Australian Politics Forum - socialists and the Chinese Communist Party

freediver

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #210 - Feb 2^nd, 2022 at 6:11pm

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Ancient history.

No it isn't. People alive today lost family members, and the CCP is going unpunished.

Chinese people today still suffer the direct physical consequences, such as stunted growth. The CCP goes unpunished.

Chinese people today still suffer from reduced cognitive skills. Especially those who had growing brains at the time when the CCP killed 50 million people. The CCP goes unpunished.

The CCP airbrushes all this out of the dialogue, creating the risk that they repeat it. The CCP goes unpunished.

The CCP lies to the people and tells that the the ideology that starved them do death: socialism, still has a place in China. Creating the risk of a push to re-embrace genuine socialism the next time China faces any kind of emergency. The CCP goes unpunished.

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Iron ore is the one resource China currently needs from Oz, which has nothing to do with your evil mainstrean economic orthodoxy which reserves the privilege of money creation for private bankers.

You have lost the plot and gone off on another ignorant tangent. Try to keep up with the discussion.

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China isn't complaining, it's doing what it has to do, in the face of US paranoia over losing its global hegemony.

Why are you complaining about it then? Or have you lost the plot and you are just picking random passages from your CCP pamphlet to respond with?

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Again you are comparing long past events (50 years ago) in China, with current religious unrest in India with 700 million of its "democratically free" citizens still living in absolute poverty.

You are the one who keeps comparing India and China, not me.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #211 - Feb 3^rd, 2022 at 2:07pm

Frank wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2022 at 6:10pm:

Gawd, you are a stupid, Bbwianesque spineless lying shill - for a supposedly 3-5,000 year old civilisation, the massacres, famines, tortures and disappearings of 50 years ago is now 'ancient history' just to cover up the gruesome monstrosities of the same people who are still in power.

Too literal re ancient history?

You are confusing Stalin with Xi; and as for Mao, he was confronted with the task of lifting 700 million people (almost the entire population of China back then) out of absolute poverty.

Allowing rich overlords to manage the economy was certainly not going to achieve the goal, and mistakes were made along the way.

But to say the CCP is the same now as it was in Mao's time is ridiculous; and your lies about the "gruesome monstrosities" including "genocide" in Xinjiang are soon to be exposed as lies, when Michelle Bachelet finalizes her visit to Xinjiang later this year.

Speaking of "gruesome": when a rich county like Oz can't look after its nursing home residents, nor eradicate entrenched poverty, we know the system is dysfunctional and evil.
And as for good governance, the spectacle of the governing party's leader being viciously verbally attacked by members of his own party makes one want to vomit.

Still, that's all you can expect from an adversarial, two-party, 'elected' rabble of self-interested vicious clowns.

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Frank

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #212 - Feb 3^rd, 2022 at 2:54pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2022 at 2:07pm:

Frank wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2022 at 6:10pm:

Gawd, you are a stupid, Bbwianesque spineless lying shill - for a supposedly 3-5,000 year old civilisation, the massacres, famines, tortures and disappearings of 50 years ago is now 'ancient history' just to cover up the gruesome monstrosities of the same people who are still in power.

Too literal re ancient history?

You are confusing Stalin with Xi; and as for Mao, he was confronted with the task of lifting 700 million people (almost the entire population of China back then) out of absolute poverty.

Allowing rich overlords to manage the economy was certainly not going to achieve the goal, and mistakes were made along the way.

But to say the CCP is the same now as it was in Mao's time is ridiculous; and your lies about the "gruesome monstrosities" including "genocide" in Xinjiang are soon to be exposed as lies, when Michelle Bachelet finalizes her visit to Xinjiang later this year.

Speaking of "gruesome": when a rich county like Oz can't look after its nursing home residents, nor eradicate entrenched poverty, we know the system is dysfunctional and evil.
And as for good governance, the spectacle of the governing party's leader being viciously verbally attacked by members of his own party makes one want to vomit.

Still, that's all you can expect from an adversarial, two-party, 'elected' rabble of self-interested vicious clowns.

So all the Chinese who have migrated to the West and are continuing to do so, are complete morons leaving paradise for hell.
Not to mention the Chinese who seel asylum in the West.
Year, right.

Recent asylum claims were dominated by Chinese nationals. Source: Department of Home Affairs.(Illustration: ABC News/Jarrod Fankhauser)
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-10/chinese-nationals-claiming-refugee-asylum-surges-311-per-cent/10590478

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Grappler Deep State Feller

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #213 - Feb 3^rd, 2022 at 5:50pm

Didn't notice our local Iranian couple complaining about our free election system... they walked in, got a friendly greeting, chatted with me who they met before, voted and commented on how different things were here. No guys with the evil eye standing at the door with AKs watching for dissidents, no religious court to hang the innocent if they vote wrongly, no pressure to vote for Allah's latest rep or suffer the pangs of Hell forever - and no virgins ..... no chance of the firing squad for belonging to the wrong faction or religious split or writing a satirical poem about the poor suffering religious cult leaders.... fatwah lot of good it'd do anyone anyway, to even try... any Muslim who attends the funeral of a non-Muslim friend is accused of riding those satanic hearses....

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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freediver

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #214 - Feb 3^rd, 2022 at 7:04pm

Quote:

You are confusing Stalin with Xi; and as for Mao, he was confronted with the task of lifting 700 million people (almost the entire population of China back then) out of absolute poverty

Did he think it would be easier if he starved 50 million or so to death?

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Allowing rich overlords to manage the economy was certainly not going to achieve the goal, and mistakes were made along the way.

Was 50 million corpses a goal? Do you think it was better to starve them to death than let them make Nikes?

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But to say the CCP is the same now as it was in Mao's time is ridiculous; and your lies about the "gruesome monstrosities"

50 million corpses would be pretty gruesome. The CCP somehow made it mundane enough for you to brush off as a little error.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Frank Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 47041 Gender:	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #215 - Feb 5^th, 2022 at 8:29pm America: There is absolutely NOTHING soulless China can counter this with. Communist China is the death of human hope, soul, playful creativity.
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thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #216 - Feb 8^th, 2022 at 2:23pm

freediver wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2022 at 7:04pm:

Did he think it would be easier if he starved 50 million or so to death?

No. But there was no guide book to lift 700 million people out of absolute poverty, mistakes were made.

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Was 50 million corpses a goal? Do you think it was better to starve them to death than let them make Nikes?

No.

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50 million corpses would be pretty gruesome. The CCP somehow made it mundane enough for you to brush off as a little error.

It was a disaster, like the US civil war and the US led Vietnam war (since you want to talk about history).

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freediver

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #217 - Feb 8^th, 2022 at 6:35pm

Quote:

No. But there was no guide book to lift 700 million people out of absolute poverty, mistakes were made.

Yes there was.

Step one, remove head from arse.

Step two, do not starve 50 million people to death in an effort to impose socialism on them.

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It was a disaster, like the US civil war and the US led Vietnam war (since you want to talk about history).

No, it was fundamentally different. In war, you try to kill people. The CCP killed far more people by trying to help them, apparently because there was no guidebook on how to lift them out of poverty, despite millions of people from many different countries already being lifted out of poverty through well understood mechanisms.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #218 - Feb 9^th, 2022 at 12:15pm

freediver wrote on Feb 8^th, 2022 at 6:35pm:

Step one, remove head from arse.

That not a rule/quide book.

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Step two, do not starve 50 million people to death in an effort to impose socialism on them.

That was a mistake.

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No, it was fundamentally different. In war, you try to kill people.

And war itself is not a mistake? (It was illegal and a mistake in the case of the US invasion of Iraq)

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The CCP killed far more people by trying to help them, apparently because there was no guidebook on how to lift them out of poverty,

That's correct.

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....despite millions of people from many different countries already being lifted out of poverty through well understood mechanisms.

"Well understood" mechanisms? 70 years after the 'Cultural Revolution', poverty is still widespread in many countries around the globe.

And there was certainly no guide to lift 700 million people out of absolute poverty - the largest poverty eradication program ever attempted in history - before 'socialism with Chinese characteristics' discovered the winning formula from 1980's on; namely, a pragmatic synthesis of capitalism and communism, never outlined in any 'guide book' before in history.

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freediver

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #219 - Feb 9^th, 2022 at 5:56pm

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That not a rule/quide book.

Sure it is. It's from the official common sense guide to not starving 50 million of your citizens to death by trying to help feed them. It's from the chapter "little mistakes you might make along the way".

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"Well understood" mechanisms? 70 years after the 'Cultural Revolution', poverty is still widespread in many countries around the globe.

The cultural revolution is pretty much irrelevant to the modern understanding of how to eradicate poverty. China is still playing catchup, while pretending to reinvent the wheel.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #220 - Feb 9^th, 2022 at 6:13pm

freediver wrote on Feb 9^th, 2022 at 5:56pm:

Sure it is. It's from the official common sense guide to not starving 50 million of your citizens to death by trying to help feed them. It's from the chapter "little mistakes you might make along the way".

The highlighted...a figment of your imagination.

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The cultural revolution is pretty much irrelevant to the modern understanding of how to eradicate poverty.

You mean now, or in 1960 when China's entire 700 million people were living in absolute poverty?

You are still confusing then with now.

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China is still playing catchup, while pretending to reinvent the wheel.

The world's most extensive highspeed rail, world's most extensive 5G network, world's largest renewable energy sector, only the 2nd nation with a rover on Mars, soon to have the only operational space station.....the "catchup" happened some time ago...

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freediver

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #221 - Feb 9^th, 2022 at 6:20pm

Quote:

You mean now, or in 1960 when China's entire 700 million people were living in absolute poverty?

Nothing has changed to our understanding since 1960. The CCP has removed it's head from it's arse.

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The world's most extensive highspeed rail, world's most extensive 5G network, world's largest renewable energy sector, only the 2nd nation with a rover on Mars, soon to have the only operational space station.....the "catchup" happened some time ago...

And yet China still call's itself a third world country when it comes to the free ride it is getting on intellectual property rights. The Average income in China is still a fraction of that in Australia and the US, and there is still a huge chunk of the population living in dire poverty.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Bobby. Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 105882 Melbourne Gender:	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #222 - Feb 9^th, 2022 at 7:16pm
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greggerypeccary Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 138322 Gender:	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #223 - Feb 9^th, 2022 at 7:18pm Bobby. wrote on Feb 9^th, 2022 at 7:16pm: https://www.ozpolitic.com/album/forum-attachments/Socialism.jpg You got a Medicare card, Booby?
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Lisa Jones Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 39047 Sydney Gender:	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #224 - Feb 9^th, 2022 at 7:30pm Anyone else starting to think that the id greatdivide is a paid cyber troll? I've never read so much non sensical Chinese Communist Party propaganda in my life!
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