06pm
 
freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 10:00pm:
So whether someone has a right to read a passage from the Koran out loud depends on their motivation for doing so?



I don't believe I mentioned volume

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 10:00pm:
OK, they have half their poo together, only half of them are dead, and the other half are coming after you, once they finish off the Jews and Zoroastrians. Would that make you happy? Perhaps you think it could never happen?



about as likely as aliens landing

freediver wrote on Jul 25th, 2016 at 10:00pm:
True, I am merely pointing out the idiocy of your proposal.


there is no idiocy in my proposal ... that you agree with it is irrelevant unless you can suggest an alternative. It's doesn't take a genius to say no to everything.
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #176 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 11:33pm
 

a lot MORE people agree with Sonia now
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #177 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 11:49pm
 

Quote:
Eric Abetz applauds Liberal activist who says Sonia Kruger was right to call for ban on Muslim immigration
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #178 - Jul 25th, 2016 at 11:54pm
 

Quote:
Australia is a free, tolerant and open democracy where we respect all points of view even if we don’t agree – or so we tell ourselves. If someone dares to say something that doesn’t happen to fit with the current thinking of the politically correct, that commitment to free speech, tolerance and respect is viciously jettisoned.

That’s exactly what has happened again this week with Sonia Kruger’s comments around Muslim immigration immediately being labelled as “racist” by the lefty-lynch mob. Indeed, some were so incensed that there were calls for her to be removed from her television presenting roles. It’s a sorry state of affairs where those who constantly profess to be the most tolerant are the first to demonstrate absolute intolerance.

As a gay man, I am deeply concerned about what an open-border approach to Muslim immigration would mean for me in circumstances where every single day in the Middle East people suspected of being gay are publicly hung or stoned to death.

Similarly, I couldn’t bemoan any woman who may be similarly concerned about the consequences of having an open-border approach from countries where it is a crime for a woman to dare to receive an education or to choose her own clothing.

Indeed, the left would be well advised to take a look at elements in the Middle East to see what genuine homophobia and misogyny actually looks like.

We only have to look at the societal consequences abroad especially for women, in places like Germany of throwing their borders open to one million immigrants to see the issues that can arise.

I am very supportive of Australia being open and accepting of immigrants to our nation, if it is done in an orderly way that ensures that immigrants understand our way of life and, importantly, our values – including in relation to the treatment of both gay people and women.

Raising these concerns is and should be unremarkable in a democracy and we should be able to engage in an adult conversation about the risks and ways to mitigate against them. But when you have the lefty-lynch mob always overeager to shut down discussion and label people as “racists”, “bigots” and “homophobes”, it begins to become fairly clear why people might want to use the privacy of the ballot box to send messages on issues, as evidenced by the election of the likes of Pauline Hanson, instead of having open and frank conversations.

All credit to Sonia Kruger for speaking her mind and not backing down. It’s high time for the lynch-mob to take a long, hard look in the mirror.


http://spectator.com.au/2016/07/kruger-is-right-muslim-immigration-should-be-car...
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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #179 - Jul 26th, 2016 at 5:38am
 
Quote:
I don't believe I mentioned volume


I see. So even reading the Koran quietly to yourself could be illegal, depending on your motivation?

Quote:
about as likely as aliens landing


Well, they are not known for their competence. But it was not all that long ago, in a historical context, that they had the biggest empire the world had ever seen, and nearly destroyed all of western civilisation with it. I'm pretty sure that if the world took your approach of standing back and letting it happen, they would. For example, the middle east does not appear capable of dealing with ISIS on it's own, and Iraq is actually asking for foreign assistance. Assad possibly also. Just because they want to become matyrs does not mean it is wrong to do as they wish. Who knows what ISIS could achieve in a century or two if foreign countries kept taking your idiotic approach of deciding it is none of their business until it is knocking on their front door.

Quote:
there is no idiocy in my proposal ... that you agree with it is irrelevant unless you can suggest an alternative


Pick one (of many, there are actually plenty of them) at random and it would probably be better than yours.

Quote:
It's doesn't take a genius to say no to everything.


It certainly doesn't John.
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