Auggie wrote on Jan 30
th, 2018 at 4:32pm:
freediver wrote on Jan 30
th, 2018 at 3:16pm:
So you are intentionally making "made up" statements about historical facts that you just thought up on a whim, but you think this is different from making "false" statements?
You said the word 'lie', which indicates sinister intent. I have no such sinister intent.
freediver wrote on Jan 30
th, 2018 at 3:16pm:
And they just happened to be the same lies that Gandalf, Abu, Falah etc trot out?
They're not the same lies. They think it was self-defense; I think it was pre-emptive warfare. How do you ensure that your community is safe? By eliminating the opposition or any potential threat. Now, I don't agree with this strategy but it's not unique to Muhammad.
Do you think that Muhammad was a bad leader for the Muslims??
freediver wrote on Jan 30
th, 2018 at 3:16pm:
How is this any different from telling blatant lies and trying to disguise them as opinion?
Because I don't believe something else to be the truth but am deliberately not telling you the truth. You think they're lies, but for many people it's sheer common-sense if you know anything about history.
freediver wrote on Jan 30
th, 2018 at 3:16pm:
Do you often recommend people read books that you have not read yourself?
Do you often accuse people who have a different opinion from you as liars??
No, Augie, sometimes he accuses them of being jellyfish.
The irony is, of course, that FD never reads or references his own arguments. His essays are renowned for referencing his own distorted renditions of something G or Abu once said.
FD lives in a surreal echo chamber, where he attempts to convince himself of his own argument by quoting himself. The more you point this out, the more he digs in. The more compelling your arguments are, the more warped his own arguments become. When he can't defend his position any longer, he simply accuses you of lying - or evading.
Which is most cunning because FD evades each and every question you put to him.
Ultimately, FD argues with himself. He understands your point of view all too well because he used to argue it himself. Everything you're saying here, FD once preached. Read his 2007 posts.
FD is one of the only posters here who refuses to rule out lying. He has argued that they are a useful tactic to confront Muslims and their apologists with. His aim is to put them on the defensive, and draw out a quote he can use for months-long interrogations. He's still interrogating Brian about something he said a few years ago.
FD will pretend to support your right to express an opinion, but he is dead against you having that opinion. When FD talks of freedom of speech, he is solely defending his own right to distort your views.
For FD, freedom of speech is about the right to lie and evade. The "right to be a bigot" is the only aspect of free speech he now defends. FD stands up only for the right to "criticise" and "condemn" Islam and its apologists. He consistently refuses to answer whether he also supports the right to
defend Islam; Allah knows he does not support the right to promote it.
Whenever he is asked about his own views on the most fundamental aspect of Western liberalism - the right to intellectual and religious freedom, FD runs.
FD is that most postmodern of Eurocentrists. The aim is to eradicate liberalism and replace it with a studious, rigidly dogmatic groupthink. FD, like others in the "cultural warrior" vein, believes in the use of hegemonic tactics that reverse logic and turn freedom on its head. In this, FD is supported by people like Miranda Divine, Andrew Bolt, and that arch-tactician, Steve Bannon. All use lies (or "alternative facts") to advance their cause, and all run from the truth when confronted.
For these types, truth is merely transactional in the interests of power, and it has always been this way. Donald Trump, of course, has argued just this. Science, legal truths and principles, basic facts - all are up for grabs. This is just the way it works.
And yes, this is of course true - FD recently mentioned Kuhn on this point. But rather than uphold the Western project of aspiring to truth, the ideologue disregards it, at times actively avoiding it - far better to continue with a lie than back down and acknowledge reality.
FD is not interested in your opinions. FD asks you questions to ridicule and make you concede to his.
Remember, as FD once said, sometimes a question is just a question. What sound does a jellyfish make?
That's a question.
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