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Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock (Read 4994 times)
thegreatdivide
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #30 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:22am
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 9:00am:
No. The US has had periods of building infrastructure on a gargantuan scale for hundreds of years.


Er..seen on TV last night: "The $4 billion LaGuadia Airport upgrade in NY is first large scale development in the US for 25 years." 
Meanwhile:
"According to the World Economic Forum's Global Competitiveness Report, in 2019, the United States ranked thirteenth in the world [PDF] in a broad measure of infrastructure quality—down from fifth place in 2002.

In contrast, China poured more cement 2010-2013 than the US in the ENTIRE 20th century, and now has the world's longest high-speed rail network. 

Quote:
And not just itself. The US was the major partner that rebuilt western Europe... Around the time that Mao was organising the great leap backwards.


And now even Gemany's infrastructure is lagging:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-31/blame-germany-s-red-tape-and-thrift-for-ailing-infrastructure

"Blame Red Tape for Germany’s Ailing Infrastructure
"Germany needs to start spending to make up for years of underinvestment, and there’s a ton of money on the table if political parties agree on terms to form a new government.

IF they agree....nah,  adversarial politics is all about greed, not sustainable development to achieve common prosperity.

Hence those street scenes from Philadelphia....

Quote:
And flying to the moon as Mao was destroying civilisation in China.


Your blind ideology has rendered you incapable of rational debate. The 'Great Leap Forward' - over half a century ago -  is recognized by the CCP today as a major mistake.

And it is likely China will have the world's only operating space station, when the ISS closes down in 5 years time. 

But unlike the gridlocked system in the US with its adversarial 2 party hyper-partisan rabble, where Repubs don't want to spend public money, China in the last 4 decades has been relentlessly implementing its 5-year development plans on target, showing the advantage of a consensus one-party meritocracy.

Quote:
There's nothing we can learn from China under the boot of the Chinese cartel, except how to watch a slow-moving train wreck.


That "train wreck" occurred 60 years ago.

Moving forward to now, we can certainly look in horror at the divided Dems in the US congress  who, despite controlling  the presidency, house and senate,  have seen spending plans cut back from $8 trillion  to $1 trillion.
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« Last Edit: Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:39am by thegreatdivide »  
 
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Jasin
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #31 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:26am
 
Having only one race in your nation is like having only x1 spoke in your 'gene pool' wheel. You're going to break a wheel.
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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Gordon
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #32 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:31am
 
Jasin wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:26am:
Having only one race in your nation is like having only x1 spoke in your 'gene pool' wheel. You're going to break a wheel.


Like when people say muslims are discriminated against.

Most Muslims countries are ninety something % Muslim.
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Jasin
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #33 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:34am
 
Easy living in a suburb where everyone is exactly like you.
That's China.
It's a flawed nation, flawed Economy and if it had to open up and let every other race in like many other nations do - China would Collapse pure and simple.
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #34 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:40am
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:22am:
NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 9:00am:
No. The US has had periods of building infrastructure on a gargantuan scale for hundreds of years.


Er..seen on TV last night: "The $4 billion LaGuadia Airport upgrade in NY is first large scale development in the US for 25 years." 
Meanwhile:
"According to the World Economic Forum's Global Competitiveness Report, in 2019, the United States ranked thirteenth in the world [PDF] in a broad measure of infrastructure quality—down from fifth place in 2002.

In contrast, China poured more cement 2010-2013 than the US in the ENTIRE 20th century, and now has the world's longest high-speed rail network. 

Quote:
And not just itself. The US was the major partner that rebuilt western Europe... Around the time that Mao was organising the great leap backwards.


And now even Gemany's infrastructure is lagging:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-31/blame-germany-s-red-tape-and-thrift-for-ailing-infrastructure

"Blame Red Tape for Germany’s Ailing Infrastructure
"Germany needs to start spending to make up for years of underinvestment, and there’s a ton of money on the table if political parties agree on terms to form a new government.

IF they agree....nah,  adversarial politics is all about greed, not sustainable development to achieve common prosperity.

Hence those street scenes from Philadelphia....

Quote:
And flying to the moon as Mao was destroying civilisation in China.


Your blind ideology has rendered you incapable of rational debate. The 'Great Leap Forward' - over half a century ago -  is recognized by the CCP today as a major mistake.

But unlike the gridlocked system in the US with its adversarial 2 party hyper-partisan rabble, where Repubs don't want to spend public money, China in the last 4 decades has been relentlessly implementing its 5-year development plans on target, showing the advantage of a consensus one-party meritocracy.

Quote:
There's nothing we can learn from China under the boot of the Chinese cartel, except how to watch a slow-moving train wreck.


That "train wreck" occurred 60 years ago.

Moving forward to now, we can certainly look in horror at the divided Dems in the US congress  who, despite controlling  the presidency, house and senate,  have seen spending plans cut back from $8 trillion  to $1 trillion.

How's the property industry under the Chinese cartel? Any sight of the tunnel's end for Evergrande?

I have seen some of the 'cement' poured in China... Cut with mashed cardboard to extend it (usually to counter the massive bribery paid to cartel officials).

I've read how the provinces 'meet' their '5-year' development plans 'targets'.

The Chinese cartel does not run on meritocracy.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #35 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:52am
 
Jasin wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:34am:
Easy living in a suburb where everyone is exactly like you.
That's China.
It's a flawed nation, flawed Economy and if it had to open up and let every other race in like many other nations do - China would Collapse pure and simple.


Can you actually debate the issues eg outlined in #30, rather than just assert:
1. It's easy living in a unicultural community.
2. multi culturalism would cause collapse in China

Point 1 is simplistic: eg, unicultural Spain had a civil war

Point 2. ignores history, the New World was based on immigration from the Old World.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #36 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 11:14am
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:40am:
How's the property industry under the Chinese cartel?


Notice how the blind ideologue cherry picks the points to which he will reply.   

Quote:
How's the property industry under the Chinese cartel? Any sight of the tunnel's end for Evergrande?


One thing for sure, Evergrande will not bring down the entire global economy, as the sick US system did in the GFC. The CCP will deal with Evergrande's debt problem,  because the CCP is not beholden to greedy "invisible hand" markets like the US is.  (Although the US government was forced to prop up its own economy when Lehman went bust...)

Quote:
I have seen some of the 'cement' poured in China... Cut with mashed cardboard to extend it (usually to counter the massive bribery paid to cartel officials).


Yet those numerous sky-scapers - built with "cardboard" cement in many  Chinese cities - appear to be holding up as well as those in the US. (careful how you reply... remember the Florida condominium...)

Quote:
I've read how the provinces 'meet' their '5-year' development plans 'targets'.


You have? Good. Then you will know the plans are invariably implemented. especially in R&D.   

Quote:
The Chinese cartel does not run on meritocracy.


The most able politicians advised by the smartest people?

Compared to film stars advised by the greediest people...in the US plutocracy...
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #37 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 11:25am
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 11:14am:
NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 10:40am:
How's the property industry under the Chinese cartel?


Notice how the blind ideologue cherry picks the points to which he will reply.   

Quote:
How's the property industry under the Chinese cartel? Any sight of the tunnel's end for Evergrande?


One thing for sure, Evergrande will not bring down the entire global economy, as the sick US system did in the GFC. The CCP will deal with Evergrande's debt problem,  because the CCP is not beholden to greedy "invisible hand" markets like the US is.  (Although the US government was forced to prop up its own economy when Lehman went bust...)

Quote:
I have seen some of the 'cement' poured in China... Cut with mashed cardboard to extend it (usually to counter the massive bribery paid to cartel officials).


Yet those numerous sky-scapers - built with "cardboard" cement in many  Chinese cities - appear to be holding up as well as those in the US. (careful how you reply... remember the Florida condominium...)

Quote:
I've read how the provinces 'meet' their '5-year' development plans 'targets'.


You have? Good. Then you will know the plans are invariably implemented. especially in R&D.   

Quote:
The Chinese cartel does not run on meritocracy.


The most able politicians advised by the smartest people?

Compared to film stars advised by the greediest people...in the US plutocracy...

The number of videos of tofu building collapses (those that have escaped the gravity of the cartel's censorship) outnumber Florida probaby by at least 10 to 1. How many have collapsed, the evidence for which has not escaped censorship, I wonder.

The provinces 'meet' their '5-year' development plans 'targets' by reporting whatever it is the cartel wants them to report. Truth or lies is of no consequence to the cartel, so long as it can report 'success'. The same was true of pandemic numbers, until the cartel gave up on collating stats.

The most powerful cartel members are advised by the most loyal to the respective cartel faction. Desmond Shum recounts how this respect and loyalty is demonstrated, the most ridiculous is when they are toasting each other with a glass of alcohol.

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thegreatdivide
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #38 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 11:31am
 
From a SCMP article today (SCMP is anti CCP media based in HK):
Chinese graduates lament Western degrees no longer a fast track for top jobs

“International students are always treated like cash cows, unfortunately,” he said. “Western universities rely a lot on the fees that overseas students pay for their income, but some don’t provide the kind of service that is of equal value.
Graduates like Chen and Wu said ultimately they felt more comfortable in China, something that influenced their decision to return.
I prefer China’s living conditions and environment, people are friendlier to me and easier to deal with,” Chen said
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #39 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 11:48am
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 11:25am:
The number of videos of tofu building collapses (those that have escaped the gravity of the cartel's censorship) outnumber Florida probaby by at least 10 to 1. How many have collapsed, the evidence for which has not escaped censorship, I wonder.


See... still cherry picking again, ignoring the majority of the original post.  So now it's a matter of "probably" 10 to 1? ignoring the fact that China has built more than 10 times as many sky-scrapers as the US in the last 4 decades.

Quote:
The provinces 'meet' their '5-year' development plans 'targets' by reporting whatever it is the cartel wants them to report. Truth or lies is of no consequence to the cartel, so long as it can report 'success'. The same was true of pandemic numbers, until the cartel gave up on collating stats.


The 5 -year plans mostly refer to national development. Corruption at the regional level is  being successfully countered by Xi as is widely acknowledged, even by the SCMP: "Xi's anti-corruption campaign has already yielded significant results that have been more successful than measures that preceded it".

Quote:
The most powerful cartel members are advised by the most loyal to the respective cartel faction. Desmond Shum recounts how this respect and loyalty is demonstrated, the most ridiculous is when they are toasting each other with a glass of alcohol.


Er...looks like a scene in any Western company boardroom, the difference being the company has no state-endorsed social responsibility quidelines  to follow at all.   


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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #40 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 12:26pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 11:48am:
NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 11:25am:
The number of videos of tofu building collapses (those that have escaped the gravity of the cartel's censorship) outnumber Florida probaby by at least 10 to 1. How many have collapsed, the evidence for which has not escaped censorship, I wonder.


See... still cherry picking again, ignoring the majority of the original post.  So now it's a matter of "probably" 10 to 1? ignoring the fact that China has built more than 10 times as many sky-scrapers as the US in the last 4 decades.

Quote:
The provinces 'meet' their '5-year' development plans 'targets' by reporting whatever it is the cartel wants them to report. Truth or lies is of no consequence to the cartel, so long as it can report 'success'. The same was true of pandemic numbers, until the cartel gave up on collating stats.


The 5 -year plans mostly refer to national development. Corruption at the regional level is  being successfully countered by Xi as is widely acknowledged, even by the SCMP: "Xi's anti-corruption campaign has already yielded significant results that have been more successful than measures that preceded it".

Quote:
The most powerful cartel members are advised by the most loyal to the respective cartel faction. Desmond Shum recounts how this respect and loyalty is demonstrated, the most ridiculous is when they are toasting each other with a glass of alcohol.


Er...looks like a scene in any Western company boardroom, the difference being the company has no state-endorsed social responsibility quidelines  to follow at all.   



And it's not just those buildings that collapse... Internally, walls dissolve or holes can easily be scratched into the walls, floors collapse due to poor quality steel used to reinforce them. Skirting boards around doors and floors fall off as they are kept in place by weak glue. Not to mention the massive electrical systems within and without each unit.

Yes, 5-year plans are the 'goals' of the cartel. Provincial governments are collectively tasked with achieving them. That's when the bullshit begins. Provincial cartel mobsters nearly always report 'success'. If they don't, they're replaced by others who will report 'success'.

Desmond Shum's account of boardroom antics is an insight into the highest value the cartel places on loyalty even over competency.

Anyway, while the cartel is paying through the nose for Australian products they were unable to sanction, or paying triple for Australian products through third parties, we're all good...

The Chinese people will need to wait for the full coming confrontation with the cartel and the world before they will be liberated from the world's last major cartel mob.

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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #41 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 1:08pm
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 12:26pm:
The provinces 'meet' their '5-year' development plans 'targets' by reporting whatever it is the cartel wants them to report. Truth or lies is of no consequence to the cartel, so long as it can report 'success'. The same was true of pandemic numbers, until the cartel gave up on collating stats.


Meanwhile entrenched systemic poverty in the US is a disgrace, nothing less than  a "human rights' crime.

The one party meritocracy in China is obviously a more advanced model of governance than Western adversarial rabbles unable to upgrade their public infrastructure.


Quote:
And it's not just those buildings that collapse... Internally, walls dissolve or holes can easily be scratched into the walls, floors collapse due to poor quality steel used to reinforce them. Skirting boards around doors and floors fall off as they are kept in place by weak glue. Not to mention the massive electrical systems within and without each unit.
 

Like in OZ, with overpriced tower housing units becoming worthless overnight due to shoddy engineering, much to the chagrin of their owners...

Quote:
Yes, 5-year plans are the 'goals' of the cartel. Provincial governments are collectively tasked with achieving them. That's when the bullshit begins. Provincial cartel mobsters nearly always report 'success'. If they don't, they're replaced by others who will report 'success'.


No the BS begins in corrupt adversarial democracies with policies determinend by the wealthy for the wealthy. 

Quote:
Desmond Shum's account of boardroom antics is an insight into the highest value the cartel places on loyalty even over competency.


An unfortunate human attribute, like greed.

Quote:
Anyway, while the cartel is paying through the nose for Australian products they were unable to sanction, or paying triple for Australian products through third parties, we're all good...


The wine growers aren't "all good"; and iron ore has halved in price in the last 6 months. As for coal,  unless renewables are rolled out quickly enough, of course China will need to import coal., but that will be temporary.

Quote:
The Chinese people will need to wait for the full coming confrontation with the cartel and the world before they will be liberated from the world's last major cartel mob.


Wrong. The Chinese people need to understand they are on the verge of greatness, if they can understand the role a successful one party meritocracy has in overcoming the contradictions in human nature.

The entrenched poverty and hyperpartisanship in the US  certainly offers a powerful example of what goes wrong when these contradictions are given free rein, in the name of "freedom". 
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #42 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 1:34pm
 
Lol, iron ore hasnt "halved " in price. Its gone down 23 percent in the last year, the previous year it went up by 150 percent. Now its on the way back up , over $100 a tonne, Chinas in a no win situation due to XIs temper tantrum. Chinas economic growth is directly tied to the price of iron ore, if they want the economy to keep growing that will push up the price. A smart leader would have negotiated with Australia for a fixed price. A stupid leader would irritate the country which feeds and provides the resources for continued  economic growth. Lets talk about the price of beef too, he thought, ok we dont need Aussie beef, we will buy it from countries like Argentina, turns out demand was so high from China the Argies sold them a lot of their breeding cattle, so basically they oversold causing a shorage and now the price is also at record highs. Stupid continual emotionally based decisions by Chinas leader, hes like a child who doesnt get his own way and does not care to think through any ramifications of his behaviour. And that is the problem with the one party totalitarian system, no media scrutiny of poor decisions, dissent not allowed, thats what you end up with. XI has set back China 20 years, hes advising his people to stock up on food for goodness sake, try and spin that one.
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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #43 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 1:49pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Dec 1st, 2021 at 1:08pm:
Wrong. The Chinese people need to understand they are on the verge of greatness, if they can understand the role a successful one party meritocracy has in overcoming the contradictions in human nature.




Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

Stand by, the CCP is here to CORRECT you and your unsatisfactory and frankly contradictory human nature!!! Because they know what the CORRECT human nature is ( Cheesy Cheesy)  so don't  think, INCORRECT human, but do as they say.  THAT is the supreme merit in the one party meritocracy. Oh, and lifetime presidency for Xi for none are knowledgable and so meritorious as emperor Xi. Oh yes!



Great Cleavage, you are peddling a simultaneously ludicrous and sinister ideology with its risible, cloth-eared bombast.


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Re: Living in China vs Living in America - Truly shock
Reply #44 - Dec 1st, 2021 at 2:48pm
 
The Chinese cartel, whether it is run by the current mob boss, his faction, or another, will not learn from its gross miscalculation of attempting to destroy Australia's economy.

If the current mob boss is overthrown or assassinated, the next one will follow on with attempting to destroy Australia; and a change of government here would not make the difference.

If anything, the cartel may be more obsessed with destroying Australia by demanding humiliating displays of obeisance to it that will not result in benefits for Australia.

The cartel's greatest weakness excretes itself from the Chinese cultural value of 'saving face'; and as the cartel realises the impossibility of a successful invasion of Taiwan, it will focus on every petty bitch fight it has already got itself into (and will generate more) with regional nations. The point being, to shore up its faux sense of superiority and to prevent its loss of face with the Chinese people.
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