Australian Politics Forum - Musims and gay marriage

Baronvonrort

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Musims and gay marriage
Sep 1^st, 2017 at 6:58pm

Quote:

Last night on ABC's The Drum, Ali Kadri, spokesman for the Islamic Council of Queensland and the Australian Federation of Islamic Councils, said his community was stuck with the choice of offending allies or siding with critics, and the result had been silence.

"We are afraid if we come out with our opinion then the left may abandon us for going against their view

As Mr Jaspal wrote for The Conversation: "Most Islamic scholars are in agreement that homosexuality is incompatible with Islamic theology.
"They tend to draw on the story of Lot in the Koran [also in the Old Testament] which recounts the destruction of the tribe of Lot allegedly due to their engagement in homosexual acts as 'evidence' for God's condemnation of homosexuality.

"Many scholars also cite the Ahadith [statements attributed to the Prophet Muhammed] that are condemnatory of homosexuality."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-31/same-sex-marriage-why-have-muslims-been-so...

The Saudis use beheading to cure homosexuals, Iran hangs homosexuals, the Islamic state throws homosexuals from tall buildings.

All muslims agree the death penalty is called for with homosexuals they only differ on what method is used to execute them.

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Musims and gay marriage
Reply #1 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:07pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 6:58pm:

Quote:

Last night on ABC's The Drum, Ali Kadri, spokesman for the Islamic Council of Queensland and the Australian Federation of Islamic Councils, said his community was stuck with the choice of offending allies or siding with critics, and the result had been silence.

"We are afraid if we come out with our opinion then the left may abandon us for going against their view

As Mr Jaspal wrote for The Conversation: "Most Islamic scholars are in agreement that homosexuality is incompatible with Islamic theology.
"They tend to draw on the story of Lot in the Koran [also in the Old Testament] which recounts the destruction of the tribe of Lot allegedly due to their engagement in homosexual acts as 'evidence' for God's condemnation of homosexuality.

"Many scholars also cite the Ahadith [statements attributed to the Prophet Muhammed] that are condemnatory of homosexuality."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-31/same-sex-marriage-why-have-muslims-been-so...

The Saudis use beheading to cure homosexuals, Iran hangs homosexuals, the Islamic state throws homosexuals from tall buildings.

All muslims agree the death penalty is called for with homosexuals they only differ on what method is used to execute them.

Typical Islam playing identity politics. The new political correctness that is sweeping the western world Sad

. The leaders should just come out and have an honest debate, rather than be afraid of isolating the left and agreeing with the right. Anyway, of course the regressive left would be aware that conservative muslims would hate the idea of gay marriage. It shouldn't come as complete shock that the same people they consistently defend for having crazy medieval views would then not agree to gay marriage. Although, the regressive left is not exactly of high intellect, as many posters on this forum prove each and every day. So I guess who really knows.

I'm encouraged to see that there is a progressive arm of muslims who want to see gay marriage legalised in Australia. Unfortunately it is a minority within the community, and only goes to show the problems plaguing the muslim world where the majority chooses the teachings of a warlord and some antiquated book as opposed to rational common sense about equality.

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Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Musims and gay marriage
Reply #2 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:18pm

Quote:

More than 500 imams in landmark gay marriage protest

More than 500 imams have joined forces to protest against David Cameron’s plans for gay marriage in an unprecedented intervention from the British Muslim community.

Leaders representing tens of thousands of worshippers at mosques across the country, have signed a joint letter to The Sunday Telegraph accusing the Government of attacking “the cornerstone of family life”

It is the first time that Muslim leaders have made a collective intervention on the issue and underlines the strength of feeling among ethnic minority voters.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/10066730/More-than-500-imams-in-landmar...

The muslim leaders in the UK didn't stay silent on gay marriage.

The first time more than 500 imams get together for a protest was it about death for apostates/blasphemers or Islamic terror or FGM or child brides or was it protesting about gay marriage.

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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Gordon Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20496 Gordon Gender:	Re: Musims and gay marriage Reply #3 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:22pm One day Muslims and the hard right will work out they actually have a lot in common.
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Yadda

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Re: Musims and gay marriage
Reply #4 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:27pm

Quote:

Last night on ABC's The Drum, Ali Kadri, spokesman for the Islamic Council of Queensland and the Australian Federation of Islamic Councils, said his community was stuck with the choice of offending allies or siding with critics, and the result had been silence.

"We are afraid if we come out with our opinion then the left may abandon us for going against their view

Demonstrating, not that moslems believe in tolerance, .....of the worldview of others.

Nor even, in the moslem choosing to truthfully and openly express his real views/opinions, and thereby necessitating the moslem to make their/an argument, for the positions they 'defend' [in concealment].

But rather, that when confronted with something which he abhors [and, when he has no means-to-power to oppose], the moslem will choose to remain silent.

To conceal his intolerance [and opposition] to the openly stated views/opinions of others.

He is willing to wait for a time, when he may be able to impose his views/opinions upon the 'other'.

.

ALL MOSLEMS CLAIM TO CHERISH THE RIGHT OF FREEDOM OF RELIGION [i.e. THE FREEDOM, TO PRACTICE ISLAM].....

BUT MOSLEMS, THROUGHOUT THE WORLD, ARE SEEN TO DENY, EXACTLY THAT RIGHT OF FREEDOM OF RELIGION, TO OTHERS!

Even in a so-called liberal moslem nation like Malaysia.

Quote:

"Malaysia's Prime Minister: LGBTs, liberalism, and pluralism are enemies of Islam"

"Last Malaysian Hindu temple in central Kuala Lumpur condemned, given five days to vacate"

"Malaysian temple condemned, temple staff and devotees given 15 minutes to leave"

"Malaysian government views LGBT community as a 'spreading problem' to be stopped"

"Malaysian deputy prime minister: Islam not compatible with freedom, liberal thought"

"Yet another Malaysian non-Muslim house of worship demolished"

"Malaysian state holding seminar on "threat of Christianity" "

"A message from Malaysia's king: "Muslims need to emulate Prophet Muhammad" "

http://www.jihadwatch.org/category/malaysia/

Q.
But why is it that the views ABOVE being expressed BY MOSLEMS within a nation like Malaysia, almost never make our nightly TV news reports ????

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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sir prince duke alevine Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23619 Gender:	Re: Musims and gay marriage Reply #5 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:42pm Gordon wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:22pm: One day Muslims and the hard right will work out they actually have a lot in common. yes, hilarious how the regressive left is physically violent with one group, and all motherly and loving with the other. And yet, both would throw a homosexual off a rooftop.
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Baronvonrort

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Re: Musims and gay marriage
Reply #6 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:45pm

Gordon wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:22pm:

One day Muslims and the hard right will work out they actually have a lot in common.

I am neither left or right i am Centrist.

Every issue needs to be debated on pros and cons.

Family law recognises same sex couples they have just as many rights as straight couples in defacto relationships, with family law already recognising same sex couples there are no additional legal benefits from same sex couples getting married.

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: Musims and gay marriage Reply #7 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 8:03pm Baronvonrort wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 6:58pm: All muslims agree the death penalty is called for with homosexuals they only differ on what method is used to execute them. I don't. Do you agree that makes you wrong Baron?
Back to top	A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said: Quote: Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms. IP Logged

polite_gandalf

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Re: Musims and gay marriage
Reply #8 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 8:07pm

Oh look, Baron forgot to quote the bits from his own article that prove him wrong:

Quote:

But the Muslim community's view is not unanimous.

Quote:

In a press release, Muslims for Marriage Equality spokesman Fahad Ali, former peer educator with the AIDS council of NSW, stated: "There is a diversity in belief and opinion on equal marriage within the Muslim community … there is a strong thread of egalitarianism and social justice within the Koran and we think that it is very applicable to the question of same-sex marriage."

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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mothra

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Re: Musims and gay marriage
Reply #9 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 8:09pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:42pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:22pm:

One day Muslims and the hard right will work out they actually have a lot in common.

yes, hilarious how the regressive left is physically violent with one group, and all motherly and loving with the other. And yet, both would throw a homosexual off a rooftop.

Ummm, i'm pretty sure that most of the people that get violent with Nazis and their ilk would get violent over someone being thrown off a building.

Or do you expect them just to tackle random Muslims in the street? Grab a hijab maybe?

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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.

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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 136432 Gender:	Re: Musims and gay marriage Reply #10 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 8:55pm Baronvonrort wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 6:58pm: All muslims agree the death penalty is called for with homosexuals ... That's complete nonsense. You lost all credibility, right there.
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mothra Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 35267 Gender:	Re: Musims and gay marriage Reply #11 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 8:56pm greggerypeccary wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 8:55pm: Baronvonrort wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 6:58pm: All muslims agree the death penalty is called for with homosexuals ... That's complete nonsense. You lost all credibility, right there. Baron had credibility?
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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Musims and gay marriage
Reply #12 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 8:58pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 8:07pm:

Oh look, Baron forgot to quote the bits from his own article that prove him wrong:

Quote:

But the Muslim community's view is not unanimous.

Quote:

In a press release, Muslims for Marriage Equality spokesman Fahad Ali, former peer educator with the AIDS council of NSW, stated: "There is a diversity in belief and opinion on equal marriage within the Muslim community … there is a strong thread of egalitarianism and social justice within the Koran and we think that it is very applicable to the question of same-sex marriage."

yes, diversity. 3% are for, and 97% against.

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Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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freediver

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Re: Musims and gay marriage
Reply #13 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 9:00pm

It' OK to have a lisp, so long as it is not deliberate, but homosexual sex attracts the death penalty.

abu_rashid wrote on Oct 9^th, 2008 at 7:12pm:

Quote:

you don't mind so much that men have sex with each other

Since it's a capital offense, I wouldn't say it's treated lightly at all.

Quote:

but you especially object to them talking in a gay way, having their own culture, and riding round on floats with their arse cheeks hanging out?

Islamically, someone who'd taken it this far would've apostasised and the Islamic ruling for apostasy would now apply to him. Talking is not part of this though, as some people have lisps and other speech impediments which cause them to talk like that. Whether it's hormone related or not, the speech in itself is not forbidden. However, if it's done intentionally to emulate women, then yes it's forbidden.

abu_rashid wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2008 at 1:52pm:

freediver wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2008 at 1:36pm:

Questionf for Abu and Malik: What is Islamic law regarding pedophilia and homosexuality? Does it accept higher societal standards or tolerance? Would you support different standards to what Islam teaches you? Can something be wrong or immoral, even if the Koran does not describe it as such?

Both are considered illegal practises and are capital offenses under Islamic law.

Quote:

Would you support different standards to what Islam teaches you?

I believe in Islam, so no I don't support different standards. However, since we do not live under an Islamic government, we must live by different laws. The two should not be confused. Islam prohibits vigilantism, and we definitely do not condone attempting to clandestinely implement our law in a non-Islamic state. This is a matter that is often confused and misconstrued in the media.

Quote:

Can something be wrong or immoral, even if the Koran does not describe it as such?

The Qur'an does not detail every little thing. It is an exposition of all things, but not in minute detail. The Sunnah, collections of recorded speech and eyewitness reocrds of Muhammad's (Pbuh) actions is by far the larger source of material to be used in Islamic jurisprudence.

As I mentioned previously, in case a specific matter is not detailed in the Qur'an or Sunnah, then we have the process of ijtihad to determine it.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Musims and gay marriage
Reply #14 - Sep 1^st, 2017 at 9:01pm

mothra wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 8:09pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:42pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 1^st, 2017 at 7:22pm:

One day Muslims and the hard right will work out they actually have a lot in common.

yes, hilarious how the regressive left is physically violent with one group, and all motherly and loving with the other. And yet, both would throw a homosexual off a rooftop.

Ummm, i'm pretty sure that most of the people that get violent with Nazis and their ilk would get violent over someone being thrown off a building.

Or do you expect them just to tackle random Muslims in the street? Grab a hijab maybe?

Oh I'm not so sure. We know that when it comes to regressives, there is one opinion when it comes to the majority, but when it's a minority they quickly stutter and shy away. Don't get me wrong, on most liberal issues that regressives fight for I agree. I just wish they were consistent, but for some reason the colour of someone's skin, or their belief in a certain type of religion, somehow makes regressives react differently. Look at you for example - I do admire how you fight for women's rights for white folk. But the moment it's about the Muslim population and all of sudden you're all like, 'The niqab is a powerful feminist statement' and what not. Just a hypocrite. I mean look at how you react to FGM in the muslim world, constantly telling us how small the population inflicted is in comparison to the total muslim population, because apparently issues only matter after a certain percentage threshold.

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« Last Edit: Sep 1^st, 2017 at 9:06pm by sir prince duke alevine »

Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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