Australian Politics Forum - Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship

Aussie

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Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship
Reply #30 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:46pm

cods wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:43pm:

Francis wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:35pm:

Hi cods, before becoming a member of parliament they complete necessary paperwork and one of the questions is are they a dual citizen.
It's expected they take the time too find out. Some still believe it's a important job and respect our laws.

Others it would seem do not

Obviously events are showing they can't be trusted and we need independent audited background checks before we let anyone in

honestly francis I disagree if I was born ion Tamworth and had not applied for citizenship of any other country... I would automatically say NO to that question...

why on earth would you think otherwise.....

my youngest grandson was born in NZ to Australian parents.....they immediately had him made and Australian citiz is he also classified as a NZ citz....if he ever went for parliament he would have to look wouldnt he..

its ridiculous....our rules are not francis....

what I am saying is for another country to just do that without notifying any one.....is bizarre..

Rubbish, cods. You are a POM. Do you reckon it has never dawned on your kids that, as a consequence, they may have some (whatever slender) right to UK citizenship?

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Bobby. Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 103329 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship Reply #31 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:46pm Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 3:15pm: If the drunken idiot renounced his NZ citizenship he was clearly in breach of the dual citizenship provision of the constitution. You're wrong. The constitution talked about being a British subject not an Australian citizen.
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Aussie

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Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship
Reply #32 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:47pm

Bobby. wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:46pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 3:15pm:

If the drunken idiot renounced his NZ citizenship he was clearly in breach of the dual citizenship provision of the constitution.

You're wrong.
The constitution talked about being a British subject not an Australian citizen.

Really, Bobby? Can you tell me the Section of the Constitution?

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Francis Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 595 Gender:	Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship Reply #33 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:48pm Cods you must take responsibility for your actions. If you say you aren't a dual citizen and it's proven you are. It is no ones fault but your own.
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Bobby.

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Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship
Reply #34 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:56pm

Aussie wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:47pm:

Bobby. wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:46pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 3:15pm:

If the drunken idiot renounced his NZ citizenship he was clearly in breach of the dual citizenship provision of the constitution.

You're wrong.
The constitution talked about being a British subject not an Australian citizen.

Really, Bobby? Can you tell me the Section of the Constitution?

It's indirectly here:
http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

At the time there were no Australian citizens.
Even now all the pollys swear allegiance to the the Queen of England & Australia.

The definition of citizen is the problem.

A constitution is a set of rules by which a country or state is run. The Australian Constitution was drafted at a series of constitutional conventions held in the 1890s. It was passed by the British Parliament as part of the Commonwealth of Australia Constitution Act 1900 and took effect on 1 January 1901.

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Bobby.

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Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship
Reply #35 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 4:57pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_nationality_law

Australian nationality law determines who is and who is not an Australian citizen. The status of Australian nationality or Australian citizenship was created by the Nationality and Citizenship Act 1948,[1] (in 1973 renamed the Australian Citizenship Act 1948) which came into force on 26 January 1949. The 1948 Act was amended many times, notably in 1973, 1984, 1986 and 2002. The Australian Citizenship Act 2007,[2] replaced the 1948 Act, commencing on 1 July 2007

Therefore -
in 1901 there was no such thing as an Australian citizen.

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Aussie Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 38534 Gender:	Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship Reply #36 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 5:14pm And nowhere in the Constitution does it refer to Australians being British Citizens as you asserted. Your point is irrelevant.
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Vic Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 8273 Melbourne Victoria Gender:	Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship Reply #37 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 6:23pm Too Late Bro. Saw you at the Fotty
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Bobby. Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 103329 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship Reply #38 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 6:53pm Aussie wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 5:14pm: And nowhere in the Constitution does it refer to Australians being British Citizens as you asserted. Your point is irrelevant. But the concept of an Australian citizen didn't exist before 1948 so how could the 1901 laws have meant anything other than a British subject?
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Aussie

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Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship
Reply #39 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 6:57pm

Bobby. wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 6:53pm:

Aussie wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 5:14pm:

And nowhere in the Constitution does it refer to Australians being British Citizens as you asserted.

Your point is irrelevant.

But the concept of an Australian citizen didn't exist before 1948
so how could the 1901 laws have meant anything other than a British subject?

Go, find Section 44 of the Constitution and post it here.

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Bobby.

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Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship
Reply #40 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 7:10pm

1901
COMMONWEALTH OF AUSTRALIA CONSTITUTION ACT - SECT 44
Disqualification

               Any person who:

                  (i) is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power; or

                  (ii) is attainted of treason, or has been convicted and is under sentence, or subject to be sentenced, for any offence punishable under the law of the Commonwealth or of a State by imprisonment for one year or longer; or

                  (iii) is an undischarged bankrupt or insolvent; or

                  (iv) holds any office of profit under the Crown, or any pension payable during the pleasure of the Crown out of any of the revenues of the Commonwealth; or

                  (v) has any direct or indirect pecuniary interest in any agreement with the Public Service of the Commonwealth otherwise than as a member and in common with the other members of an incorporated company consisting of more than twenty-five persons;

shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives.

               But subsection (iv) does not apply to the office of any of the Queen's Ministers of State for the Commonwealth, or of any of the Queen's Ministers for a State, or to the receipt of pay, half pay, or a pension, by any person as an officer or member of the Queen's navy or army, or to the receipt of pay as an officer or member of the naval or military forces of the Commonwealth by any person whose services are not wholly employed by the Commonwealth.

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Aussie

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Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship
Reply #41 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 7:17pm

Bobby. wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 7:10pm:

1901
COMMONWEALTH OF AUSTRALIA CONSTITUTION ACT - SECT 44
Disqualification

               Any person who:

                  (i) is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power; or

                  (ii) is attainted of treason, or has been convicted and is under sentence, or subject to be sentenced, for any offence punishable under the law of the Commonwealth or of a State by imprisonment for one year or longer; or

                  (iii) is an undischarged bankrupt or insolvent; or

                  (iv) holds any office of profit under the Crown, or any pension payable during the pleasure of the Crown out of any of the revenues of the Commonwealth; or

                  (v) has any direct or indirect pecuniary interest in any agreement with the Public Service of the Commonwealth otherwise than as a member and in common with the other members of an incorporated company consisting of more than twenty-five persons;

shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives.

               But subsection (iv) does not apply to the office of any of the Queen's Ministers of State for the Commonwealth, or of any of the Queen's Ministers for a State, or to the receipt of pay, half pay, or a pension, by any person as an officer or member of the Queen's navy or army, or to the receipt of pay as an officer or member of the naval or military forces of the Commonwealth by any person whose services are not wholly employed by the Commonwealth.

Good.

Now, do you see the words British Citizen there? Do you see the words British Colony there? Do you see the words 'A Country which is part of the British Empire' there?

Do you see the words 'foreign power?'

Is NZ NOW a foreign power? Is Canada NOW a foreign power. Is India NOW a foreign power.....etc etc etc??????

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Its time Gold Member Offline Boot libs out Posts: 25639 Gender:	Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship Reply #42 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 7:26pm Vic wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 6:23pm: Too Late Bro. Saw you at the Fotty
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Bobby.

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Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship
Reply #43 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 7:33pm

Aussie wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 7:17pm:

Bobby. wrote on Aug 15^th, 2017 at 7:10pm:

1901
COMMONWEALTH OF AUSTRALIA CONSTITUTION ACT - SECT 44
Disqualification

               Any person who:

                  (i) is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power; or

                  (ii) is attainted of treason, or has been convicted and is under sentence, or subject to be sentenced, for any offence punishable under the law of the Commonwealth or of a State by imprisonment for one year or longer; or

                  (iii) is an undischarged bankrupt or insolvent; or

                  (iv) holds any office of profit under the Crown, or any pension payable during the pleasure of the Crown out of any of the revenues of the Commonwealth; or

                  (v) has any direct or indirect pecuniary interest in any agreement with the Public Service of the Commonwealth otherwise than as a member and in common with the other members of an incorporated company consisting of more than twenty-five persons;

shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives.

               But subsection (iv) does not apply to the office of any of the Queen's Ministers of State for the Commonwealth, or of any of the Queen's Ministers for a State, or to the receipt of pay, half pay, or a pension, by any person as an officer or member of the Queen's navy or army, or to the receipt of pay as an officer or member of the naval or military forces of the Commonwealth by any person whose services are not wholly employed by the Commonwealth.

Good.

Now, do you see the words British Citizen there? Do you see the words British Colony there? Do you see the words 'A Country which is part of the British Empire' there?

Do you see the words 'foreign power?'

Is NZ NOW a foreign power? Is Canada NOW a foreign power. Is India NOW a foreign power.....etc etc etc??????

Aussie,
We all have the same Queen - both Australia & NZ.
All the pollies swear allegiance to her.

It will be interesting to see if I'm right when the High Court decides.

I'll be the greatest bush lawyer ever to be posting on Ozpolitic.

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Aussie Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 38534 Gender:	Re: Joyce renounces NZ Citizenship Reply #44 - Aug 15^th, 2017 at 7:35pm Well, I have no idea what your position is (and why) Bobby.
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