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Fastest rate of climate warming on record (Read 1864 times)
Pho Huc
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Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Dec 22nd, 2016 at 9:38pm
 
The global climate is currently heating at a rate greater than any recorded history.

...

...


Its not so much the temperature levels which justify my opinions, rather its the rate the temperature is increasing.

During historical warming periods the temperature increased at a rate of .8-1.4 ddC per thousand years.

In the last 100 years the RECORDED average temperature has increased .7 dgC

This is 5-10 times faster than has been recorded at ANY time in the past.

Given that instead of a since the system is heating up at a speed an order of magnitude greater than any in all of history, maybe something slightly different is happening.


Derived from.
https://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/pubs/mann2008/mann2008.html




The only plausible driver for a temperature increase at this rate is GHG's.

...
The graph shows different wavelengths of energy, measured at the Earth’s surface. Among the spikes you can see energy being radiated back to Earth by ozone (O3), methane (CH4), and nitrous oxide (N20). But the spike for CO2 on the left dwarfs all the other greenhouse gases, and tells us something very important: most of the energy being trapped in the atmosphere corresponds exactly to the wavelength of energy captured by CO2.


http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v410/n6826/abs/410355a0.html

https://ams.confex.com/ams/Annual2006/techprogram/paper_100737.htm





Three totally separate peer reviewed articles, supporting two clear concise statements.

Please note, all these papers are based on empirical data.

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« Last Edit: Dec 22nd, 2016 at 10:14pm by Pho Huc »  

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Bobby.
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #1 - Dec 22nd, 2016 at 10:02pm
 
dear Huc,

I suggest you read the Ice Age thread:

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1464603948/1080#1080

It's getting colder not hotter.
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Unforgiven
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #2 - Dec 22nd, 2016 at 10:24pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Dec 22nd, 2016 at 10:02pm:
dear Huc,

I suggest you read the Ice Age thread:

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1464603948/1080#1080

It's getting colder not hotter.


As usual Bobby; you are upside down and back to front.
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lee
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #3 - Dec 22nd, 2016 at 11:23pm
 
Yeah, Pho Huc believes in the Michael E Mann hockeystick.
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Pho Huc
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #4 - Dec 22nd, 2016 at 11:53pm
 
I believe data, until superior data is presented.

Present data or shut up Lee Wink
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #5 - Dec 23rd, 2016 at 8:33pm
 
Pho Huc wrote on Dec 22nd, 2016 at 11:53pm:
I believe data, until superior data is presented.



The only data is for a period of less than 150 years. The rest is proxy with attendant error bars. Any long term graph will have sharp spikes lost, if of short duration.
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #6 - Dec 23rd, 2016 at 8:42pm
 
Matched by the fastest rate of denial on record by denizen lee devoid of fact.
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Pho Huc
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #7 - Dec 23rd, 2016 at 9:49pm
 
lee wrote on Dec 23rd, 2016 at 8:33pm:
Pho Huc wrote on Dec 22nd, 2016 at 11:53pm:
I believe data, until superior data is presented.



The only data is for a period of less than 150 years. The rest is proxy with attendant error bars. Any long term graph will have sharp spikes lost, if of short duration.


Thats a very long winded way of stating that no, You do not have anything better.
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #8 - Dec 23rd, 2016 at 10:07pm
 
Pho Huc wrote on Dec 23rd, 2016 at 9:49pm:
Thats a very long winded way of stating that no, You do not have anything better.



The onus is on the proposer to overturn the null hypothesis. You don't understand do you?

"The paleoclimate record combined with global models shows past ice ages as well as periods even warmer than today."

http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Features/GlobalWarming/page3.php

Oh ,no. Those global model that don't work well. That don't model clouds well, that don't model water vapour well, that don't hindcast well; but somehow they come to a valid conclusion.

"The predicted rate of warming for the next century is at least 20 times faster. This rate of change is extremely unusual."

ibid

Unusual? Not unprecedented? Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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Pho Huc
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #9 - Dec 23rd, 2016 at 11:11pm
 
So what is your null proposal?
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #10 - Dec 23rd, 2016 at 11:16pm
 
Pho Huc wrote on Dec 23rd, 2016 at 11:11pm:
So what is your null proposal?



It is not MY "null hypothesis". The null hypothesis is natural variation.
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #11 - Dec 23rd, 2016 at 11:23pm
 
I guess its a bastard hypothesis then  Grin
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #12 - Dec 24th, 2016 at 2:45pm
 
Pho Huc wrote on Dec 23rd, 2016 at 11:23pm:
I guess its a bastard hypothesis then  Grin



perhaps you would like to read this?

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2015/10/03/did-james-hansen-unwittingly-prove-the-nu...

You know of James Hansen, father of AGW?

or this-

"This essay addresses Trenberth’s statement that ‘Given that global warming is ‘‘unequivocal’’, and is ‘‘very likely’’ due to human activities to quote t he 2007 IPCC report, the null hypothesis should now be reversed, thereby placing the burden of proof on showing that there is no human influence.’ We examine how the concept of a null hypothesis is being used implicitly and explicitly in the scientific and policy debate on climate change, in the context of scientific hypothesis testing, as a framework for ‘burden of proof’ arguments and policy deliberations, and metaphorically in the context of a polemic. "

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/wcc.141/pdf

From the preview of the article. Note Kevin Trenberth wants to overturn the null hypothesis, and it hasn't been. Therefore the null hypothesis is still natural variation.

Judith Curry is a lukewarmist, which doesn't suit the CAGW crowd.

So sad you don't seem to research. Other than look at papers with which you agree.

Commonly known as confirmation bias.
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Pho Huc
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #13 - Dec 24th, 2016 at 7:14pm
 
You may have noticed that I do repeatedly ask you for papers that disagree with my stated position.

If you post it I will shut up.


Its not my fault I can't find evidence to support your argument when you can't provide any evidence supporting your argument either!
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Pho Huc
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Re: Fastest rate of climate warming on record
Reply #14 - Dec 24th, 2016 at 7:26pm
 
lee wrote on Dec 24th, 2016 at 2:45pm:
[quote author=deepideas link=1482406731/11#11 date=1482499429]I

From the preview of the article. Note Kevin Trenberth wants to overturn the null hypothesis, and it hasn't been. Therefore the null hypothesis is still natural variation.


Oh-i'm sorry the the world council of null hypothesis definitions isn't going to change there mind. Hilariously, arguing with me about this fine philosophical point is the closest you have ever been to actually supporting your position.

I can't grant you the point however because the paper your paper was actually written in support of my position, and wasn't written because of any actual scientific reason but more so for the sole purpose of removing this very argument from the denialists repertoire.   
The fact that there was no change as a result of this speak more to the inertia of scientific opinion, and also indicates that scientists have found the evidence supporting global warming while operating in a transparent open framework.

I do appreciate you posting a real paper(even if it is another one supporting AGW)
it's good to actually talk about something with some real thought behind it !
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« Last Edit: Dec 24th, 2016 at 9:45pm by Pho Huc »  

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