polite_gandalf wrote on May 6^th, 2019 at 10:25am:

Very sly but no cigar.

You have never once shown us where the jihadis are not impeccably orthodox. You always only ever give the bromide about vast majority, tiny minority and their feelings.

(Shame and pride, respectively)

polite_gandalf wrote on May 7^th, 2019 at 7:28pm:



They are not universally rejected.   The 'vast majority' is very sly and hedging.  The jihadis are never shown to be ideologically unIslamic. There is no concerted effort to ostracise them, to show that they are Koranically or otherwise incorrect, etc.

Because they aren't. On the contrary - Islamic jihad is world-wide and they are everywhere part of local Muslim communities which produce, support, maintain and grow them. Jihadis do not come from anywhere but their own local Islamic communities.


That's the logic.

https://www.conservativenationalparty.org/policies

The objects of Fraser Anning’s Conservative National party are as follows:


i) the vision of Sir Henry Parkes of Australia as an English speaking, predominantly European Christian Commonwealth, as originally described in 1901 when Australia as a nation was founded;

ii) social cohesion by an immigration program that gives preference to those best able to integrate and assimilate;

iii) traditional family values, including recognising marriage as only the union of a man and a woman and the sanctity of human life at all ages, including both the unborn and the elderly;

iv) government through the democratic consent of the governed;

v) individual freedom, including unrestricted freedom of speech, association and belief;

vi) private enterprise;

vii) private property as an inviolable natural right;

viii) universal home-ownership as a national objective;

ix) Australian ownership of our infrastructure, manufacturing and agriculture;

x) widely distributed ownership of the means of production, distribution and exchange through owner operated farms, small business and co-operatives;

xi) collective bargaining in agriculture and industry;

xii) orderly marketing of agricultural products;

xiii) the development of rural and regional infrastructure and the re-industrialisation of Australia;

xiv) an end to usury through the establishment of a not-for-profit government bank;

xv) the right to own firearms and use them in self-defence;

xvi) welfare as a safety net but restricted to citizens;

xvii) citizens initiated referenda and voluntary voting;

xviii) decentralisation of power and competitive federalism;

xix) a fair taxation system that encourages productivity and savings and rewards hard work;

xx) the restoration of Australia’s national sovereignty through repudiation of coercive international treaties and a foreign policy that puts Australia first;

xxi) a capable and well-resourced military and strong support for our veterans. 

freediver wrote on May 7^th, 2019 at 9:44pm:


Then you have obviously never met a nazi.

Its starting to make sense now. All this while you bending over backwards to depict Nazis as not so bad, morally superior to muslims etc - I assumed you were just spinelessly apologising for them. Now I'm thinking you simply have no clue what a nazi actually is.

freediver wrote on May 7^th, 2019 at 9:44pm:


Here's my take FD: 100% of nazis are racist violent shitheads. They literally wouldn't be nazis if they weren't racist and violent shitheads.

You arguing that its possible for them to be something other than that only proves that you are clueless about what it actually takes to be a nazi.

moses I'll try and explain this as simply as possible.

"what it takes" to be a muslim - only requires adherence to a core set of beliefs and behaviours. These are most succintly articulated by the 5 pillars: belief in the oneness of God, dedication to prayer, alms giving, dedication to fasting and pilgrimage. If you adhere to these fundamental principles, no one can accuse you of not being a muslim.

As for 'what it takes" to be a nazi - it requires you to adhere to a violent and hateful ideology of racial supremacy. Thats not my biased spin, thats literally what it is moses. Do you actually dispute that?

Yes it is true that in addition to the 5 pillars, some muslims add on killing infidels and obligatory violence. But it is absolutely indisputable that this is a minority view of 'what it takes' to be muslim. And even the jihadis and Islamists can't dispute the fact that the 5 pillars - the 5 decidely *NON* violent, *NON* hateful principles of personal spiritual fulfillment - are absolutely crucial to being a muslim before anything else.

For nazis on the other hand - racism and violence and hate are not "optional add-ons" to a core set of non-violent, spiritual beliefs and practices that all adherents believe are the most important features of the ideology. Its violence, racism and hate - or its not Nazism. Its as simple as that.

Islam = the 5 pillars as its core. There is precisely zero relation to violence and hate in any of these 5 pillars. Take away these 5 fundamentals, and there is no Islam - even the jihadis agree with this.

Nazism = racial supremacist ideology of hate as its core principle. This has a 100% relationhip with violence and hate. Take away this principle and there is no Nazism.

Can you see the difference yet?

Can you yet perceive why I think its fair to label 100% of nazis as violent shitheads, but not fair to similarly smear 100% of muslims?

moses wrote on May 8^th, 2019 at 3:58pm:


Appears you don't know or understand Islam very well at all, Moses.   

polite_gandalf wrote on May 8^th, 2019 at 3:42pm:

Looking at Islam's history, it is full of violence and hate justified by the Koran and Mohammed's example.