Australian Politics Forum - What is racism?

freediver

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #705 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 5:32am:

freediver wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 7:49pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 7:31pm:

freediver wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 7:18pm:

Does he suggest they share religious views?

obviously.

It seems like you are sizing up for a false dichotomy. Do you think its unheard of for ethnicities and/or cultures to share the same religious views? Does an ethnicity or culture with shared religious views suddenly stop being an ethnicity or culture?

freediver wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 7:18pm:

Is Islam is a race as far as your definition of racism goes?

Rather than just keep repeating it ad infinitum, try and compose a question that actually makes sense, and actually has something to do with what I've been explaining.

To get you started, try and understand that an ideology or religion can't be a group of people - usually a group of people is some kind of group of people.

You accuse Moses of turning criticism of Islam into a racist thing. But the only racial aspect of it that you can identify is Islam. That is the only 'ethno-cultural' aspect to Moses' cricism.

Absolute rubbish.

I accuse moses of turning criticism of muslims into a racist thing. Huge difference. Because he depicts them as inferior using a broad-brush of racial markers (100% are inbred, low intelligence, psychopathic killers etc).

Criticism of Islam itself is not racist, and is perfectly acceptable - as I have explained many times.

What is a "racial marker" Gandalf? Is it something a Muslim uses to turn a non-racist statement into a racist one? If intelligence is a marker, does that mean it is racist to say that doctors are intelligent? Why do you always run away from explaining what you mean by this?

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 5:37am:

Karnal wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 8:44pm:

How is describing Muslims as an inbred, retarded subspecies who squat down to piss and play with their dicks afterwards a criticism of Islam, FD?

Its not. FD has suddenly turned the conversation from racist descriptions of muslims into criticism of Islam, so he can resort to his favourite "Islam isn't a race" meme. Just one problem though - no one else is talking about criticism of Islam.

Who invented the subspecies story Gandalf?

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Karnal

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #706 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 11:51am

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 5:32am:

freediver wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 7:49pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 7:31pm:

freediver wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 7:18pm:

Does he suggest they share religious views?

obviously.

It seems like you are sizing up for a false dichotomy. Do you think its unheard of for ethnicities and/or cultures to share the same religious views? Does an ethnicity or culture with shared religious views suddenly stop being an ethnicity or culture?

freediver wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 7:18pm:

Is Islam is a race as far as your definition of racism goes?

Rather than just keep repeating it ad infinitum, try and compose a question that actually makes sense, and actually has something to do with what I've been explaining.

To get you started, try and understand that an ideology or religion can't be a group of people - usually a group of people is some kind of group of people.

You accuse Moses of turning criticism of Islam into a racist thing. But the only racial aspect of it that you can identify is Islam. That is the only 'ethno-cultural' aspect to Moses' cricism.

Absolute rubbish.

I accuse moses of turning criticism of muslims into a racist thing. Huge difference. Because he depicts them as inferior using a broad-brush of racial markers (100% are inbred, low intelligence, psychopathic killers etc).

Criticism of Islam itself is not racist, and is perfectly acceptable - as I have explained many times.

What is a "racial marker" Gandalf? Is it something a Muslim uses to turn a non-racist statement into a racist one? If intelligence is a marker, does that mean it is racist to say that doctors are intelligent? Why do you always run away from explaining what you mean by this?

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 5:37am:

Karnal wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 8:44pm:

How is describing Muslims as an inbred, retarded subspecies who squat down to piss and play with their dicks afterwards a criticism of Islam, FD?

Its not. FD has suddenly turned the conversation from racist descriptions of muslims into criticism of Islam, so he can resort to his favourite "Islam isn't a race" meme. Just one problem though - no one else is talking about criticism of Islam.

Who invented the subspecies story Gandalf?

Don't want to say, eh? No worries. I have more.

Is your "sustainability" party a cunning way to try to keep out the tinted races?

Is your "criticism of Islam" a euphemism for your deep-seated racism?

Is your defence of Moses' views an acknowledgement that, like Herb and the old boy, you have come out as a racist?

Thanks, FD. I look forward to an interesting discussion of your views.

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Frank

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #707 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 12:05pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 7:07pm:

Moses ascribes ethno-cultural attributes to muslims in order to vilify them in a racist manner.

Mohammed ascribed ethno-cultural attributes to Jews and infidels in order to vilify them in a racist manner.

But Muslims regard him as god's last prophet and the best of men and so they emulate him to this day.

How can that be???

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Aussie Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 38808 Gender:	Re: What is racism? Reply #708 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 2:57pm Lord Herbert wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 6:18am: Racism is NOT refusing a smelly, unwashed aborigine a motel room because he's black. And what would NOT refusing a smelly, black tent wearing, see eyes only a Motel Room be because they were a smelly, black tent wearing, see eyes only person?
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kemal

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #709 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 4:00pm

kemal wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 6:52pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 6:46pm:

freediver wrote on Feb 4^th, 2017 at 6:22pm:

Were you actually giving us a tautology when you said all Islamophobia is based on racism?

No. But happy to give you a lesson in English grammar.

That would be like saying 'ice is based on water' is a tautology. Which its not. No phrase that explains the nature of something (ie "x is based on y") can be tautological.

The tautology you're probably thinking of is something like "Islamophobic racism". But its still not really a tautology - as not all racism is Islamophobic, and therefore specifying that one particular kind of racism is Islamophobic is not redundant.

So following on from your lecture, Why does Islam/Muslims suffer from Hinduophobia?

So following on from your lecture, Why does Islam/Muslims suffer from Hinduophobia?

Any comment Gandalf?

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Brian Ross on why Muslims kill Quote:-" It appears to be a cultural thing, rather than something they have learnt from their religion, despite what you appear to believe."

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polite_gandalf

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #710 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 5:49pm

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

What is a "racial marker" Gandalf? Is it something a Muslim uses to turn a non-racist statement into a racist one?

Tell me FD, do you reckon muslims are the only people who would consider the statement in my signature racist? And do you think anyone who considers it racist is necessarily involved in some sinister conspiracy to deflect attention away from criticism of Islam?

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

If intelligence is a marker, does that mean it is racist to say that doctors are intelligent?

doctors are not an ethno-cultural group, as I've mentioned before. They are a profession.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Lord Herbert

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #711 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 7:30pm

Aussie wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 2:57pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 6:18am:

Racism is NOT refusing a smelly, unwashed aborigine a motel room because he's black.

And what would NOT refusing a smelly, black tent wearing, see eyes only a Motel Room be because they were a smelly, black tent wearing, see eyes only person?

They're not smelly.

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Aussie

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #712 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:17pm

Lord Herbert wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 7:30pm:

Aussie wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 2:57pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 6:18am:

Racism is NOT refusing a smelly, unwashed aborigine a motel room because he's black.

And what would NOT refusing a smelly, black tent wearing, see eyes only a Motel Room be because they were a smelly, black tent wearing, see eyes only person?

They're not smelly.

"Your face is smelly."

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Karnal

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #713 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 9:04pm

Aussie wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 2:57pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 6:18am:

Racism is NOT refusing a smelly, unwashed aborigine a motel room because he's black.

And what would NOT refusing a smelly, black tent wearing, see eyes only a Motel Room be because they were a smelly, black tent wearing, see eyes only person?

Not racist, Aussie. Smelly Boongs and see eyes only are not a race.

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Karnal

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #714 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 9:08pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 5:49pm:

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

What is a "racial marker" Gandalf? Is it something a Muslim uses to turn a non-racist statement into a racist one?

Tell me FD, do you reckon muslims are the only people who would consider the statement in my signature racist? And do you think anyone who considers it racist is necessarily involved in some sinister conspiracy to deflect attention away from criticism of Islam?

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

If intelligence is a marker, does that mean it is racist to say that doctors are intelligent?

doctors are not an ethno-cultural group, as I've mentioned before. They are a profession.

Ah yes, I should have known. Doctors are not a race.

This clearly vindicates Moses and FD's stance on the Musel issue.

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Frank

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #715 - Feb 5^th, 2017 at 9:14pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 5:49pm:

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

What is a "racial marker" Gandalf? Is it something a Muslim uses to turn a non-racist statement into a racist one?

Tell me FD, do you reckon muslims are the only people who would consider the statement in my signature racist? And do you think anyone who considers it racist is necessarily involved in some sinister conspiracy to deflect attention away from criticism of Islam?

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

If intelligence is a marker, does that mean it is racist to say that doctors are intelligent?

doctors are not an ethno-cultural group, as I've mentioned before. They are a profession.

The Comparison of Mean IQ in Muslim and Non-Muslim CountriesDonald I. Templer

Abstract
The present research found that the Muslim country mean IQ of 81 is half a standard deviation below the mean IQ of non-Muslim nations and is not related to strength of Muslim culture as defined by the percentage of Muslims in the country. The mean IQ of 84 in Arab countries is not associated with per capita income and is incompatible with the intellectual achievements of the golden age of the Muslim Empire. Possible explanations for this decline include hybridization with sub-Saharan Africans, dysgenic decrease in the more educated Muslims employing birth control as suggested by Meisenberg, the Muslim religion not fostering critical thinking, and the intellectual contributions being both exaggerated and made by non-Muslims.

Ahem..... Islam tends to make you thick, in other words.

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Karnal

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #716 - Feb 6^th, 2017 at 12:23am

Frank wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 9:14pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 5:49pm:

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

What is a "racial marker" Gandalf? Is it something a Muslim uses to turn a non-racist statement into a racist one?

Tell me FD, do you reckon muslims are the only people who would consider the statement in my signature racist? And do you think anyone who considers it racist is necessarily involved in some sinister conspiracy to deflect attention away from criticism of Islam?

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

If intelligence is a marker, does that mean it is racist to say that doctors are intelligent?

doctors are not an ethno-cultural group, as I've mentioned before. They are a profession.

The Comparison of Mean IQ in Muslim and Non-Muslim CountriesDonald I. Templer

Abstract
The present research found that the Muslim country mean IQ of 81 is half a standard deviation below the mean IQ of non-Muslim nations and is not related to strength of Muslim culture as defined by the percentage of Muslims in the country. The mean IQ of 84 in Arab countries is not associated with per capita income and is incompatible with the intellectual achievements of the golden age of the Muslim Empire. Possible explanations for this decline include hybridization with sub-Saharan Africans, dysgenic decrease in the more educated Muslims employing birth control as suggested by Meisenberg, the Muslim religion not fostering critical thinking, and the intellectual contributions being both exaggerated and made by non-Muslims.

Ahem..... Islam tends to make you thick, in other words.

Here you go, FD. Scientific, innit.

Freud on Man's Soul, no?

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polite_gandalf

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #717 - Feb 6^th, 2017 at 8:58am

Frank wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 9:14pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 5:49pm:

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

What is a "racial marker" Gandalf? Is it something a Muslim uses to turn a non-racist statement into a racist one?

Tell me FD, do you reckon muslims are the only people who would consider the statement in my signature racist? And do you think anyone who considers it racist is necessarily involved in some sinister conspiracy to deflect attention away from criticism of Islam?

freediver wrote on Feb 5^th, 2017 at 8:51am:

If intelligence is a marker, does that mean it is racist to say that doctors are intelligent?

doctors are not an ethno-cultural group, as I've mentioned before. They are a profession.

The Comparison of Mean IQ in Muslim and Non-Muslim CountriesDonald I. Templer

Abstract
The present research found that the Muslim country mean IQ of 81 is half a standard deviation below the mean IQ of non-Muslim nations and is not related to strength of Muslim culture as defined by the percentage of Muslims in the country. The mean IQ of 84 in Arab countries is not associated with per capita income and is incompatible with the intellectual achievements of the golden age of the Muslim Empire. Possible explanations for this decline include hybridization with sub-Saharan Africans, dysgenic decrease in the more educated Muslims employing birth control as suggested by Meisenberg, the Muslim religion not fostering critical thinking, and the intellectual contributions being both exaggerated and made by non-Muslims.

Ahem..... Islam tends to make you thick, in other words.

You are quoting a well-known racist who believes negroes are intellectually deficient because of their genes. If you read the whole article, you'll see that of these "possible explanations" he actually argues against the one you highlighted - noting that "the strength of muslim culture does not seem very relevant to the IQ differences" and concluding that "It is here suggested that genetic factors are more important than economic/religious/cultural variables" - in explaining the IQ differences in arabs and muslims.

No, for old fashioned racists like Templer, it comes down to genetics, and his explanation is a far less nuanced one - simply that muslims became dumber once they started interbreeding with the inferior negroes.

So no, Islam doesn't tend to make you thick - according to Templar, interbreeding with inferior negroids makes you thick.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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freediver

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Re: What is racism?
Reply #718 - Feb 6^th, 2017 at 6:42pm

Gandalf, would it be fair to say that you have still not come up with a coherent definition of racism and that your efforts to racialise criticism of Islam actually compel you to muddy the waters as much as possible?

Quote:

Tell me FD, do you reckon muslims are the only people who would consider the statement in my signature racist?

I expect there is a reason you only included half the sentence - the same reason why you put far more effort into "interpreting" what Moses says.

Quote:

And do you think anyone who considers it racist is necessarily involved in some sinister conspiracy to deflect attention away from criticism of Islam?

I think they are doing their best with half a sentence.

Quote:

doctors are not an ethno-cultural group, as I've mentioned before. They are a profession.

Neither are Muslims. Islam is a religion, remember. You can actually choose to become a Muslim far easier than you can choose to become a doctor. Remember, you are the one who insisted that "fake" racial grouping are equally legitimate for constructing racism. You have even conceded before that doctors could be such a grouping, when you were banging on about markers. Of course, you change your mind regularly, and you seem to have dropped the BS about markers completely.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Aussie Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 38808 Gender:	Re: What is racism? Reply #719 - Feb 6^th, 2017 at 6:52pm Quote: Gandalf, would it be fair to say that you have still not come up with a coherent definition of racism ...... How about you FD? Have you?
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Poll
Question: Is the statement is my signature racist?
yes 5 (55.6%) no 3 (33.3%) depends 1 (11.1%) don't know 0 (0.0%) Total votes: 9 « Created by: polite_gandalf on: Jan 29^th, 2017 at 9:05am »