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Forced marriage being ignored (Read 6514 times)
mothra
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #75 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:13pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:11pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:08pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:58pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:51pm:
What sort of parent forces a young girl into marriage with an older man?


Forced marriage (which is different to under age marriage NB Greggy and co troll buddy were only enlightened about this by me an hour ago)......well surprise surprise...we're talking MUSLIMS.

YEP MUSLIMS.


THIS TOPIC IS ON FORCED MARRIAGE.

NOT

UNDER AGE MARRIAGE

WHICH ARE 2 DIFFERENT THINGS.

FORCED MARRIAGE IS A ...




... big problem within the Christian right.


Indeed. Girls are sometimes forced to marry their rapists.

In the US, it's girls as young as 11. Legally.
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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.
 
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greggerypeccary
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #76 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:14pm
 

"Report: Child And Forced Marriage In U.S. Linked To Religion"

"The extensive report documents the shocking and often hidden reality of child and forced marriage in America.

"While many Americans may believe that child and forced marriage is something that happens to women in desperate third world countries, the fact is many American women and girls are forced or coerced into marriage

"The first part of the two-part series examines domestic cases of child and forced marriage, which often involve fundamentalist and isolated Christian sects."


Oh dear.

Why do Lisa and Hammer condone this sort of thing?
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Mr Hammer
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #77 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:14pm
 
Forced marriage an emerging problem in Australia despite laws, welfare groups say

By Liz Hobday 

Updated 23 Jul 2014, 10:33pm

Related Story: Former Victorian premier calls for ban on marriage dowries

Hundreds of women in Australia are still being forced into marriage despite the practice being made illegal just over a year ago, Victorian welfare groups have said.

Laws passed by the Labor government in 2013 made it illegal to coerce, threaten or deceive someone into marriage.

And while Victorian authorities have yet to prosecute anyone under the new laws, forced marriage has been described as an emerging problem in Australia and many cases are thought to go unreported.

Meanwhile, a report from Plan International Australia has found there were 250 cases of children being forced into marriage in the past two years.

The charity said it was difficult to say whether the marriages were taking place in Australia, or if they were being flown to other countries for the ceremony then returning home, because it is largely under-reported.

Two years ago a 16-year-old Afghan refugee, who wants to be known as Ayan because she fears for her safety, was flown to Pakistan for a family holiday and forced to marry a man whom she had never met.

"When I went there everything just happened so quickly," she said.

"When I signed the marriage paper I had no knowledge of the fact that it was the marriage paper."




I was a shame to them. I was going to be ostracised.

She did not speak the same dialect as her husband so they could not communicate.

She was kept in Pakistan for four months.

"For that period of time it was just torture for me because no one was listening to me."

Ayan is now divorced, but only after a stand-off with her family that lasted years.

"I was a shame to them. I was going to be ostracised," she said.

"Usually what happens is the parent will take the girl overseas and the expectation is that the girl will return being married.

"It was the first time ever in my family anyone had refused like I did."

"But that didn't really matter because I knew that one day my parents would look at me and thank me for not letting them destroy my soul."

Girls to be taught forced marriage is wrong

The welfare group Good Shepherd regularly sees victims of forced marriage at its offices in Melbourne, mostly women dealing with domestic violence.

Good Shepherd chief executive officer Robyn Roberts said it was an emerging problem.

"It's really hard for us to understand at this stage the scope and scale of forced marriage in Australia," Ms Roberts said.

"But certainly anecdotal evidence is suggesting that it's prevalent in the community."

The federal police have investigated more than a dozen cases of forced marriage, most involving teenage girls.

Under Commonwealth legislation introduced a year ago, those involved in organising a forced marriage, including family members and wedding planners, face up to seven years in jail if convicted.

In New South Wales a 62-year-old man is due to stand trial accused of consenting to the marriage of his 12-year-old daughter.

It is alleged the man consented to his daughter's religious marriage to a 26-year-old Lebanese national and they were illegally married by a Muslim cleric in the lounge room of the father's home in January.




We know that it's grossly under-reported and many of these types of incidents occur within a family environment.

Superintendent Rod Jouning, Victoria Police



In Victoria, police have yet to lay any charges under the new laws, but Victoria Police Superintendent Rod Jouning said several cases had been investigated.

"We know that it's grossly under-reported and many of these types of incidents occur within a family environment," he said.

Victoria Police is developing a state-wide training program so officers can tackle the problem.

"It hasn't started yet but it will do and hopefully will cover every member of this organisation," Superintendent Jouning said.

The police training program will be rolled out later this year.

It is a move Ayan would welcome.

She said more education is needed so that victims of forced marriage realise that what is happened to them is wrong.

"With the culture we are supposed to be docile. We are supposed to listen to our parents because they are older and know what's best for us," she said.

"But I felt [it was] very wrong. Like how is it right to force me to sleep in the same room with someone who I hardly know and can't speak to?"
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Lisa Jones
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #78 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:15pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:07pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:58pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:51pm:
What sort of parent forces a young girl into marriage with an older man?


Forced marriage (which is different to under age marriage NB Greggy and co troll buddy were only enlightened about this by me an hour ago)......well surprise surprise...we're talking MUSLIMS.

YEP MUSLIMS.


Actually, it's....


Muslims. That's right. Muslims.

And all you've achieved today is waste an entire day trolling under various nics spamming every topic you've infected.....with unsubstantiated and off topic dribble.

This topic is yet another prime example where you've demonstrated your inability to understand the topic title ie FORCED MARRIAGE.

You still seem to think it means under age marriage.

Even though you've been told they're not.

Eise vlakas!

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)
 
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greggerypeccary
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #79 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:18pm
 
mothra wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:13pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:11pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:08pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:58pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:51pm:
What sort of parent forces a young girl into marriage with an older man?


Forced marriage (which is different to under age marriage NB Greggy and co troll buddy were only enlightened about this by me an hour ago)......well surprise surprise...we're talking MUSLIMS.

YEP MUSLIMS.


THIS TOPIC IS ON FORCED MARRIAGE.

NOT

UNDER AGE MARRIAGE

WHICH ARE 2 DIFFERENT THINGS.

FORCED MARRIAGE IS A ...




... big problem within the Christian right.


Indeed. Girls are sometimes forced to marry their rapists.

In the US, it's girls as young as 11. Legally.


Dear oh dear.

And Lisa and Hammer condone this sort of thing?

Why?

"Lyndsy Duet, now a school counselor in Texas, told me that she was forced into a marriage at 17 after enduring a series of rapes beginning when she was 14, by a young man her conservative Christian family had taken into the house."

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Mr Hammer
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #80 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:18pm
 

Pecca Breath and Mothra need to be educated.

Arranged Marriages and Dowry


We are all familiar with the story : boy meets girl, boy falls in love with girl, boy and girl gets married. For the majority of the western world, this is our ideal of a great beginning to a perfect marriage. It is important to realize that while India is very modernized in some aspects (i.e.. they lead the world in student's math and science scores and produce the largest amount of engineers in the world) they still keep to the tradition of arranged marriages. Marriages formed out of love AKA "love marriages" do happen in India but it is not the norm. It is an accepted fact that a person's family will play a role in picking the marriage partner.

While to many people raised in the west, this might sound odd. It is important to remember that in Indian society an arranged marriage is seen as an act of love. Since marriage is one of the most important decisions a person will ever make and because divorce is not accepted among most Indians, it is imperative that the marriage choice is carefully thought out and planned. How can a young person make such an important decision on his/her own? Instead, the family (usually the parents) look for certain traits in a marriage partner. Some desirable traits looked for in both male and female are: matching levels of education, matching cultures, close parental cities, matching religions, and matching vegetarians/non-vegetarians just to name a few.

Potential bride-grooms come under close scrutiny for several areas of the matching process. Do they have enough means to support the bride? Do they appear to be men who will make good husbands and fathers? Often, the bride will live with her in-laws after marriage in what is called a joint family. Because of this, the groom's family is also brought under close scrutiny. Do the women of the household seem well cared for? Do they have a big enough house for another person and grandchildren? Does the family have a good reputation?

Potential brides also come under scrutiny by the boy's parents. Since it is a commonly held belief that brides are the embodiment of that family's honor and pride, the girl must be from good family and have good manners. She should be respectable and have no taint on her name. Does she have the makings of a good wife and mother? Does she want to work after marriage or stay at home? There are so many factors to weigh, that I can not list them all.

Often, this turns into an interview process where photos are provided of the boy/girl in question along with bio-data about his/her life and family. If that meets with approval, arrangements will be made for the parents to meet the boy/girl and their family. Traditionally, however, the bride and groom would not even see each other until the day of their wedding. Today, while most marriages are still arranged, times are changing. There is usually a small courtship period where the bride and groom can meet and talk under the careful watch of a guardian. Also, if either one of the two do not want the marriage, it is likely to be cancelled. Very few family's today "force" marriages upon their children.

Of course, with any society, you have those people who just will not adapt and change. There are places in India where time has not moved forward. For those people, they carry on their lives as their parents have and their grandparents before them. Shockingly, there are still some forced marriages and child brides.

Which brings me to the issue of the dowry system....yes, folks it still exists. Now before you make that grimace of distaste, let me tell you a little about it. The dowry system has been in place since before the written record and it has been used by parents in every country imaginable, including America in older times. The point of the dowry system was to provide for the bride should something unfortunate occur with her husband such as death or divorce. As you can probably imagine, daughters can be extremely expensive offspring. Parents had/have to make a mad scramble to get enough wealth and material goods together to see their daughter well taken care of by the time she is of marriageable age. In Northern India, today this age can vary from 18-25 though exceptions do apply depending on socio-economic factors.

As you can see, the dowry system was something originally honorable in intention and provided for the independent wealth of the bride in a time when she was unlikely to work outside of the home. Like many customs and traditions, time can alter their original meaning and purpose. While the dowry system is still in place, it has become more of a "bride-price" system. The parents of a baby girl must come up with a respectable dowry (the term respectable is arbitrary, respectable dowry can be anything from $50 worth of material goods to $50,000 or more worth of material goods depending on the family's standing in society). If a good dowry is not made, the girl is unlikely to have a "good" match. This again, is mostly arbitrary. A good match for a very poor family might be marriage of their daughter into a slightly better financed family or a good match for a middle income family might be finding a husband that is a doctor or engineer. As you have probably guessed, there are very few brides who actually retain their dowry after marriage.
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mothra
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #81 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:18pm
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:15pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:07pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:58pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:51pm:
What sort of parent forces a young girl into marriage with an older man?


Forced marriage (which is different to under age marriage NB Greggy and co troll buddy were only enlightened about this by me an hour ago)......well surprise surprise...we're talking MUSLIMS.

YEP MUSLIMS.


Actually, it's....


Muslims. That's right. Muslims.

And all you've achieved today is waste an entire day trolling under various nics spamming every topic you've infected.....with unsubstantiated and off topic dribble.

This topic is yet another prime example where you've demonstrated your inability to understand the topic title ie FORCED MARRIAGE.

You still seem to think it means under age marriage.

Even though you've been told they're not.

Eise vlakas!





Nope. The majority are Christians.

Tell me Lisa, do you consider a person under 18 capable of consenting to marriage?

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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.
 
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mothra
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #82 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:19pm
 
Oh joy. We've hit spam-a-lot.
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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.
 
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Mr Hammer
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #83 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:20pm
 
mothra wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:18pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:15pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:07pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:58pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:51pm:
What sort of parent forces a young girl into marriage with an older man?


Forced marriage (which is different to under age marriage NB Greggy and co troll buddy were only enlightened about this by me an hour ago)......well surprise surprise...we're talking MUSLIMS.

YEP MUSLIMS.


Actually, it's....


Muslims. That's right. Muslims.

And all you've achieved today is waste an entire day trolling under various nics spamming every topic you've infected.....with unsubstantiated and off topic dribble.

This topic is yet another prime example where you've demonstrated your inability to understand the topic title ie FORCED MARRIAGE.

You still seem to think it means under age marriage.

Even though you've been told they're not.

Eise vlakas!





mothra- Nope. The majority are Christians.



Here? rubbish!

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greggerypeccary
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #84 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:20pm
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:15pm:
You still seem to think it means under age marriage.




Up!   For Lisa.

"Report: Child And Forced Marriage In U.S. Linked To Religion"

"The extensive report documents the shocking and often hidden reality of child and forced marriage in America.

"While many Americans may believe that child and forced marriage is something that happens to women in desperate third world countries, the fact is many American women and girls are forced or coerced into marriage. 

"The first part of the two-part series examines domestic cases of child and forced marriage, which often involve fundamentalist and isolated Christian sects."


Dear oh dear.

You're not condoning these forced Christian marriages, are you Lisa?
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Mr Hammer
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #85 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:21pm
 
Reasons for it- dowry system and inheritance. Suck on it Pecca Breath.
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Lisa Jones
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #86 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:21pm
 
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:55pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:54pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:51pm:
What sort of parent forces a young girl into marriage with an older man?


Australian-born Christians, apparently.

"The majority of 15- to 17-year-olds married or in a de facto marriage were born in Australia. Of those who identified as married, 57 per cent identified as Christian ... "
What's that piece of crap you downloaded. It doesn't make sense.


The nutter has given you bits of stats for Australia.....which is fine as this topic pertains to Australia. BUT the stats he's giving you are in fact on UNDER AGE MARRIAGE NOT FORCED MARRIAGE....in Australia.

2 completely different things.

He's once again attempting to blur the details so as to deceive you/make it "appear" that it's not a Muslim issue....which everyone knows that it is.
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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)
 
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mothra
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #87 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:22pm
 
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:20pm:
mothra wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:18pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:15pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:07pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:58pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:51pm:
What sort of parent forces a young girl into marriage with an older man?


Forced marriage (which is different to under age marriage NB Greggy and co troll buddy were only enlightened about this by me an hour ago)......well surprise surprise...we're talking MUSLIMS.

YEP MUSLIMS.


Actually, it's....


Muslims. That's right. Muslims.

And all you've achieved today is waste an entire day trolling under various nics spamming every topic you've infected.....with unsubstantiated and off topic dribble.

This topic is yet another prime example where you've demonstrated your inability to understand the topic title ie FORCED MARRIAGE.

You still seem to think it means under age marriage.

Even though you've been told they're not.

Eise vlakas!





mothra- Nope. The majority are Christians.



Here? rubbish!




Nope. Quite true.


mothra wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 1:02pm:
The analysis of 2011 census data by KPMG Demographics reveals under-age marriage in Australia is not confined to any particular religion or community.

The majority of 15- to 17-year-olds married or in a de facto marriage were born in Australia. Of those who identified as married, 57 per cent identified as Christian and 6 per cent were Muslim. About 30 per cent did not state their religion or identified as no religion.


http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/legal-affairs/underage-marriage-in-remo...


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greggerypeccary
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #88 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:22pm
 

"Lyndsy Duet, now a school counselor in Texas, told me that she was forced into a marriage at 17 after enduring a series of rapes beginning when she was 14, by a young man her conservative Christian family had taken into the house."

Dear oh dear.

Lisa and Hammer think this is okay?

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mothra
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Re: Forced marriage being ignored
Reply #89 - Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:22pm
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 4:21pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:55pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:54pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 5th, 2017 at 3:51pm:
What sort of parent forces a young girl into marriage with an older man?


Australian-born Christians, apparently.

"The majority of 15- to 17-year-olds married or in a de facto marriage were born in Australia. Of those who identified as married, 57 per cent identified as Christian ... "
What's that piece of crap you downloaded. It doesn't make sense.


The nutter has given you bits of stats for Australia.....which is fine as this topic pertains to Australia. BUT the stats he's giving you are in fact on UNDER AGE MARRIAGE NOT FORCED MARRIAGE....in Australia.

2 completely different things.

He's once again attempting to blur the details so as to deceive you/make it "appear" that it's not a Muslim issue....which everyone knows that it is.




Are you seriously suggesting that a 15 year old can consent to marriage Lisa?

Seriously?
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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.
 
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