Australian Politics Forum - did the protestors spread the virus?

KangAnon Gold Member Offline The Sandstorm is coming 🎵Doo doo doo doo🎵 Posts: 18235 Mianjin (Brisbane)	Re: did the protestors spread the virus? Reply #240 - Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:36pm Notice that anything under the watch of a Labor leader is 100% their fault and they should be held to account. But Liberal leaders, there is always someone else to blame.
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The_Barnacle

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #241 - Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:41pm

freediver wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:28pm:

The_Barnacle wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:09pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 12:49pm:

The_Barnacle wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 10:49am:

Gordon wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 10:10am:

Professor Brett Sutton has previously revealed that genomic sequencing carried out by Melbourne's Doherty Institute shows a significant proportion – if not all – of Victoria's second-wave cases may be traced back to quarantine breaches at hotel
s.

I agree with Gordon

So, somewhere between 1% and 100%, based on your opinion, which is based on nothing?

No. "A significant proportion, if not all", based on the findings of Professor Brett Sutton

What did he find? Is he the one who came up with "Victoria is not having a second wave"?

Professor Brett Sutton has previously revealed that genomic sequencing carried out by Melbourne's Doherty Institute shows a significant proportion – if not all – of Victoria's second-wave cases may be traced back to quarantine breaches at hotels

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freediver

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #242 - Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:54pm

The_Barnacle wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:41pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:28pm:

The_Barnacle wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:09pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 12:49pm:

The_Barnacle wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 10:49am:

Gordon wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 10:10am:

Professor Brett Sutton has previously revealed that genomic sequencing carried out by Melbourne's Doherty Institute shows a significant proportion – if not all – of Victoria's second-wave cases may be traced back to quarantine breaches at hotel
s.

I agree with Gordon

So, somewhere between 1% and 100%, based on your opinion, which is based on nothing?

No. "A significant proportion, if not all", based on the findings of Professor Brett Sutton

What did he find? Is he the one who came up with "Victoria is not having a second wave"?

Professor Brett Sutton has previously revealed that genomic sequencing carried out by Melbourne's Doherty Institute shows a significant proportion – if not all – of Victoria's second-wave cases may be traced back to quarantine breaches at hotels

So, somewhere between 1% and 100%?

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KangAnon

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #243 - Aug 8^th, 2020 at 2:40pm

Before we get too hung up on blaming the state govt, or the federal govt, or China for our covid situation let’s review some facts,

1. We had to bring in mandatory quarantining in hotels, because we couldn’t trust people to stay home after returning from overseas.

2. We then had to bring in security, because we couldn’t trust people to stay in those hotels.

3. We then had to bring in ADF, because we couldn’t trust the security guards not to have sex with those in quarantine in the hotels.

4. We had to get police to door knock and check up on people, because we couldnt trust those who were meant to be self-isolating to actually stay at home.

5. We also have to have police and ADF reinforce the metropolitan melb zone and state borders, because we can’t trust people to follow the restrictions.

6. We are now being asked to use masks, because we cannot trust people to social distance when they are in public.

7. Through it all, our supermarkets have had to introduce shopping restrictions because we couldn’t trust people to not to take more than what they needed.

So we can get as mad as we want at politicians or health officials for imposing restrictions, or the country where the virus originated, but essentially it’s our own fault that we find ourselves here.

Selfishness and lack of empathy seems to be as much of a disease as covid itself.

The quicker people start following directions, the quicker this situation will improve.

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The_Barnacle

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #244 - Aug 9^th, 2020 at 10:48am

freediver wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:54pm:

The_Barnacle wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:41pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:28pm:

The_Barnacle wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 1:09pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 12:49pm:

The_Barnacle wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 10:49am:

Gordon wrote on Aug 8^th, 2020 at 10:10am:

Professor Brett Sutton has previously revealed that genomic sequencing carried out by Melbourne's Doherty Institute shows a significant proportion – if not all – of Victoria's second-wave cases may be traced back to quarantine breaches at hotel
s.

I agree with Gordon

So, somewhere between 1% and 100%, based on your opinion, which is based on nothing?

No. "A significant proportion, if not all", based on the findings of Professor Brett Sutton

What did he find? Is he the one who came up with "Victoria is not having a second wave"?

Professor Brett Sutton has previously revealed that genomic sequencing carried out by Melbourne's Doherty Institute shows a significant proportion – if not all – of Victoria's second-wave cases may be traced back to quarantine breaches at hotels

So, somewhere between 1% and 100%?

no. you are as bad as lee with your deliberate obfuscation. In fact your whole debating style is very similar to lee.
Professor Brett Sutton has previously revealed that genomic sequencing carried out by Melbourne's Doherty Institute shows a significant proportion – if not all – of Victoria's second-wave cases may be traced back to quarantine breaches at hotels
Even of it is only a "significant proportion" that doesn't automatically mean that the BLM protests account for the rest of it.
So it is actually 0%, unless you can find any evidence, which you have failed to do

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« Last Edit: Aug 9^th, 2020 at 10:59am by The_Barnacle »

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freediver

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #245 - Aug 9^th, 2020 at 11:27am

What do you mean by no? Are you actually disagreeing with my interpretation?

Quote:

Even of it is only a "significant proportion" that doesn't automatically mean that the BLM protests account for the rest of it.

So all you really have is a statement that is either irrelevant to the question of whether the protestors spread the virus, or does not offer a direct answer?

Did any of the quarantine breaches occur before the protest?

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The_Barnacle

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #246 - Aug 9^th, 2020 at 11:35am

freediver wrote on Aug 9^th, 2020 at 11:27am:

What do you mean by no? Are you actually disagreeing with my interpretation?

Quote:

Even of it is only a "significant proportion" that doesn't automatically mean that the BLM protests account for the rest of it.

So all you really have is a statement that is either irrelevant to the question of whether the protestors spread the virus, or does not offer a direct answer?

Did any of the quarantine breaches occur before the protest?

I'm saying that it is a flawed interpretation.
The facts we have are that a significant proportion, if not all, of the second wave were caused by quarantine breaches.
The onus of proof is on you to prove that any part of the second wave was caused by the BLM protests (and there are more than 2 options for the cause of the second wave)

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #247 - Aug 9^th, 2020 at 12:59pm

Quote:

I'm saying that it is a flawed interpretation.

In what way is it flawed? Is it incorrect, or just not how the Victorian government wants it spinned?

Quote:

The onus of proof is on you to prove that any part of the second wave was caused by the BLM protests (and there are more than 2 options for the cause of the second wave)

Why?

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The_Barnacle

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #248 - Aug 9^th, 2020 at 1:10pm

freediver wrote on Aug 9^th, 2020 at 12:59pm:

Quote:

I'm saying that it is a flawed interpretation.

In what way is it flawed? Is it incorrect, or just not how the Victorian government wants it spinned?

Quote:

The onus of proof is on you to prove that any part of the second wave was caused by the BLM protests (and there are more than 2 options for the cause of the second wave)

Why?

In that case your white flag is accepted.
If you have nothing to contribute we can all accept that Professor Brett Sutton's study is correct and move on.
The question you posed in the thread title can be answered "No".
end of debate

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freediver Gold Member Online www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49509 At my desk.	Re: did the protestors spread the virus? Reply #249 - Aug 9^th, 2020 at 2:58pm Quote: The question you posed in the thread title can be answered "No". Is there any onus on you to back this up? Do you actually disagree with my interpretation, or do you merely dislike the fact I am not trying to spin it the way the Victorian government did?
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freediver Gold Member Online www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49509 At my desk.	Re: did the protestors spread the virus? Reply #250 - Aug 10^th, 2020 at 8:20am Does anyone else think it is dangerous that the Victorian government is either not attempting to answer this question, or is withholding the answer, with apparent public support?
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Bobby.

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #251 - Aug 10^th, 2020 at 8:31am

freediver wrote on Aug 10^th, 2020 at 8:20am:

Does anyone else think it is dangerous that the Victorian government is either not attempting to answer this question, or is withholding the answer, with apparent public support?

Dick head Dan did answer it on TV one day a few weeks ago.
The state didn't have anywhere to put 20,000 people in jail
and neither did they have enough cops to give them all fines or enforce the law.
There were just too many protestors.

Yesterday there was a protest but as only 7 people turned up
they all get arrested and fined.

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #252 - Aug 10^th, 2020 at 8:36am

Quote:

Yesterday there was a protest but as only 7 people turned up
they all get arrested and fined.

Only 7 people turned up because they were getting arrested and fined. The organisers announced that it was cancelled as a result. Dan basically told the first round of protestors that they would not get arrested or fined.

You don't need to arrest them all. You don't even need to fine them all.

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Bobby.

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Re: did the protestors spread the virus?
Reply #253 - Aug 10^th, 2020 at 8:44am

freediver wrote on Aug 10^th, 2020 at 8:36am:

Quote:

Yesterday there was a protest but as only 7 people turned up
they all get arrested and fined.

Only 7 people turned up because they were getting arrested and fined. The organisers announced that it was cancelled as a result. Dan basically told the first round of protestors that they would not get arrested or fined.

You don't need to arrest them all. You don't even need to fine them all.

Dan told the BLM protestors that they would be fined but
nothing happened-
they all ignored it.

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freediver Gold Member Online www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49509 At my desk.	Re: did the protestors spread the virus? Reply #254 - Aug 10^th, 2020 at 9:14am All the quotes I have seen here show him asking them politely not to go. Even if he had a good excuse for letting them protest, that is not an excuse for misinforming the public about the consequences.
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