Australian Politics Forum - a lot of people agree with Sonia

freediver

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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #240 - Jul 28^th, 2016 at 9:34pm

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quoting someone called Abu isn't an explanation

I explained why I did so. One more time for John: As an example of how these wars shape the opinion of modern Muslims.

Do you understand now John?

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as all christians consider jesus to be relevant .... and?

And Muslims consider the actions of Muhammed and the rightly guided Caliphs to be relevant. Despite it being up to 1400 years ago.

Do you understand now John?

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Ohh, I understand his relevance. .. what I don't understand is how you think they should stop reading about the central character in their religion.

Quote me. Wasn't it you who wanted to ban the reading of certain passages from the Koran, depending on the readers' motive?

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 74257 Gender:	Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia Reply #241 - Jul 28^th, 2016 at 11:47pm freediver wrote on Jul 28^th, 2016 at 9:34pm: Wasn't it you who wanted to ban the reading of certain passages from the Koran, depending on the readers' motive? Quote me.
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freediver

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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #242 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 12:37pm

It was only 3 days ago John, in this thread. Have you really forgotten already?

John Smith wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 8:36am:

freediver wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 5:38am:

I see. So even reading the Koran quietly to yourself could be illegal, depending on your motivation?

surely it's not to difficult for you?

John Smith wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 12:54pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 12:21pm:

I try to avoid incorporating people's motives into the rules for this forum, with good reason. I struggle to see how you could incorporate this into law.

I'll agree, it's not an easy one. But the courts consider motive all the time and they seem to do OK most of the time

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John Smith

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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #243 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 12:53pm

freediver wrote on Jul 29^th, 2016 at 12:37pm:

It was only 3 days ago John, in this thread. Have you really forgotten already

Ohh I remembered that. .. but I don't remember claiming that reading quietly to yourself was a reason to ban anyone.

You do realise that we already have laws that limit 'free speech', right?

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freediver

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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #244 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 7:08pm

Sure, just like you remembered the Caliphate invading Europe, after it was repeatedly pointed out to you, the tried to argue you dismissed it because it happened long ago, apparently forgetting the context in which it was brought up - that it happened long ago.

In any case, I have now quoted you explaining how reading from the Koran should be illegal depending on the motive of the person doing the reading, after you accused me of something similar. Perhaps you can now quote me, as I originally suggested, or admit you were wrong.

Then perhaps it is time for you to concede that the actions of Muhammed and the rightly guided Caliphs are relevant to Islam and Muslims, despite being 1400 years old.

Or do we need to go round and round in circles every time you forget your own words?

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Yadda

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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #245 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 7:34pm

'Forgetfulness', or 'not knowing' [something], ...seems for many here [when they are engaged in public debate], to be a very convenient, frequent and opportune happenstance.

/sarc off

Dictionary;
deceive = = deliberately mislead or misrepresent the truth to.

Dictionary;
inveigle = = persuade by deception or flattery.

Dictionary;
obfuscate = =
1 make unclear or unintelligible.
2 bewilder.

Dictionary;
sophistry = = the use of fallacious arguments, especially to deceive.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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John Smith

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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #246 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 8:27pm

freediver wrote on Jul 29^th, 2016 at 7:08pm:

In any case, I have now quoted you explaining how reading from the Koran should be illegal depending on the motive of the person doing the reading, after you accused me of something similar

no you didn't ... no where did I say reading from the Koran should be illegal. You really struggling today aren't you?

Your not really good at this are you? Especially since we've previously covered this Cheesy

John Smith wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2016 at 7:48pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2016 at 7:46pm:

Should we ban the Koran John?

not at all. I didn't call for anyone to be banned

I think it's you who forgets my words ... that's probably a result of a condition you seem to suffer from where you read one thing but the brain see's something completely different

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 74257 Gender:	Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia Reply #247 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 8:29pm freediver wrote on Jul 29^th, 2016 at 7:08pm: Then perhaps it is time for you to concede that the actions of Muhammed and the rightly guided Caliphs are relevant to Islam and Muslims, despite being 1400 years old. why? because you say so? that's not how this works FD
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freediver

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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #248 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 10:12pm

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no you didn't ... no where did I say reading from the Koran should be illegal.

Depending on the motivation John. Your own words remember? Do I need to quote you again, or can you refer to my previous post?

Quote:

why? because you say so? that's not how this works FD

Simple question Brian, are the actions of Muhammed relevant to Muslims, despite how long ago he lived? Don't get all confused now.

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 74257 Gender:	Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia Reply #249 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 10:13pm freediver wrote on Jul 29^th, 2016 at 10:12pm: Depending on the motivation John. Your own words remember? Do I need to quote you again, or can you refer to my previous post? please do
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freediver

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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #250 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 10:17pm

freediver wrote on Jul 29^th, 2016 at 12:37pm:

It was only 3 days ago John, in this thread. Have you really forgotten already?

John Smith wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 8:36am:

freediver wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 5:38am:

I see. So even reading the Koran quietly to yourself could be illegal, depending on your motivation?

surely it's not to difficult for you?

John Smith wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 12:54pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 12:21pm:

I try to avoid incorporating people's motives into the rules for this forum, with good reason. I struggle to see how you could incorporate this into law.

I'll agree, it's not an easy one. But the courts consider motive all the time and they seem to do OK most of the time

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John Smith

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Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia
Reply #251 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 10:35pm

freediver wrote on Jul 29^th, 2016 at 10:17pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 29^th, 2016 at 12:37pm:

It was only 3 days ago John, in this thread. Have you really forgotten already?

John Smith wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 8:36am:

freediver wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 5:38am:

I see. So even reading the Koran quietly to yourself could be illegal, depending on your motivation?

surely it's not to difficult for you?

John Smith wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 12:54pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 26^th, 2016 at 12:21pm:

I try to avoid incorporating people's motives into the rules for this forum, with good reason. I struggle to see how you could incorporate this into law.

I'll agree, it's not an easy one. But the courts consider motive all the time and they seem to do OK most of the time

can you highlight the bit where I asked to ban the koran ... I'm struggling to find it.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 48834 At my desk.	Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia Reply #252 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 10:38pm Sure, right after you highlight the bit where I said you did. Are the actions of Muhammed relevant to Muslims, despite how long ago he lived? Don't get all confused now.
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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 74257 Gender:	Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia Reply #253 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 10:42pm freediver wrote on Jul 29^th, 2016 at 10:38pm: Sure, right after you highlight the bit where I said you did. Ok, I'll rephrase .. can you highlight where I said reading the Koran should be illegal?
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 48834 At my desk.	Re: a lot of people agree with Sonia Reply #254 - Jul 29^th, 2016 at 10:45pm Depending on the motivation John. Do try to keep up. They are your words, after all. Are the actions of Muhammed relevant to Muslims, despite how long ago he lived? Don't get all confused now.
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