Australian Politics Forum - Western Culture

Bias_2012 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 10766 Gender:	Western Culture Apr 7^th, 2021 at 11:06pm Let's start off with a song that goes back a bit, but it was voted the "happiest" pop song
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Frank

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Re: Western Culture
Reply #1 - Apr 8^th, 2021 at 11:03am

https://tours.nga.gov.au/botticelli-van-gogh/stop/15/

https://tours.nga.gov.au/botticelli-van-gogh/stop/12/

It is a very good tour of 500 years of art, will go and see it again before it closes. Robert Hughes wrote excellent art reviews for Time magazine, including essays on some of the artists in this exhibition - see his Nothing if not Critical.

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« Last Edit: Apr 8^th, 2021 at 11:16am by Frank »

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Bias_2012

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Re: Western Culture
Reply #2 - Apr 8^th, 2021 at 2:54pm

An introduction to Western Culture ...

Western culture, sometimes equated with Western civilization, Occidental culture, the Western world, Western society, and European civilization, is the heritage of social norms, ethical values, traditional customs, belief systems, political systems, artifacts and technologies of the Western world that originated in or are associated with Europe. The term also applies beyond Europe to countries and cultures whose histories are strongly connected to Europe by immigration, colonization, or influence. For example, Western culture includes countries in Northern America, such as Canada and the United States, or Australasia, such as Australia and New Zealand, whose language and demographic ethnicity majorities are of European descent

Western culture is most strongly influenced by the Greco-Roman and Christian cultures

Ancient Greece is considered the birthplace of many elements of Western culture, including the development of a democratic system of government and major advances in philosophy, science and mathematics

Plato, along with Socrates and Aristotle, helped to establish Western philosophy
.

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Frank Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 45153 Gender:	Re: Western Culture Reply #3 - Apr 8^th, 2021 at 10:05pm And a very good thing it is, too. Part 1 of 13.
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Bias_2012

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Re: Western Culture
Reply #4 - Apr 11^th, 2021 at 10:57pm

To understand Western Culture, we must first understand Western Philosophy. I've posted short excerpts so it's easy to understand, rather than reading a long Wiki page you might never get through, except for the two dictionary definitions taken from elsewhere

Western philosophy

Western philosophy refers to the philosophical thought and work of the Western world. Historically, the term refers to the philosophical thinking of Western culture, beginning with the ancient Greek philosophy of the pre-Socratics. The word philosophy itself originated from the Ancient Greek philosophía (φιλοσοφία), literally, "the love of wisdom" (φιλεῖν phileîn, "to love" and σοφία sophía, "wisdom").

love
/lʌv/
noun

like or enjoy very much.

Definition of wisdom

: knowledge that is gained by having many experiences in life : the natural ability to understand things that most other people cannot understand : knowledge of what is proper or reasonable : good sense or judgment

Ancient Greek philosophy

The scope of ancient Western philosophy included the problems of philosophy as they are understood today; but it also included many other disciplines, such as pure mathematics and natural sciences such as physics, astronomy, and biology (Aristotle, for example, wrote on all of these topics).

20th-century philosophy and Contemporary philosophy (and 21 Century)

The three major contemporary approaches to academic philosophy are analytic philosophy, continental philosophy and pragmatism.[90] They are neither exhaustive nor mutually exclusive.

Since the Second World War, contemporary philosophy has been divided mostly into analytic and continental traditions; the former carried in the English speaking world and the latter on the continent of Europe.

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Sprintcyclist Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 40717 Gender:	Re: Western Culture Reply #5 - Apr 12^th, 2021 at 4:25am Bias_2012 wrote on Apr 7^th, 2021 at 11:06pm: Let's start off with a song that goes back a bit, but it was voted the "happiest" pop song great
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Bias_2012

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Re: Western Culture
Reply #6 - Apr 12^th, 2021 at 4:02pm

Here's the lyrics ....

https://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/electriclightorchestra/mrbluesky.html

If you press your fingers against your wrist and feel your pulse, you'll notice the basic rhythm of the song is the same as your heart beat (mine anyway, quite relaxed, and what my doctor can't find fault with)

The song has various natural elements in the lyrics that are all positive to supplement "happiness"

Nature (blue sky, Sun, after the rain and clouds cleared)

The Human element (appreciation, celebration, smiling, neighborliness ("Hey you with the pretty face
Welcome to the human race
")

A sense of Freedom ("Runnin' down the avenue
)"

Western Philosophy and Culture are predominately based on freedom and pursuit of happiness

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Frank

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Re: Western Culture
Reply #7 - Apr 12^th, 2021 at 4:15pm

Bias_2012 wrote on Apr 11^th, 2021 at 10:57pm:

To understand Western Culture, we must first understand Western Philosophy. I've posted short excerpts so it's easy to understand, rather than reading a long Wiki page you might never get through, except for the two dictionary definitions taken from elsewhere

Western philosophy

Western philosophy refers to the philosophical thought and work of the Western world. Historically, the term refers to the philosophical thinking of Western culture, beginning with the ancient Greek philosophy of the pre-Socratics. The word philosophy itself originated from the Ancient Greek philosophía (φιλοσοφία), literally, "the love of wisdom" (φιλεῖν phileîn, "to love" and σοφία sophía, "wisdom").

love
/lʌv/
noun

like or enjoy very much.

Definition of wisdom

: knowledge that is gained by having many experiences in life : the natural ability to understand things that most other people cannot understand : knowledge of what is proper or reasonable : good sense or judgment

Ancient Greek philosophy

The scope of ancient Western philosophy included the problems of philosophy as they are understood today; but it also included many other disciplines, such as pure mathematics and natural sciences such as physics, astronomy, and biology (Aristotle, for example, wrote on all of these topics).

20th-century philosophy and Contemporary philosophy (and 21 Century)

The three major contemporary approaches to academic philosophy are analytic philosophy, continental philosophy and pragmatism.[90] They are neither exhaustive nor mutually exclusive.

Since the Second World War, contemporary philosophy has been divided mostly into analytic and continental traditions; the former carried in the English speaking world and the latter on the continent of Europe.

I'd elaborate a little and add that to understand western civilisation one must understand Christianity and to understand Christianity (Platonism for the masses, as that wag Nietzsche said) one must have a good understanding of ancient Greek philosophy.

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Yadda

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Re: Western Culture
Reply #8 - Apr 12^th, 2021 at 7:19pm

I watched the ELO - Mr Blue Sky, OP.

It is a celebration of what ? Unreality ? "Things have never been so good" ?

Really ?

The truth is, that 'Western Culture' is in real crisis today. i.e. all societies, which claim 'possession' of 'Western Culture' are in real crisis today, imo.

ELO - Mr Blue Sky ????

....have your heard of the phrase, 'The Roaring 20's' ?

They thought 'things couldn't get any better' too !

The Roaring 20s: Culture, Life & Economy - HISTORY
https://www.history.com/topics/roaring-twenties/roaring-twenties-history

I would say that what Lily Allen sings of, is more emblematic of what 'Western Culture' is about, today.

Dictionary;
emblem = = a heraldic device or symbolic object as a distinctive badge of a nation, organization, or family. a symbol or symbolic representation.
– DERIVATIVES emblematic

[and, its a great song.]

------ >

Lily Allen - The Fear (Explicit)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-wGMlSuX_c

Quote:

Lily Allen - The Fear

I want to be rich and I want lots of money
I don't care about clever I don't care about funny
I want loads of clothes and buggerloads of diamonds
I heard people die while they are trying to find them

And I'll take my clothes off and it will be shameless
'Cause everyone knows that's how you get famous.

[Pre-chorus:]
I'll look at the sun and I'll look in the mirror
I'm on the right track, yeah I'm on to a winner.

[Chorus:]
I don't know what's right and what's real anymore
And I don't know how I'm meant to feel anymore
And when do you think it will all become clear?
'Cause I'm being taken over by the fear

Life's about film stars and less about mothers
It's all about fast cars and cussing each other
But it doesn't matter cause I'm packing plastic
And that's what makes my life so smacking fantastic
......
......

Dictionary;
nihilism = =
1 the rejection of all religious and moral principles, often in the belief that life is meaningless.
2 extreme scepticism, maintaining that nothing has a real existence.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Frank Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 45153 Gender:	Re: Western Culture Reply #9 - Apr 12^th, 2021 at 9:08pm As crap as the OP song.
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Bias_2012

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Re: Western Culture
Reply #10 - Apr 12^th, 2021 at 10:47pm

Yadda wrote on Apr 12^th, 2021 at 7:19pm:

The truth is, that 'Western Culture' is in real crisis today. i.e. all societies, which claim 'possession' of 'Western Culture' are in real crisis today, imo.

Have a little patience, we're getting to it, there's more to come, including the confusion caused by mixed cultures in the Western world

Pop songs are taken for granted in Western culture, but how many young folk know that freedom of expression was assured by Western culture, but at the same time fail to realize that pop music is taking over Western philosophy - not a good idea, we need to keep Western philosophy alive

Why Philosophy Should Become More Like Pop Music

When pop music started in a big way in the 1960s, it seemed at times like an especially silly medium, favoured by hormonal school girls and connected up with delinquent and tediously bizarre behaviour.

By contrast, philosophy had a reputation for being deeply serious and impressive – the natural home of the big ambition to understand ourselves and transform the world through ideas.

But since the 1960s, philosophy has stalled and pop has conquered the world. It is now the foremost medium for the articulation of ideas on a mass scale. This explains why, if it is to survive, philosophy must study pop; part of its salvation lies in understanding pop’s techniques so as to be able to become, in crucial ways, a little more like it.

There are a host of critical lessons philosophy can learn from pop. For a start, pop teaches us about charm. The great pop songs are bewitchingly, dazzlingly charming in the manner in which they get their messages across: they know exactly how to wear away our defences and enter our imaginations with easy grace. It’s a reminder that it isn’t enough for ideas to be correct. For them to become powerful and deliver on their promises, they need to know how to win over an audience. Pop is the most seductive force the world has ever known; it has more – and more devoted – adherents than all religions put together. It is more deeply loved, more trusted, and a more constant companion in our joys and sorrows than any other art form.

Read more here ....

https://www.theschooloflife.com/thebookoflife/philosophy-and-pop/

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Bias_2012

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Re: Western Culture
Reply #11 - Apr 12^th, 2021 at 11:23pm

Frank wrote on Apr 12^th, 2021 at 9:08pm:

As crap as the OP song.

Not necessarily, the OP song is about brightening your day. Yadda's song is about the excesses and perhaps abuse of Western culture

We don't need either of those, excesses and abuse, but we still need the freedom to express ourselves and put new ideas into action without government interference or censorship ... in other words, free enterprise, innovation and invention, within the law of course, but are excessive laws making it impossible to do anything these days?

Excessive and repressive laws could be dangerous to the survival of Western culture

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 84005 Proud pre-1850's NO Voter Gender:	Re: Western Culture Reply #12 - Apr 13^th, 2021 at 1:44am ... is excellent ... I would be content to see it just once....
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Yadda

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Re: Western Culture
Reply #13 - Apr 13^th, 2021 at 3:57pm

Once upon a time, in a land far, far away.....

Western Culture once seemed to encourage [personal] responsibility, human reason, and material innovation [i.e. science and its 'method'].

But societies today which claim 'possession' of THE VALUES of what we once knew as 'Western Culture' are, i would argue, 'philosophically' focused upon the pursuit of 1/ hedonism, and 2/ consumption. ??

And our 'education' systems seem to have been hijacked by social forces [i.e. 'social activists'] whose main objective seems to be; encouraging and teaching individuals how to cheat reasonable laws and reasonable rules and reasonable social conventions,
in order to pursue the '1/ and 2/' without earning the 'credit' to 'legitimately' do so.

I would argue, that today, we [in 'Western' nations] all live in a 'theft' focused society.

i.e.
'You may do anything that you want [i.e. desire] to do.'

'And if anybody pulls you up, and tries to hold you to account for [the consequences of] your actions, ...just insistently argue with them, that they have no right to try to hold you to account [for what you are doing/have done].'

It is LAWLESSNESS.

So called, 'Western societies' [today], are teaching LAWLESSNESS and social irresponsibility [as 'skill sets'], to its own children.

BLM, Greens, Trans activist politics, Extinction Rebellion, Critical Race Theory, POLITICIANS, and on, and on.

.

@ Frank, @Reply #9,

Yeah ?

Well excuse me, but i'm just a teenage girl who 'wants to have fun'. Tongue

And Lily Allen - The Fear, shows my generation what is really important in this life.

.

"It is no measure of health to be well-adjusted to a profoundly sick society."
- J. Krishnamurti

"Harmony makes small things grow, lack of it makes great things decay."
- Sallust / Bits & Pieces

"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter."
- Martin Luther King, Jr.

Why It's Called Made In America
Principles to Live By - 1942
1. You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift.
2. You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong
3. You cannot help the poor man by destroying the rich.
4. You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred.
5. You cannot build character and courage by taking away man's initiative and independence.
6. You cannot help small men by tearing down big men.
7. You cannot lift the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer.
8. You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than your income.
9. You cannot establish security on borrowed money.
10 You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they will not do for themselves.

William J. H. Boetcker, Presbyterian minister, 1942 Source: TruthOrFiction
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/l/lincoln-quotes.htm

"Glory follows virtue as if it were its shadow."
- Marcus Tullius Cicero, Roman Statesman

.

ARGUMENT;
The types of personal values which Western Culture was built upon ---- >

Quote:

What are the most important things in life? What do the
proverbs, the wise sayings of man through the ages, have to say
on this point? Let us search them. If we did so we would come
up with the following list:

   - the basic necessities (food and shelter)
   - a good wife (or spouse)
   - good health
   - a good conscience
   - a good name
   - wisdom, understanding, good sense, spiritual knowledge,
         understanding of ourselves and life

Now let us ask another question. What things are most commonly
pursued by man? What does the common, ordinary man pursue in
life? We can list them:

   - temporary pleasure (gratification of appetites)
   - material possessions, wealth
   - social position, being "important"
   - friendship, friends, acceptance by a group

http://solitaryroad.com/a398.html

.

Proverbs 29:18
Where there is no vision, the people perish: but he that keepeth the law, happy is he.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
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Bias_2012

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Re: Western Culture
Reply #14 - Apr 13^th, 2021 at 8:40pm

A little more on the origins of Western Culture at the time of the Roman Empire, then we can move on to later centuries to see how it develops throughout the ages

These are self explanatory ....

Concepts of what is the West arose out of legacies of the Western Roman Empire and the Eastern Roman Empire. Later, ideas of the West were formed by the concepts of Latin Christendom and the Holy Roman Empire.

What is thought of as Western thought today originates primarily from Greco-Roman and Germanic influences, and includes the ideals of the Middle Ages, the Renaissance, and the Enlightenment, as well as Christian culture.

Medieval Christianity is credited with creating the modern university, the modern hospital system, scientific economics, and natural law (which would later influence the creation of international law). Christianity played a role in ending practices common among pagan societies, such as human sacrifice, slavery, infanticide and polygamy

Let's not confuse Christianity with the Roman Catholic church. Christianity is a belief system in it's own right. The Roman Catholic church purports to be Christian, but at the end of the day, it's only a church, and hasn't always been Christian

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