Australian Politics Forum - Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?

Yadda

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Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Mar 12^th, 2019 at 11:52pm

QUESTION #1;
If ISLAMIC law is superior    and if ISLAMIC law is very just, and if moslems [the followers of ISLAM] are the virtuous people,
why is there so much corruption and injustice and oppression in every moslem majority nation ?

QUESTION #2;
Is there somewhere in the world, an 'exemplar' moslem majority nation, which every moslem in the world is proud of ?

Is it Pakistan perhaps ?

Which name, of that country, means,    'the land of the pure.'

If your reply [to QUESTION #1] is going to be,       that;
"Many moslem nations have corrupt politicians and leaders, and have violent and oppressive regimes."

.....why don't [why can't] the virtue of the moslem majority in that nation, be enough to overthrow those who are their oppressors ?

Q.
Why are all of those brave and virtuous moslems, in moslem majority nations, unable to work together, to overthrow those oppressors - with Allah's help ?

.

"Ye [moslems] are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah. If only the People of the Book had faith, it were best for them: among them are some who have faith, but most of them are perverted transgressors."
Koran 3.110

"Let those fight in the cause of Allah Who sell the life of this world for the hereafter. To him who fighteth in the cause of Allah,- whether he is slain or gets victory - Soon shall We give him a reward of great (value).
And why should ye not fight in the cause of Allah and [for] those who, being weak, are ill-treated (and oppressed)?- Men, women, and children, whose cry is: "Our Lord! Rescue us from this town, whose people are oppressors; and raise for us from thee one who will protect; and raise for us from thee one who will help!"
Those who believe fight in the cause of Allah, and those who reject Faith Fight in the cause of Evil: So fight ye against the friends of Satan: feeble indeed is the cunning of Satan."
Koran 4.74-76

AGAIN;
Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation, which is a beacon [to the whole world] of peace, and of justice, and of prosperity,
because moslems live there, and because they follow ISLAMIC law !?

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Yadda

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Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Reply #1 - Mar 13^th, 2019 at 11:08am

Yadda wrote on Mar 12^th, 2019 at 11:52pm:

QUESTION #2;
Is there somewhere in the world, an 'exemplar' moslem majority nation, which every moslem in the world is proud of ?

Is it Pakistan perhaps ?

Which name, of that country, means, 'the land of the pure.'

Pakistan, ISLAM, the moslem ummah, it applies the same.

Proverbs 22:1
A good name is rather to be chosen than great riches, and loving favour rather than silver and gold.

Proverbs 14:34
Righteousness exalteth a nation: but sin is a reproach to any people.

Many people may fear ISLAM's name reputation in the world,
but moslems are known for their deceit and their treachery, not for their virtue and honest dealing.

moslems = = the followers of ISLAM.

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« Last Edit: Mar 13^th, 2019 at 11:18am by Yadda »

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49371 At my desk.	Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ? Reply #2 - Mar 13^th, 2019 at 12:52pm Gandalf, Brian et al often try to use Indonesia or Malaysia - Muslim majority nations with a far shorter history of Islam than most and hence the greatest non-Muslim influence. But even they show demonstrable signs of slipping backwards under the influence of Islam.
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Karnal

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Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Reply #3 - Mar 13^th, 2019 at 1:47pm

freediver wrote on Mar 13^th, 2019 at 12:52pm:

Gandalf, Brian et al often try to use Indonesia or Malaysia - Muslim majority nations with a far shorter history of Islam than most and hence the greatest non-Muslim influence. But even they show demonstrable signs of slipping backwards under the influence of Islam.

Ah, the old plausible theory - South East Asian Muslims are nicer because they don't have the Negroid genes of their fellow Arabian subspecies.

Give them another 500 years, FD. They'll import Negroid genes for sure. They'll have to. Muhammed decreed it.

It's the only way they can get back at decent white people everywhere.

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ? Reply #4 - Mar 13^th, 2019 at 1:53pm Indonesia is a good example of living Islam - by simple virtue of being the largest muslim country in the world.
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greggerypeccary

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Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Reply #5 - Mar 13^th, 2019 at 1:56pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 13^th, 2019 at 1:53pm:

Indonesia is a good example of living Islam - by simple virtue of being the largest muslim country in the world.

I find it so funny that thousands of Islamophobic bogans go to Bali every year.

True story: many of them don't even know Bali is in Indonesia - they think it's a separate nation.

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Yadda

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Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Reply #6 - Mar 15^th, 2019 at 10:04am

Q.
Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 13^th, 2019 at 1:53pm:

1/ Indonesia is a good example of living Islam -
2/ by simple virtue of being the largest muslim country in the world.

Indonesia is 1/ a good example of living Islam - by simple virtue of being 2/ the largest muslim country in the world.

gandalf,

I do not dispute your points, 1/ and 2/ above.

Yes, 2/ Indonesia is the country in the world with the largest moslem population,
and yes, 1/ Indonesia is a good example of [the many] followers of ISLAM in Indonesia, living and promoting ISLAM.

gandalf,

YOUR OWN POINTS, REITERATED;
The population of Indonesia is > 200 million, and the vast majority of those 200 million people declare themselves to be followers of ISLAM.

And yes [i do agree with you that], the influence of ISLAMIC culture and ISLAMIC law is very strong, in Indonesia.

.

gandalf,

But in light of the examples and evidences [provided below], i don't see how, or why, you would choose to 'hold up' Indonesia' as an 'ensign' of ISLAMIC virtue and of ISLAMIC tolerance and of ISLAMIC justice, in law.

.

gandalf,

I provide these examples and evidences [below] which would contradict any assurtion or argument that a virtuous ISLAMIC based society, exists today, in Indonesia.

These being examples and evidences [imo], which would go a long way to convince [any reasonable person], that a virtuous, ISLAMIC based society, DOES NOT exist today, in Indonesia.

.

gandalf,

Can you tell us, AND WILL YOU TELL US ???, do you endorse any of these ISLAMIC virtues [listed below], which are commonly on display in Indonesia ?

ISLAM and ISLAMIC law, in Indonesia ------ >

ISLAM and ISLAMIC law, in Indonesia ------ >

ISLAM and ISLAMIC law, in Indonesia ------ >

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Sharia in Indonesia: Women unable to walk after brutal public whippings
Mar 7, 2019 9:10 am By Christine Douglass-Williams

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Teen girl and her boyfriend are caned for hugging in public
Feb 3, 2019 5:08 pm By Robert Spencer

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Muslim lawmakers reject anti-rape bill over concerns that it’s “pro-adultery” and “pro-LGBT”
Feb 3, 2019 4:36 pm By Robert Spencer

["Muslim lawmakers reject anti-rape bill" ??? on the face of it, is this a virtuous position, for the followers of ISLAM to support ? ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Muslim cleric linked to Bali jihad massacre to be released despite not renouncing “radicalism”
Jan 23, 2019 12:00 pm By Robert Spencer

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: President whom foes say is insufficiently Islamic to release Muslim cleric behind Bali jihad massacre
Jan 20, 2019 8:00 am By Robert Spencer

[the influence of ISLAMIC religious law, overlaps into Indonesian politics ? ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Muslims plot jihad massacres during Christmas and New Year celebrations
Dec 15, 2018 1:41 pm By Robert Spencer
"Targeting people who are in the midst of joyful celebrations"

[such aggression is 100% lawful, in ISLAMIC law. Koran 9.123, Koran 9.111 ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Tens of thousands of Muslims rally to celebrate ousting of Christian governor who was accused of blasphemy
Dec 5, 2018 12:21 pm By Robert Spencer

[Q. gandalf, was it and act of blasphemy, for Christian politician Ahok, to publicly quote a Koranic verse, verbatim ?
Q. gandalf, in an ISLAMIC law jurisdiction, should a non-moslem be permitted to publicly quote Koranic verses, in support of his own legal position ?
Q. what is the proper and appropriate ISLAMIC law 'remedy', if this is not permissible ? ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Christian politician faces blasphemy charge for saying she won’t support laws based on “Bible or Sharia”
Dec 2, 2018 7:55 am By Robert Spencer

[Q. are publicly expressing secular opinions and views unlawful, in Indonesian ? in Indonesian law ? ]

MORE.... [examples]

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Yadda

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Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Reply #7 - Mar 15^th, 2019 at 10:05am

CONTINUED....

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Aceh village tells coffee shops to cut Wi-Fi so kids don’t get distracted from reading Quran
Nov 25, 2018 11:05 am By Robert Spencer

[Q. is that coz, the followers of ISLAM in Indonesia, are afraid that those kids may 'miss out' on reading commands which are in the Koran which urge them to fight and kill disbelievers [including Christians and Buddhists ] ? ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Dozens of mosques attended by government workers are preaching jihad and attacks on non-Muslims
Nov 21, 2018 7:31 am By Christine Douglass-Williams

[oh gandalf!!! this is a great ISLAMIC virtue! don't you agree ? ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Sharia Indonesia: Woman caned in public for being “in close proximity” to boyfriend
Oct 29, 2018 4:05 pm By Robert Spencer

[gandalf, do you consider this statement to be truthful; "ISLAM is the most feminist religion" - Yassmin Abdel-Magied ??? ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Rally to promote moderate Islam canceled after threats of violence from Muslims screaming “Allahu akbar”
Oct 26, 2018 2:44 pm By Robert Spencer

[Q. gandalf, do you agree, that there is no 'moderate ISLAM' ?
but rather, that there is just ISLAM ?    ...which is the pure religion of Allah, and which is defined the Koran and by other authentic ISLAMIC religious texts ?
and do you support the view which is held by many moslems, that the promotion of a 'moderate ISLAM' is a conspiracy by the enemies of ISLAM ? ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: 63 jihad terror groups pledge allegiance to the Islamic State’s caliph
Oct 12, 2018 8:27 am By Robert Spencer

[well they would, wouldn't they!
coz, these 'terrorists' are all followers of of the precepts and laws of ISLAM, just as ISIS itself is. ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia city orders top civil servants to go to mosque for dawn prayers or risk being fired
Sep 20, 2018 2:59 pm By Robert Spencer

[coz, 1/ in this Indonesian city 'civil servant' positions go to moslems, and 2/ if they don't go to mosque for dawn prayers, these moslems may 'miss out' on hearing the commands which are in the Koran which urge them to fight and kill disbelievers [including Christians and Buddhists ]. ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Kindergarten dresses children as armed jihadis for parade
Aug 20, 2018 10:44 am By Robert Spencer

[nothing wrong with this!    the followers of ISLAM in Indonesia, encouraging moslem children to devote themselves to death for Allah's cause.
so, so virtuous. 5 gold stars.]

"Fighting [against disbelievers] is prescribed for you, and [if] ye dislike it.....Allah knoweth, and ye know not."
Koran 2.216 ]
"Say: "...If ye think that ye are friends to Allah, to the exclusion of (other) men, then express your desire for Death, if ye are truthful!" "
Koran 62.06

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Gay couple flogged over 80 times, woman caned for selling alcohol, crowd screams “Hit them harder”
Jul 13, 2018 3:00 pm By Robert Spencer

[its only proper and lawful.    ...and virtuous, to punish those who do not obey ISLAMIC law.]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Mosque survey finds 41% of Jakarta mosques are “radical,” including many that are state-owned
Jul 9, 2018 11:55 am By Robert Spencer

['radical' !!??    surely, they simply mean that this contingent [mosque attendees], obey Allah and ISLAMIC law.
without any doubt, highly virtuous people! ]

"We sent not a messenger, but to be obeyed..........they ['believers'] can have no (real) Faith, until they make thee judge in all disputes between them, and find in their souls no resistance against Thy decisions, but accept them with the fullest conviction."
Koran 4.64, 65
"O ye who believe! Obey Allah, and obey the messenger, and make not vain your deeds!"
Koran 47:33

MORE.... [examples]

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Yadda

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Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Reply #8 - Mar 15^th, 2019 at 10:06am

CONTINUED....

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Mosque quotes Qur’an in telling Muslims not to vote for non-Muslims
Jul 5, 2018 12:57 pm By Robert Spencer

[it goes against everything which ISLAM stands for, to permit non-moslems to have positions of governance over believers.]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Muslim cleric masterminded deadly jihad massacres from his jail cell
Jun 24, 2018 8:00 am By Robert Spencer

[ah well. luckily, this moslem cleric is just a single mis-understander of what ISLAM teaches.
peace and tolerance.]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Ramadan in Indonesia: Muslims force closure of church
Jun 6, 2018 9:53 am By Robert Spencer

[because ISLAM is superior. every dhimmi Christian understand this. ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Muslim cleric orders multiple jihad massacres
May 19, 2018 9:42 am By Robert Spencer
"A Muslim cleric?
A man who has dedicated his life to understanding Islam correctly and communicating it properly somehow got the idea that his religion commanded him to fight against and kill unbelievers?"

[yet another follower of ISLAM, who simply mis-understands what ISLAM teaches.
ISLAM is peace.]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Six jihad suicide bombers from one family attack three churches during Sunday Mass, killing at least 11
May 13, 2018 8:22 am By Robert Spencer

[ISLAM is peace.]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Christian gets four years prison for remarks about the Qur’an
May 12, 2018 2:00 pm By Robert Spencer

[how dare any Christian say.....anything. disbeliever!!!!! ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: Man gets five years prison for “insulting Islam” and “spreading hate speech”
May 8, 2018 9:06 am By Robert Spencer

[perhaps he's one of those Christian blasphemers ? ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Muslim preacher says Muslims will go to hell for buying from Starbucks because it supports LGBT community
Apr 29, 2018 4:30 pm By Robert Spencer

[everyone knows, that Allah hates LGBT. he thinks that they are perverse deviants. ]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia: “Amorous couples” and alleged sex workers whipped for breaking Islamic law
Apr 21, 2018 11:21 am By Christine Douglass-Williams
"More than a thousand people, including dozens of tourists from neighbouring Malaysia jeered and screamed abuse at the group of three men."

[speaks for itself.]

WWW search.... gandalf, do you approve of this ISLAMIC virtue, in Indonesia ?
Indonesia’s Aceh province takes Sharia caning indoors to hide its abuses after backlash
Apr 14, 2018 9:32 am By Christine Douglass-Williams

[coz, the followers of ISLAM in Indonesia are proud of their religion, of ISLAMIC laws, and have nothing to hide from the eyes of the world ? ]

fin.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Yadda

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Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Reply #9 - Mar 15^th, 2019 at 11:33am

Q.
Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 13^th, 2019 at 1:53pm:

1/ Indonesia is a good example of living Islam -
2/ by simple virtue of being the largest muslim country in the world.

Indonesia is 1/ a good example of living Islam - 2/ by simple virtue of being the largest muslim country in the world.

gandalf,

YOUR OWN POINTS, REITERATED;
The population of Indonesia is > 200 million, and the vast majority of those 200 million people declare themselves to be followers of ISLAM.

And yes [i do agree with you that], the influence of ISLAMIC culture and ISLAMIC law is very strong, in Indonesia.

.

WWW search....
abc news jakarta isis mosque

n.b.
These news reports are accounts of an ISIS recruitment drive, inside Jakarta mosques [multiple].

ISLAM is peace.

Camera crew captures Islamic State recruitment drive in Jakarta mosque
Samantha Hawley reported this story on Monday, February 22, 2016 08:16:00

http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2016/s4410900.htm

Islamic State supporters meet at Jakarta mosques to recruit members for militant group
Samantha Hawley, Monday, February 22, 2016

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-02-22/islamic-state-supporters-run-recruitment-d...

moslems = = followers of ISLAM

n.b.
To everyone who reads this post,

.....i want you to know, that there are an awful lot of moslems living in Indonesia.

ISIS = = followers of ISLAM

WWW search....
indonesia, burn churches

WWW search....
indonesia, murder christians

.

Moslem clerics, in Indonesia are teaching moslem children.....

“People who worship anything other than Allah are infidels and it is permitted to kill them.”

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2015/03/people-who-worship-anything-other-than-allah-a...

"Jakarta (AsiaNews/Agencies) – The Religious Affairs Ministry banned the distribution of an Islamic religious textbook for high school grades that contain radical religious notions."

Funny though, how the ISLAMIC text book [sanctioning the 'lawful' murder of non-moslems] was only banned - AFTER ITS EXISTENCE IN INDONESIAN HIGH SCHOOLS WAS PUBLICLY EXPOSED.

OBSERVATION;
ISLAM = = the religion whose members are 'terrified',
....of open, public exposure, of ISLAM's doctrines.

Why so ?

/sarc off

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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freediver

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Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Reply #10 - Mar 15^th, 2019 at 12:26pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 13^th, 2019 at 1:53pm:

Indonesia is a good example of living Islam - by simple virtue of being the largest muslim country in the world.

So jailing mayors for daring to say nice things about Islam and caning people under shariah law is a 'good' example of what Islam does to a country?

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Reply #11 - Mar 15^th, 2019 at 2:45pm

freediver wrote on Mar 15^th, 2019 at 12:26pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 13^th, 2019 at 1:53pm:

Indonesia is a good example of living Islam - by simple virtue of being the largest muslim country in the world.

So jailing mayors for daring to say nice things about Islam and caning people under shariah law is a 'good' example of what Islam does to a country?

Arguably yes. As long as you are consistent and accept that electing mayors who stare down Islamists and build churches, and Presidents who crack down on Islamist hate speech - is also a 'good' example of what Islam does to a country.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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freediver

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Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ?
Reply #12 - Mar 15^th, 2019 at 6:36pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 15^th, 2019 at 2:45pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 15^th, 2019 at 12:26pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 13^th, 2019 at 1:53pm:

Indonesia is a good example of living Islam - by simple virtue of being the largest muslim country in the world.

So jailing mayors for daring to say nice things about Islam and caning people under shariah law is a 'good' example of what Islam does to a country?

Arguably yes. As long as you are consistent and accept that electing mayors who stare down Islamists and build churches, and Presidents who crack down on Islamist hate speech - is also a 'good' example of what Islam does to a country.

I understand the mayor in question was Christian. Won't be long before they put a stop to that. Inshallah.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ? Reply #13 - Mar 16^th, 2019 at 9:22am Good grief, FD are you telling me this self censoring Islamofascist shithole actually elected a christian??? Shurly shum mishtake.
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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96394	Re: Where is, the 'exemplar' moslem majority nation ? Reply #14 - Mar 16^th, 2019 at 1:16pm polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 16^th, 2019 at 9:22am: Good grief, FD are you telling me this self censoring Islamofascist shithole actually elected a christian??? Shurly shum mishtake. And their sinister laws allow a Christian to rule over them? Shurely an even bigger mishtake.
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