Australian Politics Forum - Russia will not invade Ukraine

MeisterEckhart

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Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine
Reply #630 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 1:43pm

Karnal wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 1:37pm:

athos wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 12:42pm:

Karnal wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 10:11pm:

athos wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 4:40pm:

Karnal wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 3:57pm:

athos wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 3:23pm:

Chechnya leader Ramzan Kadyrov promised $500 000 for "Ukrainian nationalists commanders heads"

Chechnya leader Ramzan Kadyrov promised a 500 000 $ reward for the chairman`s head of every Ukrainian nationalists commander.
That statement Kadyrov made in his telegram channel.

“A reward is being announced for the heads of the Ukrainian nationalists commander: Bandera, Azov, Dudayev’s battalion of shaitans (devils). I say this not as an official, but as a volunteer on behalf of Russian patriots, the same volunteers who have financial capabilities and have expressed a desire to pay 500 000 dollars for the head of each commander," he said.
Cheesy

I say, Athos, you still haven't said why we should support Putin. What is it, exactly?
Is it his charisma? His charm?
Please explain?

You don't have to support anyone. Just try to be reasonably objective and not be so ignorant.

I see, so let's get this straight.

Do you support the Russian invasion of the Ukraine?

A simple yes or no will suffice.

I see, so let's get this straight.

Do you want to be The Grand Inquisitor?
Do you want to be a like him***?
Simply yes or no.

No, dear. Do you want to express yourself?

Here's your opportunity. Why do you support the invasion of a sovereign country?

You still haven't said

You're talking to a bot.

Chinese bots are sending out RT youtube clips because RT is starting to be blocked around the world.

This is the CCP's way of talking like its sitting on the fence while sending out its bot army to troll for Putin.

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Karnal

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Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine
Reply #631 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 1:50pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 12:46pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 12:23pm:

Clowns to the left of me - jokers to the right...

An act of aggression that is left unchallenged will lead to further acts of aggression. There are significant Russian minorities in Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, Finland and so forth - they will soon start 'pleading' for help from the persecution of the governments there and Uncle Vlad will be forced to act.... triggering WW III.

The man is a psychopath...

Should have been prevented by diplomacy.

For example, abolish NATO, it's a relic of the Cold War.

Putin has already said he would leave Ukraine alone if the threat from NATO is removed.

Yes, and then he corrected himself by saying the Ukraine is spiritually and existentially Russian, and that his invasion is about returning the Ukraine to the Motherland.

I'm still curious, Great. You haven't yet explained why you support this invasion.

Athos hasn't said, but he keeps inserting China into his posts, as if China somehow has a stake in who controls the Ukraine.

Why do you think that would be?

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 95293 Gender:	Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine Reply #632 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 1:56pm Shurely
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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 95293 Gender:	Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine Reply #633 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 1:56pm Shome
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MeisterEckhart

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Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine
Reply #634 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 1:58pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 12:46pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 12:23pm:

Clowns to the left of me - jokers to the right...

An act of aggression that is left unchallenged will lead to further acts of aggression. There are significant Russian minorities in Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, Finland and so forth - they will soon start 'pleading' for help from the persecution of the governments there and Uncle Vlad will be forced to act.... triggering WW III.

The man is a psychopath...

Should have been prevented by diplomacy.

For example, abolish NATO, it's a relic of the Cold War.

Putin has already said he would leave Ukraine alone if the threat from NATO is removed.

Putin said he wasn't going to invade the Ukraine. Didn't even tell the Russian people until less than a week before it began.

The CCP knew, of course, but did noting to advise the world.

NATO is more relevant now than it has been in over 30 years.

Even Sweden and Finland are turning towards joining NATO.

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Karnal

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Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine
Reply #635 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:11pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 1:43pm:

Karnal wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 1:37pm:

athos wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 12:42pm:

Karnal wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 10:11pm:

athos wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 4:40pm:

Karnal wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 3:57pm:

athos wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 3:23pm:

Chechnya leader Ramzan Kadyrov promised $500 000 for "Ukrainian nationalists commanders heads"

Chechnya leader Ramzan Kadyrov promised a 500 000 $ reward for the chairman`s head of every Ukrainian nationalists commander.
That statement Kadyrov made in his telegram channel.

“A reward is being announced for the heads of the Ukrainian nationalists commander: Bandera, Azov, Dudayev’s battalion of shaitans (devils). I say this not as an official, but as a volunteer on behalf of Russian patriots, the same volunteers who have financial capabilities and have expressed a desire to pay 500 000 dollars for the head of each commander," he said.
Cheesy

I say, Athos, you still haven't said why we should support Putin. What is it, exactly?
Is it his charisma? His charm?
Please explain?

You don't have to support anyone. Just try to be reasonably objective and not be so ignorant.

I see, so let's get this straight.

Do you support the Russian invasion of the Ukraine?

A simple yes or no will suffice.

I see, so let's get this straight.

Do you want to be The Grand Inquisitor?
Do you want to be a like him***?
Simply yes or no.

No, dear. Do you want to express yourself?

Here's your opportunity. Why do you support the invasion of a sovereign country?

You still haven't said

You're talking to a bot.

Chinese bots are sending out RT youtube clips because RT is starting to be blocked around the world.

This is the CCP's way of talking like its sitting on the fence while sending out its bot army to troll for Putin.

Maybe, but Athos is a fellow poster here. He has his own thoughts.

He knows, for example, that the idea of China favouring the invasion of the Ukraine in order to set a precedent for the invasion of Taiwan is just cynical imperialism. This provides no ethical legitimacy to the invasion of the Ukraine, which is a fully sovereign country.

If Athos did take this line, he would have to acknowledge that he has no ethical position whatsoever. All he could say is that might makes right. His case would make no legitimate claim to sovereignty.

Nor does saying the British Empire or America did it, so it's all good. That's not an ethical position either, it's just an acknowledgement that your side is just as bad.

If Athos went with the might makes right argument, there would be nothing left to say. Everybody would disagree with him and that's that.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine
Reply #636 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:11pm

Karnal wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 3:55pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 2:22pm:

Karnal wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 1:58pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 4^th, 2022 at 1:17pm:

Karnal wrote on Mar 3^rd, 2022 at 10:45pm:

Right, so you don't support the invasion, and you don't support the Ukraine defending the invasion.

That's a lose-lose, no?

The loss is the the loss of innocent life when armies start firing at one another in modern civilian-based war arenas. Should have finally been criminalized in 1946.

Quote:

So I'm curious. How to give everybody what they want?

I've spent hours patiently explaining it to Frank, but
deluded "freedom" ideologues like yourself are slow learners. Hopefully your own children aren't in the firing line.

Quote:

If we took away said veto,

....the UNSC would speak with one voice, to maintain the rulings of an ICJ dedicated to upholding the UNUDHR ie, by majority vote of the permanent members, just as a majority vote of justices in a nation's own Supreme Court is the foundation of rule of law in the nation; individual nations would NOT be free to wage war on the basis of the obsolete concept of national sovereignty.

Quote:

Putin would be in the Hague, in a cell next to Bush. That, dear, won't happen, as every schoolboy knows.

Both of them, being free from the burden of maintaining national "security" vis a vis other nations, would only be involved in engendering sustainable prosperity in their own nations.

Sorry, Great, I'm confused. Are you complaining about Ukrainian soldiers murdering innocent Russian troops?

Complaining about (dis-)organized mass murder by all and sundry? YES.

Quote:

You may have patiently told the old boy, but I haven't seen your explanation. Did you catch the news about the Russian invasion?

Boring.... more avoidable mass murder - old as recorded history itself; meanwhile listening to deluded media "freedom" ideologues frantically exploiting every individual tragedy for its impact is disgusting and sick, as to be expected.....exhibiting the "human psychosis", which biologist Jeremy Griffiths points out is the result of an unconscious conflict - specific to humans - between instinct-guided behaviour, and behaviour directed by conscious awareness of the desires of self and others.

Quote:

Cheers

Yes..hopefully your children aren't in the firing line.

A sovereign country defending itself against invaders is not murder, Great. We call this self defence.

Yet the Russians living in Ukraine call it liberation.

Quote:

So I'm curious. How would you expect the Ukraine to compromise with Russia?

Already explained. Russians in Ukraine would like their autonomy, and Putin would be happy with the demise of NATO, an obsolete Cold War relic. There's certainly room for compromise there.

Quote:

Should they lay down their arms quicker? Ask to be shot? Put out their women and children to be raped? How should this compromise work, exactly?

Once diplomacy fails, all morality flees.

See #620.

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MeisterEckhart Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 11876 Gender:	Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine Reply #637 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:15pm thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:11pm: Yet the Russians living in Ukraine call it liberation. Something for you to remember when thinking about Tibet, Xinjiang (East Turkestan) and inner Mongolia.
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MeisterEckhart Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 11876 Gender:	Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine Reply #638 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:17pm Karnal wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:11pm: Maybe, but Athos is a fellow poster here. He has his own thoughts. Bots don't have their own thoughts. They're AI. Try a Turing test on him. Write in another language (that's easily translatable) or write phonetically. See what happens.
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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 95293 Gender:	Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine Reply #639 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:18pm Great, you've missed the news, dear. Russia has invaded the Ukraine. Putin's not talking to anybody, he's going for the capital. So again, I'm curious. Athos appears to support this invasion in the interest of another country's geopolitical moves. You?
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thegreatdivide

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Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine
Reply #640 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:22pm

Karnal wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 1:50pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 12:46pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 12:23pm:

Clowns to the left of me - jokers to the right...

An act of aggression that is left unchallenged will lead to further acts of aggression. There are significant Russian minorities in Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania, Finland and so forth - they will soon start 'pleading' for help from the persecution of the governments there and Uncle Vlad will be forced to act.... triggering WW III.

The man is a psychopath...

Should have been prevented by diplomacy.

For example, abolish NATO, it's a relic of the Cold War.

Putin has already said he would leave Ukraine alone if the threat from NATO is removed.

Yes, and then he corrected himself by saying the Ukraine is spiritually and existentially Russian, and that his invasion is about returning the Ukraine to the Motherland.

Putin "corrected" himself because of the continued existence of NATO.

Quote:

I'm still curious, Great. You haven't yet explained why you support this invasion.

It's not as simple as that, despite your wanting a simple 'yes/no' answer. See #620.

Quote:

Athos hasn't said, but he keeps inserting China into his posts, as if China somehow has a stake in who controls the Ukraine.
Why do you think that would be?

I can't speak for Athos, but China wants to do business with Ukraine, the EU, AND Russia, to resist containment by the current paranoid global hegemon, the US.

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« Last Edit: Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:34pm by thegreatdivide »

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine
Reply #641 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:27pm

Karnal wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:18pm:

Great, you've missed the news, dear. Russia has invaded the Ukraine. Putin's not talking to anybody, he's going for the capital.

So again, I'm curious. Athos appears to support this invasion in the interest of another country's geopolitical moves.

You?

'Athos' is programmed to post scripts about Anglos this and that in the only English its developers can handle and post RT youtube clips.

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thegreatdivide

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Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine
Reply #642 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:29pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:15pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:11pm:

Yet the Russians living in Ukraine call it liberation.

Something for you to remember when thinking about Tibet, Xinjiang (East Turkestan) and inner Mongolia.

.

These are already autonomous regions of China, with freedom of culture, language and religion (but not freedom to secede).

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thegreatdivide

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Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine
Reply #643 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:33pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:17pm:

Karnal wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:11pm:

Maybe, but Athos is a fellow poster here. He has his own thoughts.

Bots don't have their own thoughts. They're AI. Try a Turing test on him. Write in another language (that's easily translatable) or write phonetically. See what happens.

Athos is not a bot, see post #621, a brilliant examination of 'freedom' by the Chief Inquisitor...

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: Russia will not invade Ukraine
Reply #644 - Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:34pm

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:29pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:15pm:

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 5^th, 2022 at 2:11pm:

Yet the Russians living in Ukraine call it liberation.

Something for you to remember when thinking about Tibet, Xinjiang (East Turkestan) and inner Mongolia.

.

These are already autonomous regions of China, with freedom of culture, language and religion (but not freedom to secede).

That's not what the Tibetans, Uighurs or inner Mongolians say.

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