Australian Politics Forum

Setanta

Gold Member

Offline

\/ Peace man!

Posts: 16520
Northern NSW
Gender: male

Re: Windows 11
Reply #15 - Jun 24^th, 2021 at 5:57pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 3:45pm:

I think Microsoft needs to figure out a way of undoing the superfluous programs that Windows has to offer. If someone wants a certain program, they should download it for themselves. But if the processor and RAM is getting increased with every generation of computer, then it is not a problem.

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/microsoft/how-to-remove-unwanted-apps-from...

Back to top

IP Logged

Gordon Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20499 Gordon Gender:	Re: Windows 11 Reply #16 - Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:31pm Can it...
Back to top	IBI IP Logged

Setanta

Gold Member

Offline

\/ Peace man!

Posts: 16520
Northern NSW
Gender: male

Re: Windows 11
Reply #17 - Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:41pm

Carl D wrote on Jun 23^rd, 2021 at 3:21pm:

lee wrote on Jun 23^rd, 2021 at 12:42pm:

Is it Unix/Linux based as rumoured?

I've seen the rumours too but the consensus of opinion seems to be "No".

Someone said it would probably be "corporate suicide" for Microsoft to do something like that.

You may both be confused, MS cannot use the Linux kernel for many reasons. What you both may be referring to is Windows Subsystem for Linux.

I haven't used it but I envision it to be something like Wine is to Linux. It will be interesting to see how it goes but I've been using Debian/Gnu since I gave up on OS/2 in about '96-7 and I'm not inclines to move to Windows for it. I'm happy where I am.

Back to top

« Last Edit: Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:49pm by Setanta »

IP Logged

Brian Ross

Gold Member

Offline

Representative of me

Posts: 40938

Re: Windows 11
Reply #18 - Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:48pm

Microsoft once referred to Linux as "Communism". Linux has a non-commercial license, something Microsoft cannot and will not commit to. Linux is a cleaner, more robust system than Windows. Windows is optimised for management via a centralised server and Linux is not. There are various work-arounds that cover that aspect of Linus use in the commercial workplace but they are not a core component of the Operating System. Windows suffers from poor security and poor interaction with the network. Linux does not. Roll Eyes

Back to top

Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

IP Logged

Setanta

Gold Member

Offline

\/ Peace man!

Posts: 16520
Northern NSW
Gender: male

Re: Windows 11
Reply #19 - Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:50pm

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:48pm:

Microsoft once referred to Linux as "Communism". Linux has a non-commercial license, something Microsoft cannot and will not commit to. Linux is a cleaner, more robust system than Windows. Windows is optimised for management via a centralised server and Linux is not. There are various work-arounds that cover that aspect of Linus use in the commercial workplace but they are not a core component of the Operating System. Windows suffers from poor security and poor interaction with the network. Linux does not. Roll Eyes

Do we have a Linux fanboi here?

Back to top

IP Logged

lee

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 17330
Gender: male

Re: Windows 11
Reply #20 - Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:55pm

Setanta wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:41pm:

You may both be confused, MS cannot use the Linux kernel for many reasons. What you both may be referring to is Windows Subsystem for Linux.

or not

"With Microsoft embracing Linux ever more tightly, might it do the heretofore unthinkable and dump the NT kernel in favor of the Linux kernel? No, I’m not ready for the funny farm. As it prepares Windows 11, Microsoft has been laying the groundwork for such a radical release.

I’ve long toyed with the idea that Microsoft could release a desktop Linux. Now I’ve started taking that idea more seriously — with a twist. Microsoft could replace Windows’ innards, the NT kernel, with a Linux kernel.

It would still look like Windows. For most users, it would still work like Windows. But the engine running it all would be Linux."

https://www.computerworld.com/article/3438856/call-me-crazy-but-windows-11-could...

"Linux-based Windows 12 Lite is '3x faster than Windows 10' and 'immune from ransomware'"

https://betanews.com/2020/02/10/linux-based-windows-12-lite/

Edit: "Windows 11 - Still not Linux-based"

https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&p=2027906

Back to top

« Last Edit: Jun 24^th, 2021 at 7:00pm by lee »

IP Logged

Setanta

Gold Member

Offline

\/ Peace man!

Posts: 16520
Northern NSW
Gender: male

Re: Windows 11
Reply #21 - Jun 24^th, 2021 at 7:18pm

lee wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:55pm:

Setanta wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:41pm:

You may both be confused, MS cannot use the Linux kernel for many reasons. What you both may be referring to is Windows Subsystem for Linux.

or not

"With Microsoft embracing Linux ever more tightly, might it do the heretofore unthinkable and dump the NT kernel in favor of the Linux kernel? No, I’m not ready for the funny farm. As it prepares Windows 11, Microsoft has been laying the groundwork for such a radical release.

I’ve long toyed with the idea that Microsoft could release a desktop Linux. Now I’ve started taking that idea more seriously — with a twist. Microsoft could replace Windows’ innards, the NT kernel, with a Linux kernel.

It would still look like Windows. For most users, it would still work like Windows. But the engine running it all would be Linux."

https://www.computerworld.com/article/3438856/call-me-crazy-but-windows-11-could...

"Linux-based Windows 12 Lite is '3x faster than Windows 10' and 'immune from ransomware'"

https://betanews.com/2020/02/10/linux-based-windows-12-lite/

Edit: "Windows 11 - Still not Linux-based"

https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=58&p=2027906

I'd like to see it but I don't imagine MS would base their OS on another's kernel that must be open sourced. No BSD licence. Windows would have been a better OS from the get go if they follow what they were supposed to do, with IBM and OS/2.

Back to top

IP Logged

Brian Ross

Gold Member

Offline

Representative of me

Posts: 40938

Re: Windows 11
Reply #22 - Jun 24^th, 2021 at 8:10pm

Setanta wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:50pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:48pm:

Microsoft once referred to Linux as "Communism". Linux has a non-commercial license, something Microsoft cannot and will not commit to. Linux is a cleaner, more robust system than Windows. Windows is optimised for management via a centralised server and Linux is not. There are various work-arounds that cover that aspect of Linus use in the commercial workplace but they are not a core component of the Operating System. Windows suffers from poor security and poor interaction with the network. Linux does not. Roll Eyes

Do we have a Linux fanboi here?

You have a Linux/Unix Systems Engineer here, Set. Got a problem with someone making his professional living from a real OS?

Back to top

Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

IP Logged

Setanta

Gold Member

Offline

\/ Peace man!

Posts: 16520
Northern NSW
Gender: male

Re: Windows 11
Reply #23 - Jun 24^th, 2021 at 8:57pm

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 8:10pm:

Setanta wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:50pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:48pm:

Microsoft once referred to Linux as "Communism". Linux has a non-commercial license, something Microsoft cannot and will not commit to. Linux is a cleaner, more robust system than Windows. Windows is optimised for management via a centralised server and Linux is not. There are various work-arounds that cover that aspect of Linus use in the commercial workplace but they are not a core component of the Operating System. Windows suffers from poor security and poor interaction with the network. Linux does not. Roll Eyes

Do we have a Linux fanboi here?

You have a Linux/Unix Systems Engineer here, Set. Got a problem with someone making his professional living from a real OS?

Depends, is a real OS only the one you run? Are you as much of an OS bigot as you are elsewhere in your psyche?

Back to top

IP Logged

Brian Ross

Gold Member

Offline

Representative of me

Posts: 40938

Re: Windows 11
Reply #24 - Jun 25^th, 2021 at 2:43pm

Setanta wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 8:57pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 8:10pm:

Setanta wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:50pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:48pm:

Microsoft once referred to Linux as "Communism". Linux has a non-commercial license, something Microsoft cannot and will not commit to. Linux is a cleaner, more robust system than Windows. Windows is optimised for management via a centralised server and Linux is not. There are various work-arounds that cover that aspect of Linus use in the commercial workplace but they are not a core component of the Operating System. Windows suffers from poor security and poor interaction with the network. Linux does not. Roll Eyes

Do we have a Linux fanboi here?

You have a Linux/Unix Systems Engineer here, Set. Got a problem with someone making his professional living from a real OS?

Depends, is a real OS only the one you run? Are you as much of an OS bigot as you are elsewhere in your psyche?

Windows is a useless OS for servers. It is adequate for use on PCs. It has, I admit superior PC management tools. Linux can nearly match in that regard. Windows though is insecure and stupid in how it handles ACLs.

Back to top

Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

IP Logged

Setanta

Gold Member

Offline

\/ Peace man!

Posts: 16520
Northern NSW
Gender: male

Re: Windows 11
Reply #25 - Jun 25^th, 2021 at 6:47pm

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 25^th, 2021 at 2:43pm:

Setanta wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 8:57pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 8:10pm:

Setanta wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:50pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:48pm:

Microsoft once referred to Linux as "Communism". Linux has a non-commercial license, something Microsoft cannot and will not commit to. Linux is a cleaner, more robust system than Windows. Windows is optimised for management via a centralised server and Linux is not. There are various work-arounds that cover that aspect of Linus use in the commercial workplace but they are not a core component of the Operating System. Windows suffers from poor security and poor interaction with the network. Linux does not. Roll Eyes

Do we have a Linux fanboi here?

You have a Linux/Unix Systems Engineer here, Set. Got a problem with someone making his professional living from a real OS?

Depends, is a real OS only the one you run? Are you as much of an OS bigot as you are elsewhere in your psyche?

Windows is a useless OS for servers. It is adequate for use on PCs. It has, I admit superior PC management tools. Linux can nearly match in that regard. Windows though is insecure and stupid in how it handles ACLs.

I wish Linux had nested group ACLs.

I suppose I'm just not as vocally rabid as you. I don't care what OS people choose. I did net/sys admin/build a school from no network to Linux server with 400 Windows clients using LDAP and Samba. I also helped build a local ISP back in the late '90s, about '98 that was linux based 50 modem. It died with the expansion of big ISPs. It's not a hosting service. The other half of the business was, making/selling/suporting PCs is still going and is in Casino now. I did consulting with them for dealing with WinNT servers.

I guess I have been guilty of posting here that Windows belongs in a VM.

Back to top

IP Logged

Brian Ross

Gold Member

Offline

Representative of me

Posts: 40938

Re: Windows 11
Reply #26 - Jun 25^th, 2021 at 8:36pm

Setanta wrote on Jun 25^th, 2021 at 6:47pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 25^th, 2021 at 2:43pm:

Setanta wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 8:57pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 8:10pm:

Setanta wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:50pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 24^th, 2021 at 6:48pm:

Microsoft once referred to Linux as "Communism". Linux has a non-commercial license, something Microsoft cannot and will not commit to. Linux is a cleaner, more robust system than Windows. Windows is optimised for management via a centralised server and Linux is not. There are various work-arounds that cover that aspect of Linus use in the commercial workplace but they are not a core component of the Operating System. Windows suffers from poor security and poor interaction with the network. Linux does not. Roll Eyes

Do we have a Linux fanboi here?

You have a Linux/Unix Systems Engineer here, Set. Got a problem with someone making his professional living from a real OS?

Depends, is a real OS only the one you run? Are you as much of an OS bigot as you are elsewhere in your psyche?

Windows is a useless OS for servers. It is adequate for use on PCs. It has, I admit superior PC management tools. Linux can nearly match in that regard. Windows though is insecure and stupid in how it handles ACLs.

I wish Linux had nested group ACLs.

Doesn't need them. Windows doesn't do ACLs at all well. They are clumsy and difficult to administer easily.

Quote:

I suppose I'm just not as vocally rabid as you.

Because I spoke up, I am "vocally rabid"? I find your claims about my views rather bizarre.

Quote:

I don't care what OS people choose.

Neither do I, particularly. There are swings and roundabouts and to deny them is in itself rather silly IMO. People are familiar with Windoze. They choose Windoze. Most people are scared of the unfamiliar and they are not familiar with Linux. They do not understand the problems with a home OS like Windoze.

Quote:

I did net/sys admin/build a school from no network to Linux server with 400 Windows clients using LDAP and Samba. I also helped build a local ISP back in the late '90s, about '98 that was linux based 50 modem. It died with the expansion of big ISPs. It's not a hosting service. The other half of the business was, making/selling/suporting PCs is still going and is in Casino now. I did consulting with them for dealing with WinNT servers.

I guess I have been guilty of posting here that Windows belongs in a VM.

I have used computers for over 40 years. I have programmed mainframes. I have administered minis. I have administered NT and Windoze servers and PCs. I have administered Linux servers. They all have problems. I think the biggest problem with Windoze machines in the people that use them. Roll Eyes

Back to top

Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

IP Logged

Setanta

Gold Member

Offline

\/ Peace man!

Posts: 16520
Northern NSW
Gender: male

Re: Windows 11
Reply #27 - Jun 28^th, 2021 at 7:35pm

I called you a fanboi because you tend to throw what you use and what you think of other OSs in the wrong discussions, such as this thread we are in and the one you imposed on over at https://www.polanimal.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=66&t=18333&start=10#p303978

When you do this in a thread about Windows, why do you think it's good form to throw out the equivalent of "I use Linux, dumbarses use Windoze!" That's what a fanboi does.

Back to top

IP Logged

Setanta

Gold Member

Offline

\/ Peace man!

Posts: 16520
Northern NSW
Gender: male

Re: Windows 11
Reply #28 - Jun 28^th, 2021 at 7:45pm

Quote:

Re: Win11 is almost here.
Post by brian ross » Fri Jun 25, 2021 6:19 pm

Jovial Monk wrote: ↑Thu Jun 24, 2021 9:14 pm
brian ross wrote: ↑Thu Jun 24, 2021 9:06 pm
Linux is a better OS than Windoze. Far better. No ransomware for Linux. :roll: :roll:
MacOS is even better tho!
MacOS is a branded version of Linux.

WTF?

Linux is a Kernel. MacOS is based on the BSD Kernel. The BSD license allows commercial use and even the Gnu/Linux systems we use as well as Windows has/had it's share of BSD licensed code. OSX is BSD, not Linux.

Back to top

« Last Edit: Jun 28^th, 2021 at 7:50pm by Setanta »

IP Logged

Carl D

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 9346
Rivervale, Perth
Gender: male

Re: Windows 11
Reply #29 - Jun 29^th, 2021 at 1:44am

Well, it doesn't look like either of my desktop PC's will be able to run Windows 11 since it apparently will only run on 8th Generation CPU's and above.

The CPU's for two PC's I have here are as follows:

4th Generation Intel(R) Core(TM) i3-4160 CPU @ 3.60GHz (Haswell). ASUS H81M-PLUS motherboard. Which is the one I'm using right now.

7th Generation Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-7600 CPU @ 3.50GHz (Kaby Lake). Gigabyte B250M-D3H motherboard.

Oddly enough, the little 11 inch Lenovo laptop I bought a few weeks back should be able to run Windows 11 with its Intel(R) Celeron N4020 CPU. But, I probably won't bother and just leave Windows 10 on it.

Lots of people are annoyed about this "8th Generation and above CPU's only" BS from Microsoft and quite a few of them (myself included) believe it is a ploy to boost new computer/component sales.

At least Windows 10 is still supported for another 4 years. Unless Microsoft change their minds, of course.

(I still haven't tried installing the Windows 11 ISO I mentioned in my first post on the desktop PC's or the laptop and I probably won't bother now).

Back to top

« Last Edit: Jun 29^th, 2021 at 10:22am by Carl D »

** Repeat Covid infections exercise our immune system in the same way that repeat concussions exercise our brain **

IP Logged