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privatisation (Read 27807 times)
Grappler Truth Teller Feller
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Re: privatisation
Reply #195 - Apr 15th, 2022 at 11:23am
 
You can't eat theories, though if you gather enough of them together you could build a house of paper pages...
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Grappler Truth Teller Feller
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Re: privatisation
Reply #196 - Apr 15th, 2022 at 11:25am
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 14th, 2022 at 8:07pm:
Adam Bandt demolishes a private profit above social well-being ideologue from News Corp, at the National Press Club on the 13th (yesterday):

Adam Bandt shuts down a journalist's 'gotcha' question at the Press Club

https://dai.ly/x89y7dh

(15 secs. of electoral commission advert as the start)

Tingle scratching her nose at the end  is priceless ...Bandt striking a bit 'close to home', perhaps..



What does 'private profit above social well-being' have to do with the way money is (not) created?

Different issues... stick to one first... nobody is convinced on that yet..
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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thegreatdivide
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Re: privatisation
Reply #197 - Apr 15th, 2022 at 4:18pm
 
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Apr 15th, 2022 at 11:25am:
thegreatdivide wrote on Apr 14th, 2022 at 8:07pm:
Adam Bandt demolishes a private profit above social well-being ideologue from News Corp, at the National Press Club on the 13th (yesterday):

Adam Bandt shuts down a journalist's 'gotcha' question at the Press Club

https://dai.ly/x89y7dh

(15 secs. of electoral commission advert as the start)

Tingle scratching her nose at the end  is priceless ...Bandt striking a bit 'close to home', perhaps..



What does 'private profit above social well-being' have to do with the way money is (not) created?


The point is newscorp journos know nothing about money creation, which is why they ask stupid questions of politicians (Bandt and the Greens are actually MMT-literate, and can therefore blow away stupid journos' questions).

Quote:
Different issues... stick to one first... nobody is convinced on that yet..


Addressed above, journos deliberately ask stupid questions to ensnare politicians who are all constrained by the present evil debt-money system.

Quote:
You can't eat theories, though if you gather enough of them together you could build a house of paper pages...


You mentioned 'real butter', I explained you are actually eating shite (ie money as debt) , though you don't know it because private banksters have convinced you otherwise.

There is nothing theoretical about real resources, whereas the illusion that money is a real resource is certainly problematic.

Money is like  the 'points' used to keep score in a game; it is 'drawn from the ether' - like 'points' - ie created ex nihilo as required to enable convenient mobilization  of real resources. 

The problem is that private banksters claim the sole right to create money, meaning that governments  cannot fund the needs of the community, given that no-one wants to pay higher  taxes, and everyone thinks - erroneously - the government's budget is like their own household budget.   
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« Last Edit: Apr 15th, 2022 at 4:25pm by thegreatdivide »  
 
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wombatwoody
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Re: Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Reply #198 - Apr 15th, 2022 at 9:30pm
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 7:36pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:59pm:
wombatwoody wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:42pm:
I don't see how this should be off topic in such a discussion.

Anyway, back in the 90s when John Howard was delivering his sales pitch for Telstra's privatisation he said it would be of great benefit to the average mum and dad - because they could buy shares and become investors.

But who asked him this:Why buy what you already own?




Exactly..... more LNP lies to help their Boys Club mates get rich milking the masses.


Ahem.

While privatisation is supported by neoliberal ideology that stipulates less government intervention in the economy, Australia's history of privatisation was initiated under a Labor government, which appears to defy Labor Party policy objectives.

However, during the Hawke-Keating years, there were attempts to remove the ideological underpinnings of the debate on privatisation, as the approach taken by the government was "more about a pragmatic choice" to modernise and open the economy to international markets. Prime Minister Hawke said, "The difference between us will be one of ideology. That will distinguish us from the opposition (Liberals)."

Hawke was rebuking the charge that Labor had abandoned its commitments to public ownership and enterprise, while highlighting the need for economic rationalism in order to address pressing economic problems.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privatisation_in_Australia


Shows how when it comes to things that really matter both parties are the same.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Reply #199 - May 17th, 2022 at 2:29pm
 
wombatwoody wrote on Apr 15th, 2022 at 9:30pm:
Lisa Jones wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 7:36pm:
Gnads wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:59pm:
wombatwoody wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 5:42pm:
I don't see how this should be off topic in such a discussion.

Anyway, back in the 90s when John Howard was delivering his sales pitch for Telstra's privatisation he said it would be of great benefit to the average mum and dad - because they could buy shares and become investors.

But who asked him this:Why buy what you already own?




Exactly..... more LNP lies to help their Boys Club mates get rich milking the masses.


Ahem.

While privatisation is supported by neoliberal ideology that stipulates less government intervention in the economy, Australia's history of privatisation was initiated under a Labor government, which appears to defy Labor Party policy objectives.

However, during the Hawke-Keating years, there were attempts to remove the ideological underpinnings of the debate on privatisation, as the approach taken by the government was "more about a pragmatic choice" to modernise and open the economy to international markets. Prime Minister Hawke said, "The difference between us will be one of ideology. That will distinguish us from the opposition (Liberals)."

Hawke was rebuking the charge that Labor had abandoned its commitments to public ownership and enterprise, while highlighting the need for economic rationalism in order to address pressing economic problems.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privatisation_in_Australia


Shows how when it comes to things that really matter both parties are the same.


Exactly. Hawke was captured by the then new global neoliberal economic orthodoxy, without being aware of it.

And so today the major difference between the parties is in housing policy...and both fail to deal with the problem of sky-rocketing housing prices,  falling home ownership, and un-affordable rent.

Hawke forgot that Menzies was able to build sufficient public housing for low-wage earners to house everyone
(and eliminate unemployment) ......by running continuous government deficits in a growing economy.

MMT offers the next stage in the evolution of a functioning economy, ie one which provides housing and jobs for everyone, by achieving continuous rises in living standards, in a non high-population-growth environment (in contrast to the immigration fueled, post war Menzies years).




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thegreatdivide
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Re: privatisation
Reply #200 - May 17th, 2022 at 3:03pm
 
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privatisation_in_Australia

"While privatisation is supported by neoliberal ideology that stipulates less government intervention in the economy, Australia's history of privatisation was initiated under a Labor government, which appears to defy Labor Party policy objectives.

However, during the Hawke-Keating years, there were attempts to remove the ideological underpinnings of the debate on privatisation, as the approach taken by the government was "more about a pragmatic choice" to modernise and open the economy to international markets. Prime Minister Hawke said, "The difference between us will be one of ideology. That will distinguish us from the opposition (Liberals).

Hawke was rebuking the charge that Labor had abandoned its commitments to public ownership and enterprise, while highlighting the need for economic rationalism in order to address pressing economic problems".


Exactly. Hawke was captured by the then new global neoliberal economic orthodoxy, without understanding the reasons for the establishment of neoliberalism.

And so today the major difference between the parties is in housing policy...and both fail to deal with the problem of sky-rocketing housing prices,  falling home ownership,  and un-affordable rent, threatening to permanently lock the low paid, job-insecure young (inter alia)  out of home ownership. 

Hawke forgot that Menzies was able to build sufficient public housing for low-wage earners to house everyone
(and eliminate unemployment) ......by running continuous government deficits in a growing economy. (in the pre-neoliberal era).

MMT offers the next stage in the evolution of a functioning economy (in the era of globalization), ie an economy which provides housing and jobs for everyone, by achieving continuous rises in living standards, in a non high-population-growth environment (in contrast to the immigration fueled, post war Menzies years).





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« Last Edit: May 17th, 2022 at 3:12pm by thegreatdivide »  
 
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Re: privatisation
Reply #201 - May 17th, 2022 at 5:51pm
 
TUZENBAKH. The yearning for work, oh dear, how well I understand it! I've never worked in my life. I was born in cold, idle Petersburg, in a family that had known nothing of work or cares of any kind. I remember, when I came home from the military school, a valet used to pull off my boots. I used to be troublesome, but my mother looked at me with reverential awe, and was surprised when other people didn't do the same. I was shielded from work. But I doubt if they have succeeded in shielding me completely, I doubt it! The time is at hand, an avalanche is moving down upon us, a mighty clearing storm which is coming, is already near and will soon blow the laziness, the indifference, the distaste for work, the rotten boredom out of our society. I'll work, and in another twenty-five or thirty years every one will have to work. Every one!

Chekhov, The Three Sisters, 1901.


And he was right about Russia  - and look what happened to Russia.
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Re: privatisation
Reply #202 - May 17th, 2022 at 7:35pm
 
.
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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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Re: Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Reply #203 - May 17th, 2022 at 7:38pm
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Apr 13th, 2022 at 9:22pm:
John Smith wrote on Apr 13th, 2022 at 5:12pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 9:11pm:
We should privatise the ABC/SBS those who like it can buy shares in it. It will save taxpayers over a billion dollars a year. Why should those who don't watch it pay taxes for a small minority who don't want commercials to pay for it?




Crap. SBS and ABC provide local coverage for everyone, including in areas where private media would not bother.



That's more bullshit from a bullshitter.

With the internet people get coverage for what they want.

We should also sell off the remaining part of Telstra. People in remote areas aren't going to get copper cables to connect that's too expensive when they can use 4g/5g coverage.

Elon Musks starlink is  giving internet coverage which would be cheaper and quicker than waiting for Telstra to run copper lines into remote areas.

As for water lots of people still use rainwater tanks in rural areas they truck in water when tanks run dry.

The governments job is running the country they should sell off any business they're involved with.





Grin Grin Grin

my internet stop working almost every time it rains or when the guy down the road waters his lawn

Thanks to the libtard party
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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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Re: privatisation
Reply #204 - May 17th, 2022 at 7:40pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 14th, 2022 at 7:47am:
No you do not always know what you pay, especially when the government is running it.

You have no evidence at all.



I'm not surprised that you are clueless but most people know what their services cost them. They typically get a bill every month or quarter
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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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Re: Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Reply #205 - May 17th, 2022 at 8:43pm
 
John Smith wrote on May 17th, 2022 at 7:38pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Apr 13th, 2022 at 9:22pm:
John Smith wrote on Apr 13th, 2022 at 5:12pm:
Baronvonrort wrote on Apr 12th, 2022 at 9:11pm:
We should privatise the ABC/SBS those who like it can buy shares in it. It will save taxpayers over a billion dollars a year. Why should those who don't watch it pay taxes for a small minority who don't want commercials to pay for it?




Crap. SBS and ABC provide local coverage for everyone, including in areas where private media would not bother.



That's more bullshit from a bullshitter.

With the internet people get coverage for what they want.

We should also sell off the remaining part of Telstra. People in remote areas aren't going to get copper cables to connect that's too expensive when they can use 4g/5g coverage.

Elon Musks starlink is  giving internet coverage which would be cheaper and quicker than waiting for Telstra to run copper lines into remote areas.

As for water lots of people still use rainwater tanks in rural areas they truck in water when tanks run dry.

The governments job is running the country they should sell off any business they're involved with.





Grin Grin Grin

my internet stop working almost every time it rains or when the guy down the road waters his lawn

Thanks to the libtard party

Move out of the Italian ghetto, Planks. They have been dudding you, the compadres.



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Re: privatisation
Reply #206 - May 17th, 2022 at 9:20pm
 
John Smith wrote on May 17th, 2022 at 7:40pm:
freediver wrote on Apr 14th, 2022 at 7:47am:
No you do not always know what you pay, especially when the government is running it.

You have no evidence at all.



I'm not surprised that you are clueless but most people know what their services cost them. They typically get a bill every month or quarter


Not when the government runs things. They set the price to win votes, not to cover their costs.
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Re: privatisation
Reply #207 - May 17th, 2022 at 9:21pm
 
Privatisation is a great idea - Never.
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Re: privatisation
Reply #208 - May 17th, 2022 at 9:23pm
 
Dnarever wrote on May 17th, 2022 at 9:21pm:
Privatisation is a great idea - Never.


Why do you think the Labor party is so fond of it?
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Re: privatisation
Reply #209 - May 17th, 2022 at 9:26pm
 
freediver wrote on May 17th, 2022 at 9:20pm:
John Smith wrote on May 17th, 2022 at 7:40pm:
freediver wrote on Apr 14th, 2022 at 7:47am:
No you do not always know what you pay, especially when the government is running it.

You have no evidence at all.



I'm not surprised that you are clueless but most people know what their services cost them. They typically get a bill every month or quarter


Not when the government runs things. They set the price to win votes, not to cover their costs.


You have some examples of this happening? I can not say that I have ever seen this . As often as not we get the argument that privatisation forces the price down through competition though we know that isn't true either.

So now we have the argument that Government run will price too low and the competition from privatisation will reduce the prices by more.

Does that sound about right?
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