Australian Politics Forum - socialists and the Chinese Communist Party

Lisa Jones

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #225 - Feb 9^th, 2022 at 7:41pm

Frank wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2022 at 6:10pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2022 at 6:02pm:

freediver wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2022 at 4:04pm:

You and the other CCP stooges here are more blinded by ideology than our labor and liberal cheerleaders.

Nonsense. People in China just want to get on with their lives in an economy that is lifting the living standards of all at a faster rate than any nation in history.

They despise the fake 'free election' BS, and don't need to concern themselves with the electoral cycle, rather they can contribute to the nation's sustainable development to the best of their ability and personal advantage.

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You have turned the CCP into a religion. That's the only way you could get people to describe the CCP as pragmatic compared to ideologically driven after it starved 50 million people to death in the name of socialism.

Ancient history. As a matter of fact, China is now 3 times richer than when the 2008 Olympics were staged; that's growth for you.

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Knowing how to achieve it does not, but luckily not everyone kills 50 million people with their 'little mistakes'.

Ancient history, as noted above. Achieving the fastest increase in living standards in history in a single generation is a result of pragmatic good governance.

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Not necessarily. You just need economic growth to exceed poulation growth. As your India example demonstrates.

Barely achieved in India, with 700 million (over half the population) still living in absolute poverty.

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Iron ore comes to mind.

Iron ore is the one resource China currently needs from Oz, which has nothing to do with your evil mainstrean economic orthodoxy which reserves the privilege of money creation for private bankers.

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Can you explain why you are complaining about this? Are they supposed to give it to China for free?

China isn't complaining, it's doing what it has to do, in the face of US paranoia over losing its global hegemony.

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It's odd that you keep talking about catastrophic consequences while defending the party that killed 50 million of your comrades.

Again you are comparing long past events (50 years ago) in China, with current religious unrest in India with 700 million of its "democratically free" citizens still living in absolute poverty.

Gawd, you are a stupid, Bbwianesque spineless lying shill - for a supposedly 3-5,000 year old civilisation, the massacres, famines, tortures and disappearings of 50 years ago is now 'ancient history' just to cover up the gruesome monstrosities of the same people who are still in power.

Please read.

GreatDivide is a pro CCP paid cyber troll.

"The US think-tank Jamestown Foundation is reporting that China is employing an extensive network of more than 20 million “internet commentators” — trolls tasked with artificially amplifying content favorable to the Chinese government."

Read more here ....

https://www.global-influence-ops.com/china-uses-22-million-strong-internet-troll...

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thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #226 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 11:21am

freediver wrote on Feb 9^th, 2022 at 6:20pm:

Nothing has changed to our understanding since 1960. The CCP has removed it's head from it's arse.

Re the West: true, that's why poverty remains entrenched in the West despite material advancement.

Whereas the CCP has changed as you say, which is why common prosperity is rapidly being attained in China.

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And yet China still call's itself a third world country when it comes to the free ride it is getting on intellectual property rights.

China is no longer "getting a free ride", the US is decoupling as fast as it can...but it's too late. Chinese home-grown AI will soon overtake the US.

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The Average income in China is still a fraction of that in Australia and the US, and there is still a huge chunk of the population living in dire poverty.

And yet China has eradicated absolute poverty AND built a rapidly increasing middle class set to double in size from the present 400 million, to 800 million by 2030.

While Oz still has aboriginal people living in 3rd world conditions.

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Lisa Jones

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #227 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 1:05pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 27^th, 2022 at 11:09am:

issuevoter wrote on Jan 27^th, 2022 at 6:57am:

Politically, the goal of socialism is to make all citizens wards of the state.

I note the name 'dinosaur' is associated with your posts, which would explain the sheer absurdity of your statement above.

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Thus cementing control.

No, rather cementing the neurons in your befuddled brain.

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This is the purpose of UBI.

Oh god, the cement has already set....

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Socialists in the capitalist West, still cling to the idea of a Marxist utopia and are reluctant to acknowledge that the CCP, for all its "socialism" only exists by police and military force. If I said this in China, I would disappear

1. Eradication of poverty in modern AI and IT assisted economies is not utopia.

2. The CCP has the support of >90% of the Chinese population.

3. No-one in HK has 'disappeared', though some separatist democracy goons have emigrated to other Western countries. They are welcome to the adversarial, gridlocked, achieve-nothing rabbles aka "democracy".

Oh so you live in China then.

That's where you're posting from.

My bad.

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)

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Lisa Jones

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #228 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 1:07pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 11:21am:

freediver wrote on Feb 9^th, 2022 at 6:20pm:

Nothing has changed to our understanding since 1960. The CCP has removed it's head from it's arse.

Re the West: true, that's why poverty remains entrenched in the West despite material advancement.

Whereas the CCP has changed as you say, which is why common prosperity is rapidly being attained in China.

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And yet China still call's itself a third world country when it comes to the free ride it is getting on intellectual property rights.

China is no longer "getting a free ride", the US is decoupling as fast as it can...but it's too late. Chinese home-grown AI will soon overtake the US.

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The Average income in China is still a fraction of that in Australia and the US, and there is still a huge chunk of the population living in dire poverty.

And yet China has eradicated absolute poverty AND built a rapidly increasing middle class set to double in size from the present 400 million, to 800 million by 2030.

While Oz still has aboriginal people living in 3rd world conditions.

Ahh so was that your motivation in moving to China to live there and escape destructive democracy.

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)

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thegreatdivide Gold Member Offline Australian Politics<br /> Posts: 12972 Gender:	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #229 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 1:48pm Lisa Jones wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 1:07pm: Ahh so was that your motivation in moving to China to live there and escape destructive democracy. Dear Lisa, this is a debating forum, not a social club. My personal circumstances need be of no interest to you.
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Lisa Jones

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #230 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 1:53pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 1:48pm:

Lisa Jones wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 1:07pm:

Ahh so was that your motivation in moving to China to live there and escape destructive democracy.

Dear Lisa, this is a debating forum, not a social club. My personal circumstances need be of no interest to you.

Oh I know what this forum is all about.

It's interesting that you would conclude that I'm somehow interested in your personal circumstances.

I can assure you I'm not.

YOU yes YOU are constantly extolling the wondrous virtues of the CCP so it's only natural for your audience to assume you're in a position to be able to because you live in China and therefore know what you're posting about. First hand.

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)

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Frank

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #231 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:04pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 11:21am:

And yet China has eradicated absolute poverty AND built a rapidly increasing middle class set to double in size from the present 400 million, to 800 million by 2030.

By redefining it to mean "less than $2 a day". China does a lot of that, redefining.

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While Oz still has aboriginal people living in 3rd world conditions.

A case of "You can lead a whore to culture but you can't make her think".

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thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #232 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:42pm

Lisa Jones wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 1:53pm:

Oh I know what this forum is all about.

It's interesting that you would conclude that I'm somehow interested in your personal circumstances.

I can assure you I'm not.

Yet for the last half dozen replies you have made totally irrelevant comments about me, rather than debating the topic.

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YOU yes YOU are constantly extolling the wondrous virtues of the CCP

Just to be clear: I am extolling the virtues of common prosperity and sustainable development for ALL nations, impossible in an 'invisible hand' competitive free market system in which profits flow to the most able without regard for the common welfare.

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so it's only natural for your audience to assume you're in a position to be able to because you live in China and therefore know what you're posting about. First hand.

Well I hope I have now dismissed that assumption once and for all.

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Lisa Jones

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #233 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:47pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:42pm:

Lisa Jones wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 1:53pm:

Oh I know what this forum is all about.

It's interesting that you would conclude that I'm somehow interested in your personal circumstances.

I can assure you I'm not.

Yet for the last half dozen replies you have made totally irrelevant comments about me, rather than debating the topic.

Quote:

YOU yes YOU are constantly extolling the wondrous virtues of the CCP

Just to be clear: I am extolling the virtues of common prosperity and sustainable development for ALL nations, impossible in an 'invisible hand' competitive free market system in which profits flow to the most able without regard for the common welfare.

Quote:

so it's only natural for your audience to assume you're in a position to be able to because you live in China and therefore know what you're posting about. First hand.

Well I hope I have now dismissed that assumption once and for all.

No

Your posts ARE extolling the virtues of the CCP.

Your posts do so by commenting as though you're it's on their behalf.

Are you now trying to say that you're not a resident of China and that your comments about China are based on what you have read?

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)

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Lisa Jones Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 39047 Sydney Gender:	Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party Reply #234 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:50pm Whilst here Greatdivide....tell the forum what you think/believe occurred at Tiananmen Square on June 4, 1989.
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thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #235 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:51pm

Frank wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:04pm:

By redefining it to mean "less than $2 a day". China does a lot of that, redefining.

Wrong. China subsidizes housing, healthcare and education for its low wage workers, so the $2 a day is irrelevant as a measure of the actual standard of living of low wage workers.

As recognized by Ellen Brown:

https://www.truthdig.com/articles/the-american-dream-is-alive-and-well-in-china/

The American Dream Is Alive and Well—in China

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A case of "You can lead a whore to culture but you can't make her think".

No, a case of evil 'survival of the fittest', dog eat dog capitalism.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #236 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:56pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:42pm:

Quote:

so it's only natural for your audience to assume you're in a position to be able to because you live in China and therefore know what you're posting about. First hand.

Well I hope I have now dismissed that assumption once and for all.

So what is it?

Are you a Chinese national? Are you posting from China?

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thegreatdivide

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #237 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 3:01pm

Lisa Jones wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:47pm:

Your posts ARE extolling the virtues of the CCP.

Well...if you insist....but to repeat: I am extolling the virtues of common prosperity and sustainable development for ALL nations, impossible in an 'invisible hand' competitive free market system in which profits flow to the most able without regard for the common welfare.

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Your posts do so by commenting as though you're it's on their behalf.

The sad fact is the CCP is the only party in the world currently extolling the virtues of common prosperity.

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Are you now trying to say that you're not a resident of China and that your comments about China are based on what you have read?

Addressed above. Time for you defend your 'invisible hand', competitive free market system in which profits flow to the most able without regard for the common welfare.

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Lisa Jones

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #238 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 3:05pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:51pm:

Frank wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 2:04pm:

By redefining it to mean "less than $2 a day". China does a lot of that, redefining.

Wrong. China subsidizes housing, healthcare and education for its low wage workers, so the $2 a day is irrelevant as a measure of the actual standard of living of low wage workers.

As recognized by Ellen Brown:

https://www.truthdig.com/articles/the-american-dream-is-alive-and-well-in-china/

The American Dream Is Alive and Well—in China

Quote:

A case of "You can lead a whore to culture but you can't make her think".

No, a case of evil 'survival of the fittest', dog eat dog capitalism.

Oh dear 😐

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7546956/

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: socialists and the Chinese Communist Party
Reply #239 - Feb 10^th, 2022 at 3:09pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 10^th, 2022 at 1:48pm:

this is a debating forum, not a social club. My personal circumstances need be of no interest to you.

Your status as a Chinese national is of particular importance as it is against the law for a Chinese national to discus or debate anything that is not in the interests of furthering the totalitarian rule of the CCP.

And, given it was Chinese nationals who bashed Drew Pavlou, your status as a Chinese national (particularly if you are in Australia) is of considerable importance.

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