Australian Politics Forum - socialists and the Chinese Communist Party

thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #120 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:29pm

freediver wrote on Jan 30^th, 2022 at 12:43pm:

[quote]Proving how impratical democracy is for vast subsistence populations.
What it proves is that it requires a cultural change, not a facade.

India has about as much chance of cultural change as the US has of reducing its hyper-partisanship.

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This is a good thing. They have justice as well as democracy.

Even if murderous riots disputing the election results occur in the nation's Capitol itself, before "justice" steps in....

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The last time a leader discarded economics like this, tens of millions of Chinese starved to death.

10's of millions of Americans living paycheck to pay check - the very definition of chronic financial stress - are threatening the stability of US democracy itself.

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That is just you being hysterical.

The 'China containment' policy is real

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He is a spin doctor. Like you, trying to sell capitalism to the Chinese people as rebranded socialism, in order to save face for the CCP over the tens of millions of people they killed by trying to help them.

Ideological narratives built around words like 'capitalism' and 'socialism', to produce your 'rebranded socialism', are meaningless.

The CCP is "selling" an economy that works for all (aka common prosperity)..... something which Bernie Sanders is also promoting in the US, blocked by evil mainstream economists who you claim they know how the economy works (they don't, even a top Fed insider (Rudd) pointed that out).

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Unless the winds of change change again, and if the people are oblivious, they will get away with it.

The CCP is well aware of the obstacles being put in the path of China, by the US.

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Besides, there is more than one way to kill tens of millions of Chinese people by trying to help them, as your MMT argument proves.

Actually it will be fun watching mainstream economists ratcheting up interest rates in the US; should cause a recession in no time.

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The Chinese people should hate the CCP for starving tens of millions of Chinese people to death. They should hate the CCP out of love for China.

So Ozzies should hate the Oz government for the aboriginal genocide, still ongoing in the form of chronic alcoholism, family dysfunction and a life expectancy 10 years less than non-indigenous.....

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #121 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:33pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:29pm:

So Ozzies should hate the Oz government for the aboriginal genocide, still ongoing in the form of chronic alcoholism, family dysfunction and a life expectancy 10 years less than non-indigenous.....

So you're not denying that the Chinese should hate the CCP, then?

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freediver

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #122 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:37pm

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India has about as much chance of cultural change as the US has of reducing its hyper-partisanship.

If it is happening in China, why not India?

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Even if murderous riots disputing the election results occur in the nation's Capitol itself, before "justice" steps in....

Yes. Even if. I realise freedom may be a scary thing for you, but it is better than running down your own citizens with tanks.

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10's of millions of Americans living paycheck to pay check - the very definition of chronic financial stress - are threatening the stability of US democracy itself.

CCP propaganda, not reality. US democracy is not under threat, other than threat of improvement.

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The 'China containment' policy is real

So what? It is not stopping China pretending to be communist while rapidly transitioning to capitalism.

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Ideological narratives built around words like 'capitalism' and 'socialism', to produce your 'rebranded socialism', are meaningless.

Only if the word socialism is meaningless, which appears to be the CCP agenda.

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The CCP is "selling" an economy that works for all (aka common prosperity)

It is selling it as socialism, in order to save face for the CCP for starving tens of millions of it's citizens to death in the name of socialism. So are you. And your comrades who have turned up recently.

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Actually it will be fun watching mainstream economists ratcheting up interest rates in the US; should cause a recession in no time.

We have a recession every decade or two. Not sure whay you compare that to starving tens of millions of your own citizens to death in the name of socialism.

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So Ozzies should hate the Oz government for the aboriginal genocide, still ongoing in the form of chronic alcoholism, family dysfunction and a life expectancy 10 years less than non-indigenous.....

We are not a one party dictatorship. China is. I did not say the Chinese people should hate the Chinese government. I said they should hate the CCP for starving tens of millions of Chinese people to death in the name of socialism. The Chinese people should be given a chance to turf the CCP for it's calamitous failings, instead of having to suffer their endless turd polishing. Tens of millions of dead people is not some little mistake the people should be expected to forget about.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #123 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:51pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:14pm:

Oh yes! It may be written but it is not done.

You ignore the fact that social security rises as a nation's per capita wealth rises. China has in fact eradicated absolute poverty in 2021, and instituted a basic social security program for 1.5 billion people.

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Every foreigner and the odd Chinese citizen who risks imprisonment can show you that, in practise, the ordinary Chinese pay their own way in just about everything including unemployment, health and injury.

No, I gave the link to the 5 mandatory social security items.

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Then there are the kickbacks they're usually forced to pay to local party officials. To add to the cost, the central government burdens provincial governments with unpayable debt by demanding huge infrastructure growth they can't pay for. This incentivises the provincial governments to fleece its population.

Xi is widely known for his crackdown on corruption.

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As for salary and wages. So many ordinary Chinese have not been paid fully for years. Xi Jinping now wants many of them to work extra hours for no extra pay.

Link?

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China may have 1.4 billion, but the catastrophe of imposed socialism (and it's always had Chinese characteristics), has left a gender gap that may ultimately bring China down regardless of how its governed.

The catastrophe of uncontrolled breeding like rabbits is certainly well evident in India. Meanwhile Modern AI and IT assisted economies allow much more flexibility re population policy, provided mainstream economists with their false 'continuous growth' nonsense are ignored.

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thegreatdivide Gold Member Offline Australian Politics<br /> Posts: 12973 Gender:	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #124 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:54pm MeisterEckhart wrote on Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:33pm: So you're not denying that the Chinese should hate the CCP, then? So you're not deny Ozzies ...ditto.. We all have to move on from the past, and deal with today's problems.
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MeisterEckhart

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #125 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 2:04pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:54pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:33pm:

So you're not denying that the Chinese should hate the CCP, then?

So you're not deny Ozzies ...ditto..

We all have to move on from the past, and deal with today's problems.

This is a thread about socialists and the Chinese Communist Party.

In the context of this thread you appear to not be denying that the Chinese should hate the CCP.

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freediver

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #126 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 2:14pm

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ou ignore the fact that social security rises as a nation's per capita wealth rises. China has in fact eradicated absolute poverty in 2021, and instituted a basic social security program for 1.5 billion people.

So the propaganda ministry tells us...

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/future-development/2021/09/24/whats-next-for-poverty-reduction-policies-in-china/#:~:text=China's%20poverty%20line%20is%20below,upper%2Dmiddle%2Dincome%20countries.

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Earlier this year China’s government announced that it had eradicated absolute poverty, measured against a standard equivalent to $2.30 per person per day applied to rural areas.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #127 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 3:01pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 30^th, 2022 at 1:51pm:

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Every foreigner and the odd Chinese citizen who risks imprisonment can show you that, in practise, the ordinary Chinese pay their own way in just about everything including unemployment, health and injury.

No, I gave the link to the 5 mandatory social security items.

Yes. That's what they say they'll do. It's not what they do.

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As for salary and wages. So many ordinary Chinese have not been paid fully for years. Xi Jinping now wants many of them to work extra hours for no extra pay.

Link?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMLzrks4cBM

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The catastrophe of uncontrolled breeding like rabbits is certainly well evident in India. Meanwhile Modern AI and IT assisted economies allow much more flexibility re population policy, provided mainstream economists with their false 'continuous growth' nonsense are ignored.

Ignoring the India deflection, modern AI and IT will not create new humans let alone not correct the gender imbalance.

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freediver Gold Member Online www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49082 At my desk.	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #128 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 3:02pm How is Artificial Insemination going to assist the economy?
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MeisterEckhart Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 12579 Gender:	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #129 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 3:10pm freediver wrote on Jan 30^th, 2022 at 3:02pm: How is Artificial Insemination going to assist the economy? It could work on what, in China, are called leftover women - Unmarried and over 25. The Ceausescus would have approved.
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freediver Gold Member Online www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49082 At my desk.	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #130 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 3:25pm I thought there was a shortage of women, on account of their parents drowning them at birth in a bucket of water, thanks to the CCP one child policy.
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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #131 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 5:31pm

freediver wrote on Jan 30^th, 2022 at 3:25pm:

I thought there was a shortage of women, on account of their parents drowning them at birth in a bucket of water, thanks to the CCP one child policy.

Structure of society is at fault - there are four main 'classes' and the highest types - those women who go into professional study and such -are overlooked by the mainly business types in the top rung of men, who want a sweet young thing of the next class down, so that the man is always the boss.

There are countless doctors, lawyers, and other high class professional ladies unattached in China - while at the same time - due to the 'marrying down one rung in four' worn-out nonsense - the men at the very lowest class are forced to remain single or find wives in Cambodia etc.

Chinese society has some major flaws - as I've said before - not least that it cuts the very finest intelligent and hard-working educated women out of having a family.... leading to the inevitable dumbing down of the entire structure. A good thing for the ruling self-appointed elite - the less educated the masses the less likelihood they will object to the latest move to control every facet of their lives.

You see a couple of them here.... plugging the official line about no personal sovereignty (unless you are of the elite, of course) and so forth, and actually believing that the rest of the world would benefit from such a slanted and tottering social structure - or be punished eventually by Big China for not complying.

A recipe for getting their arses kicked if you ask me - however - reports are that the British Army is at its lowest combat arms strength for 300 years and women are just not applying for the 'sharp end' jobs - Too Tough For The Muff! I have no doubt that most of the West is in that parlous state due to the in-roads of Frankenstein Social Scientists and their monster creations.... reports are that Europe is in no position to stand up to any Russian intrusion.... might be back to The Channel and Battle of Britain again, with different foes....

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #132 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 5:48pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Jan 30^th, 2022 at 3:01pm:

Yes. That's what they say they'll do. It's not what they do.

Pass.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMLzrks4cBM

First thing I notice is the sneering attitude toward the concept of common prosperity. Second thing I notice is the concern over debt; mainstream Western economists have been predicting a debt-based collapse in China for many years, despite the fact that yuan-denominated debt can be cancelled at any time by the PBofC (the sole legal issuer of Yuan).

Now, as to unpaid salaries, unpaid overtime etc, that is indeed a problem which can be avoided, because China
can supply the essentials for all it's citizens regardless of public debt, as noted above).

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Ignoring the India deflection, modern AI and IT will not create new humans let alone not correct the gender imbalance.

I already said there is no need for "new humans", China can increasingly run its economy with robots. And the gender imbalance can be dealt with by attracting women from other Asian countries.

(Btw, population growth the world over must be contained, for a sustainable future on this planet).

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #133 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 5:50pm

Jesus - here's one .................. if I hinted at m.o.t.h.r.a. would she put in appearance to tell us that changing Australia Day is inevitable and drugs do no harm?

Wonder how the CCP plans to stop people shagging and breeding......

When it comes to robots - someone has to take that sucker up and keep it flying - and that person is called a ... pilot. Round here we've got our prime pilots and our pud-knockers ...... now what'll you two pud-knockers have?

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

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freediver Gold Member Online www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49082 At my desk.	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #134 - Jan 30^th, 2022 at 6:03pm Quote: And the gender imbalance can be dealt with by attracting women from other Asian countries. Have you considered not drowning baby girls in a bucket of water at birth? Or is China too much like India - impossible to change the culture?
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