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Socialism (Read 14007 times)
Frank
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Re: Socialism
Reply #105 - Nov 17th, 2021 at 7:30am
 
An attempted communist “act of repudiation” failed in Cuba on Monday at the home of the family of political prisoner Andy García Lorenzo, where his family took the opportunity to sing protest songs and chant in the faces of its would-be repressors.

García, 23, is among the estimated thousands arrested on July 11, a day during which human rights groups believe nearly 200,000 people on the island took the streets to demand an end to the 62-year-old communist regime there. The Castro dictatorship responded to widespread peaceful protests with disproportionate violence, engaging in public beatings, arrests, and shootings of suspected dissidents – and even witnesses to the protests – in the aftermath of the event.




Everyone loves socialism - except the people.

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thegreatdivide
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Re: Socialism
Reply #106 - Nov 17th, 2021 at 12:39pm
 
Frank wrote on Nov 17th, 2021 at 7:30am:
An attempted communist “act of repudiation” failed in Cuba on Monday at the home of the family of political prisoner Andy García Lorenzo, where his family took the opportunity to sing protest songs and chant in the faces of its would-be repressors.

García, 23, is among the estimated thousands arrested on July 11, a day during which human rights groups believe nearly 200,000 people on the island took the streets to demand an end to the 62-year-old communist regime there. The Castro dictatorship responded to widespread peaceful protests with disproportionate violence, engaging in public beatings, arrests, and shootings of suspected dissidents – and even witnesses to the protests – in the aftermath of the event.

Everyone loves socialism - except the people.


You can't answer reply #103? Doesn't fit with your ideological anti-'socialist' rant?

Note; politics is a contest between  outcomes generated by private sector self-interest, and collective prosperity achieved by government planning, the latter being  necessary because people have widely different abilities to compete in private sector markets.

The society that best achieves a synthesis of these two opposing principles  via  its political system, will be the most successful in raisng living standards for all.

I can see an uncomprehending  US becoming increasingly desperate in the next decade, as the Chinese economy continues on its unstoppable growth trajectory...
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Grappler Deep State Feller
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Re: Socialism
Reply #107 - Nov 17th, 2021 at 1:53pm
 
Frank wrote on Nov 17th, 2021 at 7:30am:
An attempted communist “act of repudiation” failed in Cuba on Monday at the home of the family of political prisoner Andy García Lorenzo, where his family took the opportunity to sing protest songs and chant in the faces of its would-be repressors.

García, 23, is among the estimated thousands arrested on July 11, a day during which human rights groups believe nearly 200,000 people on the island took the streets to demand an end to the 62-year-old communist regime there. The Castro dictatorship responded to widespread peaceful protests with disproportionate violence, engaging in public beatings, arrests, and shootings of suspected dissidents – and even witnesses to the protests – in the aftermath of the event.




Everyone loves socialism - except the people.



You said 'communism' then segued into 'socialism..... I'm afraid you can't do that kind of maneuver without flaps and full power... you'll stall at the top of your flip......
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Frank
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Re: Socialism
Reply #108 - Nov 17th, 2021 at 2:01pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 17th, 2021 at 12:39pm:
Frank wrote on Nov 17th, 2021 at 7:30am:
An attempted communist “act of repudiation” failed in Cuba on Monday at the home of the family of political prisoner Andy García Lorenzo, where his family took the opportunity to sing protest songs and chant in the faces of its would-be repressors.

García, 23, is among the estimated thousands arrested on July 11, a day during which human rights groups believe nearly 200,000 people on the island took the streets to demand an end to the 62-year-old communist regime there. The Castro dictatorship responded to widespread peaceful protests with disproportionate violence, engaging in public beatings, arrests, and shootings of suspected dissidents – and even witnesses to the protests – in the aftermath of the event.

Everyone loves socialism - except the people.


You can't answer reply #103? Doesn't fit with your ideological anti-'socialist' rant?

Note; politics is a contest between  outcomes generated by private sector self-interest, and collective prosperity achieved by government planning, the latter being  necessary because people have widely different abilities to compete in private sector markets.

The society that best achieves a synthesis of these two opposing principles  via  its political system, will be the most successful in raising living standards for all.

I can see an uncomprehending  US becoming increasingly desperate in the next decade, as the Chinese economy continues on its unstoppable growth trajectory...



The Chinese are migrating to the West. Westerners are not migrating to China. Why?
Because human flourishing is NOT just economic, although the US and the West provide a better economic foundation for human flourishing than China, with its $12/day 'success story'.

The worst thing about China and socialism is the brutal, oppressive manner in which the communist vanguard drive, control and stifle their people in a 'competition' with the capitalist West. Like the Soviets, they focus on increasing production numbers of steel, concrete, consumer goods (exported to the West who can pay for them), lengths of rail and roads etc (from a very very low base).

But they never crow about how unhappy their people are - coming in at 82nd, between Congo and Ivory Coast.
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/happiest-countries-in-the-wor...

Human Development index:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index
Top 50 = Western countries plus HK, Singapore, Japan, S Korea and a smattering of oil rich sheikdoms.

China, Cuba, N Korea - nowhere.







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« Last Edit: Nov 17th, 2021 at 2:06pm by Frank »  

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thegreatdivide
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Re: Socialism
Reply #109 - Nov 19th, 2021 at 12:16am
 
Frank wrote on Nov 17th, 2021 at 2:01pm:
The Chinese are migrating to the West. Westerners are not migrating to China. Why?


Plenty of Westerners set up businesses in China, in the heady days of 10% growth. But now geopolitics (ie US paranoia) is destroying the opportunities.


Quote:
Because human flourishing is NOT just economic, although the US and the West provide a better economic foundation for human flourishing than China, with its $12/day 'success story'.


Er.. was it you who said China has double the number of billionaires as the US?  In any case China has a middle class of 400 million people, bigger than the US. 

Quote:
The worst thing about China and socialism is the brutal, oppressive manner in which the communist vanguard drive, control and stifle their people in a 'competition' with the capitalist West.


Actually "socialist" China has strayed down the free market road for too long, hence Xi's call to strive for common prosperity, now that a middle class bigger than the US has been achieved. Meanwhile half the US population can't find $600 dollars from savings in an emergency, no nice holidays or freedom from financial stress for them.

  https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/11/just-39percent-of-americans-could-pay-for-a-1000-emergency-expense.html

Quote:
Like the Soviets, they focus on increasing production numbers of steel, concrete, consumer goods (exported to the West who can pay for them), lengths of rail and roads etc (from a very very low base).


No they are focusing on 'common prosperity'...and developing world leading AI and IT.

Quote:
But they never crow about how unhappy their people are - coming in at 82nd, between Congo and Ivory Coast.
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/happiest-countries-in-the-wor...

Human Development index:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index
Top 50 = Western countries plus HK, Singapore, Japan, S Korea and a smattering of oil rich sheikdoms.

China, Cuba, N Korea - nowhere.


Chinese satisfaction with their government, >90%.

https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2020/07/long-term-survey-reveals-chinese-
government-satisfaction/

T"he survey team found that compared to public opinion patterns in the U.S., in China there was very high satisfaction with the central government. In 2016, the last year the survey was conducted, 95.5 percent of respondents were either “relatively satisfied” or “highly satisfied” with Beijing"



The US? Hyper-partisanship in a divided society resulting in the Jan 6th riots, and claims of a rigged election.






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Bobby.
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Re: Socialism
Reply #110 - Nov 19th, 2021 at 6:42am
 
Socialism?

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Socialism.jpg (165 KB | 7 )
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Frank
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Re: Socialism
Reply #111 - Nov 19th, 2021 at 7:25am
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 19th, 2021 at 12:16am:
Chinese satisfaction with their government, >90%.

https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2020/07/long-term-survey-reveals-chinese-
government-satisfaction/

T"he survey team found that compared to public opinion patterns in the U.S., in China there was very high satisfaction with the central government. In 2016, the last year the survey was conducted, 95.5 percent of respondents were either “relatively satisfied” or “highly satisfied” with Beijing"




Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin
Thank you, that made my day.
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Re: Socialism
Reply #112 - Nov 20th, 2021 at 2:16pm
 
Frank wrote on Nov 19th, 2021 at 7:25am:
Thank you, that made my day.


Good, but it's a pity you are content with - blind to - the hyper-partisanship and entrenched poverty in your own nation, while bleating on about 'socialism', whatever that is.
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Frank
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Re: Socialism
Reply #113 - Nov 20th, 2021 at 2:34pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 20th, 2021 at 2:16pm:
Frank wrote on Nov 19th, 2021 at 7:25am:
Thank you, that made my day.


Good, but it's a pity you are content with - blind to - the hyper-partisanship and entrenched poverty in your own nation, while bleating on about 'socialism', whatever that is.



Oh? So now you don't know what socialism is but defend and advocate for it anyway.  I quoted authoritative sources and provided links from https://www.marxists.org/ .  If you still dont know what socialism is then you will never know. Using emotionally incontinent Global Times Chinese socialis rhetoric  - hyper, entrenched, bleating - indicates that you are actively blind to what it is - or you are a very eager little propagandist FOR it.


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thegreatdivide
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Re: Socialism
Reply #114 - Nov 20th, 2021 at 5:05pm
 
Frank wrote on Nov 20th, 2021 at 2:34pm:
Oh? So now you don't know what socialism is but defend and advocate for it anyway. 


No, I advocate for sustainable shared prosperity.

Whereas you turn a blind eye the the hyper-partisanship and entrenched poverty ravaging the democracies, while bleating about historical examples of "socialism" that have no relevance to today's national and global macro-economic  problems.   
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Re: Socialism
Reply #115 - Nov 20th, 2021 at 8:00pm
 
Frank wrote on Nov 14th, 2021 at 9:56am:
Dnarever wrote on Nov 13th, 2021 at 7:06pm:
Amazing how important socialism is to the right when there has not been a prominent socialist present in over 80 years.

In fact the biggest threat from socialism is the rights socialism for the wealthy which is alive, well and supported by the anti socialists.



What IS socialism to your mind, ducky?  Are you able to articulate it? Dare you?

None of thd other pro-socialism bozos here are willing or able to articulate their understanding (?) of socialism.  They think it just means 'noice'.




Who ever said that I am pro socialism. You have repeatedly proven that you have no idea what it is. Is this the reason you want for me to tell you ?
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Frank
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Re: Socialism
Reply #116 - Nov 21st, 2021 at 12:03am
 
Dnarever wrote on Nov 20th, 2021 at 8:00pm:
Frank wrote on Nov 14th, 2021 at 9:56am:
Dnarever wrote on Nov 13th, 2021 at 7:06pm:
Amazing how important socialism is to the right when there has not been a prominent socialist present in over 80 years.

In fact the biggest threat from socialism is the rights socialism for the wealthy which is alive, well and supported by the anti socialists.


What IS socialism to your mind, ducky?  Are you able to articulate it? Dare you?

None of thd other pro-socialism bozos here are willing or able to articulate their understanding (?) of socialism.  They think it just means 'noice'.




Who ever said that I am pro socialism. You have repeatedly proven that you have no idea what it is. Is this the reason you want for me to tell you ?

What IS socialism to your mind, ducky? Are you able to say?

No.

...
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Re: Socialism
Reply #117 - Nov 22nd, 2021 at 3:04pm
 
Frank wrote on Nov 21st, 2021 at 12:03am:
What IS socialism to your mind, ducky? Are you able to say?


Are YOU able to consider an economy that works for all?

....which is Bernie Sanders' definition of 'socialism', not bogged down by historical precedents which have nothing to do with the current global reality, in which the market economy has achieved global dominance after the fall of the USSR.

You are just using your anti-"socialist"  rant to avoid  implementation of an economy that works for all,  to serve your own greedy purposes.


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Re: Socialism
Reply #118 - Nov 22nd, 2021 at 8:22pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 20th, 2021 at 5:05pm:
Frank wrote on Nov 20th, 2021 at 2:34pm:
Oh? So now you don't know what socialism is but defend and advocate for it anyway. 


No, I advocate for sustainable shared prosperity.

Whereas you turn a blind eye the the hyper-partisanship and entrenched poverty ravaging the democracies, while bleating about historical examples of "socialism" that have no relevance to today's national and global macro-economic  problems.   


No you don't! You advocate for sitting around and feeling entitled to grab as many free handouts for yourself as you can while others do the hard yards.

Not only are YOU greedy and selfish....you're also dishonest in describing yourself as an advocate for sustainable shared prosperity. Those key words are the very basis of left wing BS extremist propaganda.

Actually while I have you here....where are you posting from? You're definitely not from Australia. 

Edit : No need to answer. You're a paid troll posting from outside Australia. All good.

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Frank
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Re: Socialism
Reply #119 - Nov 22nd, 2021 at 8:35pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Nov 22nd, 2021 at 3:04pm:
Frank wrote on Nov 21st, 2021 at 12:03am:
What IS socialism to your mind, ducky? Are you able to say?


Are YOU able to consider an economy that works for all?

....which is Bernie Sanders' definition of 'socialism', not bogged down by historical precedents which have nothing to do with the current global reality, in which the market economy has achieved global dominance after the fall of the USSR.

You are just using your anti-"socialist"  rant to avoid  implementation of an economy that works for all,  to serve your own greedy purposes.



Every economy works for all.  Just not equally, regardless of effort and contribution.  The question is - what to reward and what not to.
Equality - ie an economy that works for all,  regardless of contribution and effort - is idiotic. It's the socialist eyewash that seduces the stupid, the resentful and the envious .





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