Setanta wrote on Feb 4^th, 2018 at 1:29am:


I am unsure why some people appear to have problems with honesty.   Tsk, tsk.   

Brian were you being honest when you said you have no right or ability to criticise Islam? If so, why do you always run away from the topic? After all this time, no-one knows why you say such stupid things or what they mean.

Brian Ross wrote on Feb 5^th, 2018 at 4:33pm:


Can you provide a specific example of a legitimate criticism of Islam?

If I say that Islamic theology teaches offensive Jihad, is that legitimate criticism?

Brian Ross wrote on Feb 5^th, 2018 at 5:16pm:


Not to present a strawman argument, but you're essentially saying that there's no objective truth when it comes to religion doctrine? It all comes down to interpretation?? Does that mean that Nazism come down to interpretation??

Gandalf had admitted that he is 'limited' as to how he can interpret the Quran. He cannot adopt an 'anything goes' approach, since this is inconsistent with religious truth.

Let me put this proposition to you:

"If I'm wrong about Islam, and it is NOT a militant and totalitarian religion, then the only consequence is that I'm a bigot or Islamophobe, or I'm wrong.

BUT, if you're wrong about Islam and IT IS a militant and totalitarian religion, then the consequences are enormous."

Now, I'm not saying that in the event of the latter that this justifies deportation of Muslims who are already here, or restricting their rights. What I'm saying is that it is legitimate and reasonable for we as a country to have a conversion about whether or not we should be importing an ideology that goes against our national interest.

The so-called Islamophobes want a complete ban on Muslim migration. I want a severe reduction of numbers in Asylum Seekers and Refugees from ALL nations, which would affect all races and religions.

Baronvonrort wrote on Feb 5^th, 2018 at 5:47pm:


But, of course, Gandalf will assert that the Hadith aren't really reliable and cannot be used to inform Islamic doctrine, despite the fact that the Hadith are considered to be authoritative among Sunni Muslims. So, either he's a Quranist (completely rejecting the Hadith) in which case he is in the minority, or he's 'cherry-picking' by accepting some Hadith and rejecting most of them??

Which one is it, Gandalf?

Auggie wrote on Feb 5^th, 2018 at 5:23pm:


Everything comes down to interpretation, Augie.  Be it religion or political ideology.   Everybody takes what they want and leaves behind the stuff they don't want.   Muhammad was a man of his times and his culture.  He had set out an objective to create a religion and to become the master of his people.   Christ, if he existed, was trying to accommodate his people to Roman rule.   Is it any wonder that their two religions differ?   It is why Hinduism is different to Buddhism and why Taoism/Shintoism/Greek/Roman/Egyptian/Norse religion is different as well.   They were created to satisfy people who were simple and ill-educated.   Terry Pratchett once wrote about his book Pyramids - a satire of Ancient Egyptian beliefs that he started out sticking to the Egyptian beliefs but in the end just made it up as he went along because it was all just too weird.   Today, to us, Islam is just too weird.  To those that choose to believe in it, it isn't.   They have accommodated their minds to it.

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Why?  I don't believe in Islam.  I am unsure why people adopt this simplistic idea that because I defend the rights of Muslims, I must also be a Muslim.   It is like suggesting that someone who defends the rights of Jews that they must be Jewish as well.   

The only consequence of you being right and me being wrong is that I will be a little bit embarrassed and I'll just go off and argue about something else.   The consequences for me are minor, Augie.   Just as the consequences for you are minor.

For the Muslims though...

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I am unsure why you or anybody keeps attempting to claim Islam is an "ideology".  It isn't.  It is a religion.   Ideologies are based upon rational (or in some cases, I admit, irrational) thought.  Religions are not.  Religions are based upon belief.  They don't need to be rational at all.

I am also unsure why everybody believes that all Muslims believe the same thing.  They don't.   Some believe the whole shebang.  Most don't.   Again, they take what they want from the religion.   It's like Catholics who believe in contraception.   It is against the theology of their religion but they ignore that because pregnancy is hard work and sex is fun.

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You aren't going to get a reduction to anything, Augie 'cause you don't have the power to prevent people seeking Asylum.   They seek Asylum because they are terrified of being killed.   It's a powerful motivator.   The Islamophobes are simply crazy.   They fear people because they fear them.   No rational thought, just fear.  Tsk, tsk. 

Brian Ross wrote on Feb 5^th, 2018 at 4:33pm:


Would you prefer if I sprouted excuses and justification for genocide on demand?

Were you being honest when you said you have no right or ability to criticise Islam? If so, why do you always run away from the topic? After all this time, no-one knows why you say such stupid things or what they mean.