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privatisation (Read 27878 times)
Dnarever
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Re: privatisation
Reply #105 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:40pm
 
John Smith wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:15pm:
aquascoot wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:12am:
John Smith wrote on Apr 11th, 2022 at 9:03pm:
aquascoot wrote on Apr 11th, 2022 at 7:54pm:
incorrect.


the best things that keep getting improved are made by private companies

just look at smart phones and tv's.

every year they get better and better.



Rubbish. They're not improving phones because they want to make them better for you, They're improving phones because they are trying to increase or maintain market share. If they could get away with selling you the same old nokia 5110 they were selling you decades ago, they would do it in a heartbeat.





aquascoot wrote on Apr 11th, 2022 at 7:54pm:
anything done by government is catastrophic and usually a failure.


more rubbish.





they increase market share by making them better for you, idiot  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


no, they increase market share by making it better than their competition. They don't give a bugger about ME.


Often they don't make it better they just market it better. They don't give a bugger if it is any better they just want to sell it.

I currently have a mobile phone that has a worst function of making phone calls - It is better at almost everything except what it is meant to do.
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wombatwoody
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Re: Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Reply #106 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:42pm
 
I don't see how this should be off topic in such a discussion.

Anyway, back in the 90s when John Howard was delivering his sales pitch for Telstra's privatisation he said it would be of great benefit to the average mum and dad - because they could buy shares and become investors.

But who asked him this: Why buy what you already own?


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Gnads
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Re: Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Reply #107 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:59pm
 
wombatwoody wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:42pm:
I don't see how this should be off topic in such a discussion.

Anyway, back in the 90s when John Howard was delivering his sales pitch for Telstra's privatisation he said it would be of great benefit to the average mum and dad - because they could buy shares and become investors.

But who asked him this: Why buy what you already own?




Exactly..... more LNP lies to help their Boys Club mates get rich milking the masses.
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freediver
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Re: privatisation
Reply #108 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:19pm
 
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Apr 11th, 2022 at 11:28pm:
Saying 'privatisation is good' over and over will not alter the fact that in every 'privatised' 'venture' the cost to the end user has gone up for a lower standard of service.


Crap.

Do you have any evidence at all for this?

Quote:
And for far more fundamental & moral reasons certain utility businesses like water & electricity generation/supply should not be in the hands of private enterprise.


Do you know what the reasons are?

Quote:
It's a furphy/fallacy that only the private sector can run a business anyway.


Strawman. Even a communist government can run a business. Just not very well.

Quote:
The fact that many of our politicians come from a private sector background & often go back there after politics should be evident.


It's got nothing at all to do with the skills of the individual.

Gnads wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:46am:
freediver wrote on Apr 10th, 2022 at 8:36pm:
What would have been done differently if it was in the government's hands?


Maintenance of infrastructure assets for one.


But we just had someone pointing out that the NSW government sold off electricity assets because it "couldn't afford" to maintain them.

Gnads wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:50am:
freediver wrote on Apr 11th, 2022 at 9:20am:
Because their management is too heavily influenced by politics. If you look at the workplace culture of state owned enterprises compared to privately owned ones it is always the same thing - unproductive, unmotivated.

A competitive marketplace will deliver the goods cheaper. Ultimately, it is for the same reason why capitalist economies are so much wealthier than the communist ones. Communism gives you an idea of what happens when the government controls all the businesses. So unless there is a sound economic reason - that is, a condition that makes a market failure both inevitable and worse than the alternative of government ownership - democratic governments around the world have been steadily unloading state owned assets.

Which industries do you consider to be a matter of national security?

 
You complete tosser Grin

You're saying that politics wouldn't be involved when the system is being run by LNP supporting business?


Yes. People tend to run their businesses to make money.

Quote:
And for national security reasons we do not require foreign investment in essential public utilities like electricity & water supply.


Grin

You think the water supply is a national security issue?

Quote:
Because they can afford to ...... & they're elitist snot nosed twerps like you.


Another lie. Most of them struggle to come up with the money.

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Well under the private only model those who cannot pay get no education.


Youa re missing the point DNA.

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And then you find that as often as not the public schools end up leading the education standards results and receive the top grades.


So the parrots keep mindlessly chanting. But where is the evidence?

Quote:
It seems frustrating to be asked to explain the obvious, things that you obviously do know yourself.
It isn't determined by the history but the history displayed the position. There are industries that historically have been part of the competitive market most this is because it is where they belong. Things that may even benefit from competition that are not essential services or not of national importance.


So how do you know where they belong?

Quote:
It would be just as ludicrous to nationalize yo-yo manufacture as it is to privatise education or power.


And yet you cannot explain why.
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« Last Edit: Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:30pm by freediver »  

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Gnads
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Re: privatisation
Reply #109 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:30pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:19pm:
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Apr 11th, 2022 at 11:28pm:
Saying 'privatisation is good' over and over will not alter the fact that in every 'privatised' 'venture' the cost to the end user has gone up for a lower standard of service.


Crap.

Do you have any evidence at all for this?


It happens to be true. Don't know what world you're living in.
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freediver
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Re: privatisation
Reply #110 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:31pm
 
Gnads wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:30pm:
freediver wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:19pm:
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Apr 11th, 2022 at 11:28pm:
Saying 'privatisation is good' over and over will not alter the fact that in every 'privatised' 'venture' the cost to the end user has gone up for a lower standard of service.


Crap.

Do you have any evidence at all for this?


It happens to be true. Don't know what world you're living in.


This isn't a religion Gnads. You need evidence. No matter how strongly you believe it yourself.
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John Smith
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Re: privatisation
Reply #111 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 7:16pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:31pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:30pm:
freediver wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 6:19pm:
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Apr 11th, 2022 at 11:28pm:
Saying 'privatisation is good' over and over will not alter the fact that in every 'privatised' 'venture' the cost to the end user has gone up for a lower standard of service.


Crap.

Do you have any evidence at all for this?


It happens to be true. Don't know what world you're living in.


This isn't a religion Gnads. You need evidence. No matter how strongly you believe it yourself.


The same could be said off you. SO far you haven't provided any evidence that private education provides better results. Nothing. You could prove private education provides better results just as easily as they can the other way. It's the same web sites. Instead you just make the same dumb comments repeatedly and demand others prove you wrong.
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freediver
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Re: privatisation
Reply #112 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 7:25pm
 
Quote:
SO far you haven't provided any evidence that private education provides better results.


Sure I have. The fact that so many people are willing to pay so much for it.

Money talks, BS walks.

Quote:
every 'privatised' 'venture' the cost to the end user has gone up for a lower standard of service


This is both an absurd statement, and one that is easy to back up with evidence. So far the only evidence we have is Monk driving past a power pole that had blown over, and hearing somewhere it was built privately, and the NSW government not being able to afford to maintain electricity infrastructure.
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Lisa Jones
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Re: Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Reply #113 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 7:36pm
 
Gnads wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:59pm:
wombatwoody wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:42pm:
I don't see how this should be off topic in such a discussion.

Anyway, back in the 90s when John Howard was delivering his sales pitch for Telstra's privatisation he said it would be of great benefit to the average mum and dad - because they could buy shares and become investors.

But who asked him this:Why buy what you already own?




Exactly..... more LNP lies to help their Boys Club mates get rich milking the masses.


Ahem.

While privatisation is supported by neoliberal ideology that stipulates less government intervention in the economy, Australia's history of privatisation was initiated under a Labor government, which appears to defy Labor Party policy objectives.

However, during the Hawke-Keating years, there were attempts to remove the ideological underpinnings of the debate on privatisation, as the approach taken by the government was "more about a pragmatic choice" to modernise and open the economy to international markets. Prime Minister Hawke said, "The difference between us will be one of ideology. That will distinguish us from the opposition (Liberals)."

Hawke was rebuking the charge that Labor had abandoned its commitments to public ownership and enterprise, while highlighting the need for economic rationalism in order to address pressing economic problems.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privatisation_in_Australia
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Baronvonrort
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Re: privatisation
Reply #114 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 8:32pm
 
Dnarever wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 11:51am:
freediver wrote on Apr 11th, 2022 at 9:06pm:
Quote:
Typically not but it was the reason behind NSW's Labor's attempted power sell off.

Simply the NSW government could not afford the necessary upgrades and maintenance due to a long period of neglect.

So it isn't always the reason but it can be.


Just in case anyone has forgotten this little gem.


One case of a justified sell off.


Amusing how those against privatisation are all for getting solar panels and a battery.

I guess privatisation is only bad sometimes.  Smiley
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Re: privatisation
Reply #115 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 8:33pm
 
Is Labor still committed to public ownership? It is hard to find a clear answer.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-09-20/fact-check3a-are-labor27s-policies-socialist3f/8948552

Quote:
The Australian Labor Party's national platform has long included an objective of "democratic socialism" along these lines "to the extent necessary", but it is not reflected in the party's current policies.

Labor is not proposing nationalisation of Australian industries.
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Re: privatisation
Reply #116 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 8:45pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 7:25pm:
Quote:
SO far you haven't provided any evidence that private education provides better results.


Sure I have. The fact that so many people are willing to pay so much for it.

Money talks, BS walks.



In NSW we only have 2 government non selective high schools in the top 100 schools.

Willoughby Girls High school is highest ranked at 65th that area has large Asian population.

A government selective high school only takes bright kids these schools do well because they don't admit dim wits.The kids sit a test in 6th grade to qualify for a selective high school. The high school i went to is ranked 2nd best in NSW.

10 private schools are ranked in the top 21 high schools.

https://www.matrix.edu.au/high-school-rankings/2021-high-school-rankings/

If your offspring aren't smart enough to get into selective high school then private schools have better results compared to non selective government schools.


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Re: privatisation
Reply #117 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 8:48pm
 
Quote:
In NSW we only have 2 government non selective high schools in the top 100 schools.


That seems rather different to the chants coming from the mindless parrots.
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John Smith
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Re: privatisation
Reply #118 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 8:56pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 7:25pm:
Sure I have. The fact that so many people are willing to pay so much for it.

Money talks, BS walks.



best you keep walking then.
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Re: Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Reply #119 - Apr 12th, 2022 at 9:11pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 10th, 2022 at 7:53pm:
For far more fundamental reasons - the government should not be running these businesses in the first place.


The governments job is running the country it should not be involved with businesses.

We should privatise the ABC/SBS those who like it can buy shares in it. It will save taxpayers over a billion dollars a year. Why should those who don't watch it pay taxes for a small minority who don't want commercials to pay for it?




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