Australian Politics Forum - Mask mandates didn't do anything

aquascoot Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 34603 Gender:	Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything Reply #330 - Oct 31^st, 2022 at 5:15am mah a friend of my wifes works at a pathology centre. she wore full ppe, an n95 that was personally fitted by an expert a face shield AND she still caught covid twice at work. you cant fight off an airborne virus in a big city it was always the best strategy to work on your own health
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AusGeoff

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #331 - Oct 31^st, 2022 at 5:42am

ShellShilo wrote on Oct 30^th, 2022 at 4:23pm:

...Thank you for listening. And, I will agree to disagree.

Thanks for that Shell. I always respect people who have well-considered,
well-articulated reasons for following the path they choose—whether it's
to wear a mask, or whether be vaccinated. We, all of us, have a right to
choose as we see fit.

What I despise is the people—many here unfortunately—who have no
apparent reasons for doing what they do COVID-wise. They simply attack
people like me who have done their personal due diligence, and acted upon
the result, as you have done.

For posting my own valid opinions about COVID and its causes and prevention,
I've been attacked numerous times by people who rely on crude insults, and
ad hominems—but with zero data actually refuting my claims.

The insults roll off my back like water off the duck's, but those people seem
to enjoy throwing around pathetic little schoolyard insults. Let 'em have their
fun I say—it just further reduces any logic in their absurd claims.

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AusGeoff

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #332 - Oct 31^st, 2022 at 5:52am

aquascoot wrote on Oct 31^st, 2022 at 5:15am:

mah

a friend of my wifes works at a pathology centre.
she wore full ppe, an n95 that was personally fitted by an expert
a face shield

AND

she still caught covid twice at work.

you cant fight off an airborne virus in a big city

it was always the best strategy to work on your own health

I guess people working in close contact with infected people hugely
raises the odds of contracting COVID, despite one's best precautions.

Of course, having said that, there's no viable evidence that the nurse
contracted the disease whilst she was actually at work. Obviously
she travelled outside of work, into shops and banks, and public transport
and friend's homes etc. After its incubation period passes, it's impossible
to determine where or when the sufferer picked up the virus—due to the
multiple locations visited.

To say she contracted it (solely) at work veers very closely towards a
"correlation does not imply causation" fallacy.

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ShellShilo

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #333 - Oct 31^st, 2022 at 5:41pm

AusGeoff wrote on Oct 31^st, 2022 at 5:42am:

ShellShilo wrote on Oct 30^th, 2022 at 4:23pm:

...Thank you for listening. And, I will agree to disagree.

Thanks for that Shell. I always respect people who have well-considered,
well-articulated reasons for following the path they choose—whether it's
to wear a mask, or whether be vaccinated. We, all of us, have a right to
choose as we see fit.

What I despise is the people—many here unfortunately—who have no
apparent reasons for doing what they do COVID-wise. They simply attack
people like me who have done their personal due diligence, and acted upon
the result, as you have done.

For posting my own valid opinions about COVID and its causes and prevention,
I've been attacked numerous times by people who rely on crude insults, and
ad hominems—but with zero data actually refuting my claims.

The insults roll off my back like water off the duck's, but those people seem
to enjoy throwing around pathetic little schoolyard insults. Let 'em have their
fun I say—it just further reduces any logic in their absurd claims.

As "Lols" can confirm, I can truly empathize with you. My view was a minority view on another political forum. I was banned twice, and three threads were closed down by the admin. I was told, that what I was saying about Covid was dangerous and irresponsible. So, the ad hominem and personal attacks kept coming fast and furious. These people simple live in their own echo-chambers.

Remember, there are people who still believe in Zeus and Thor, or that the earth is flat. So, the truth might only be relative to whatever is the popular consensus. So, do your own research, and make your own choices. It's your body, and your life.

Anything that you introduce into the body, that didn't come with the body, will produce side effects, or can have adverse reactions. This even includes foods. And, unless you want to wear a fully self-contained Hazmat suit, and live for the rest of your life at the bottom of your swimming pool, then there is nothing you can do that can prevent any virus from infecting you.

It's NOT the virus that will kill you. It's our immune's Cytokine storm and septic shock syndrome that will kill you. It is this balance that determines the condition of our immune system. If you are in the high-risk groups, then your immune system is already compromised, and is not as efficient. Therefore, those in these high-risk groups should take whatever precautions that are available.

So, maybe you fall into the high risk groups. Or, maybe you just want to feel more safe and secure from this disease. This is YOUR choice. And, no government should be allowed to force you to chooser, one way or the other.

Good luck to you.

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Dnarever

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #334 - Oct 31^st, 2022 at 5:54pm

ShellShilo wrote on Oct 30^th, 2022 at 9:00pm:

Dnarever wrote on Oct 30^th, 2022 at 4:56pm:

ShellShilo wrote on Oct 29^th, 2022 at 12:17am:

Carl D wrote on Oct 28^th, 2022 at 9:56pm:

Gordon wrote on Oct 28^th, 2022 at 7:53pm:

Everyone was coughing up furballs but the mask protected me. At least they work for something.

They even look like corona viruses!

I strongly suspect it isn't the plane trees causing it.

I see people from around Australia commenting daily on Twitter about the almost constant 'chorus of coughing' they hear in places like shopping centres these days - sounds like some of them are coughing up a lung.

I've even heard it myself a few times when I'm shopping. Thank goodness I'm still one of the few who didn't fall for the "pandemic is over, no need to wear a mask anymore" BS from our pathetic Federal and State governments (and the media, of course).

I think what people are saying is, that this is about, "CHOICE". I should have the choice of what I want to put into my body. I should have a choice of what I want to put on my face. I should have a choice on whom I wish to share my medical history with. These choices were taken away from me. Now, I have them back.

So, you are free to keep your distance. You are free to wear as many masks has you like. And, you can take as many doses of this vaccine as you want. This is your right. Whatever makes you feel safe and secure.

But I also feel safe and secure, without doing all of these things. My freedom is worth more than the risk of catching the flu.

Quote:

I think what people are saying is, that this is about, "CHOICE". I should have the choice of what I want to put into my body. I should have a choice of what I want to put on my face. I should have a choice on whom I wish to share my medical history with.

You also get the choice of being prosecuted if your choice kills other people.

What crime exactly would you be prosecuted for?

You really want to defend your right to kill other people through your negligent behaviour ?

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ShellShilo

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #335 - Oct 31^st, 2022 at 8:47pm

Dnarever wrote on Oct 31^st, 2022 at 5:54pm:

ShellShilo wrote on Oct 30^th, 2022 at 9:00pm:

Dnarever wrote on Oct 30^th, 2022 at 4:56pm:

ShellShilo wrote on Oct 29^th, 2022 at 12:17am:

Carl D wrote on Oct 28^th, 2022 at 9:56pm:

Gordon wrote on Oct 28^th, 2022 at 7:53pm:

Everyone was coughing up furballs but the mask protected me. At least they work for something.

They even look like corona viruses!

I strongly suspect it isn't the plane trees causing it.

I see people from around Australia commenting daily on Twitter about the almost constant 'chorus of coughing' they hear in places like shopping centres these days - sounds like some of them are coughing up a lung.

I've even heard it myself a few times when I'm shopping. Thank goodness I'm still one of the few who didn't fall for the "pandemic is over, no need to wear a mask anymore" BS from our pathetic Federal and State governments (and the media, of course).

I think what people are saying is, that this is about, "CHOICE". I should have the choice of what I want to put into my body. I should have a choice of what I want to put on my face. I should have a choice on whom I wish to share my medical history with. These choices were taken away from me. Now, I have them back.

So, you are free to keep your distance. You are free to wear as many masks has you like. And, you can take as many doses of this vaccine as you want. This is your right. Whatever makes you feel safe and secure.

But I also feel safe and secure, without doing all of these things. My freedom is worth more than the risk of catching the flu.

Quote:

I think what people are saying is, that this is about, "CHOICE". I should have the choice of what I want to put into my body. I should have a choice of what I want to put on my face. I should have a choice on whom I wish to share my medical history with.

You also get the choice of being prosecuted if your choice kills other people.

What crime exactly would you be prosecuted for?

You really want to defend your right to kill other people through your negligent behaviour ?

Again I ask you, what is the crime that is being committed here? You are asking me a loaded question. You're saying that anyone who chooses NOT to follow medical protocols, is choosing to kill people. Then you're saying that killing people through medical negligence, is somehow an individual right that I am defending. Neither is correct.

There is no direct causality link between following medical protocols and people dying from this virus. In fact, the stats show that the opposite seems to be true.

Choosing to infect someone with this flu virus, because you didn't wash your hands that morning, would be a legal nightmare to prosecute. Let alone to enforce. But your assumption that choosing NOT to follow medical protocols/mandates, is choosing to kill people, would be impossible to prove, let alone to prosecute.

Also, there is no such thing, as a RIGHT to kill another through criminal negligent behavior. But I do have the right to choose what goes into my body. Regardless, if the whole world drops dead. Or, even what I choose to wear on my face. What about all the millions of Australians who are NOT even infected? Are they also choosing to kill people, because they choose not to wear a mask?

What I don't understand, is why you can't see the slippery slope that is being created? Just how far are you willing to allow the government to intrude into your privacy? They've even built interment/quarantine camps for people who may/may not have had Covid-19. And, you don't even raise an eyebrow. Just how far are you willing to go for the greater good?

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Sophia

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #336 - Nov 12^th, 2022 at 12:48pm

I am beginning to wonder now….
Here’s 3 of us travelling from Tullamarine airport to gold coast… plane cancelled and we are stuck between airport and motel nearby killing time (8 hours).
Daughter and I don’t bother with masks… hubby wears a mask the entire time even on the plane and in the car with Uber driver…
Guess who’s got a sore throat last night and is sneezing and nose dripping.
And daughter and I are okay.. no symptoms of any kind.
Hubby was so paranoid about being in public with covid lurking around…
Did his mask make him sick?
I just did a RAT test on him and it shows up negative.
It’s not just covid but breathing into a mask for hours that will do something too!
I bought some anti histamines and he’s stopped sneezing and snoozing instead.
Geezuz men and their flu/colds! Like he’s dying! Roll Eyes

I wonder if after all this if he will wear a mask going back?

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Sophia

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #337 - Nov 12^th, 2022 at 1:16pm

I was always pro mask wearing… now I’ve changed my mind… and… what do I see on qld broadcasting? That it’s recommended to wear masks indoors in public.
Im certain those filthy things are the cause of widespread germs.
Be funny if one day they say they were wrong … it’s the masks that cause self to become sick Undecided

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #338 - Nov 13^th, 2022 at 9:48am

Sophia wrote on Nov 12^th, 2022 at 1:16pm:

I was always pro mask wearing… now I’ve changed my mind… and… what do I see on qld broadcasting? That it’s recommended to wear masks indoors in public.
Im certain those filthy things are the cause of widespread germs.
Be funny if one day they say they were wrong … it’s the masks that cause self to become sick Undecided

I was pro N95 mask wearing for covid i changed my mind after looking at the evidence.

The government will never admit they were wrong on anything. Most think politicians made them safe because politicians claimed they made it safer for us and never question these lies.

Quote:

Masks do more harm than good

June 8, 2022

“Whilst masks are a successful psychological tool to remind the public to remain alert, they are not effective in preventing the community spread of disease.“

In March 2021, HART published a review of the evidence for the effectiveness of masks in reducing the transmission of respiratory viruses, and highlighted the potential negative consequences (physical, social and psychological) of requiring healthy people to cover their faces in community settings. The conclusion was that masks do more harm than good. Over 12 months later, this extended update of the relevant science draws a similar conclusion.

Prior to June 2020, public health organisations, and their experts, did not endorse masking healthy people in the community as a means of reducing viral transmission.

In an interview on March 2020, Dr Jenny Harries (England’s Deputy Chief Medical Officer) said that, ‘For the average member of the public’ masks ‘are really not a good idea’ and that ‘people can put themselves at more risk than less’. Professor Jason Leitch (Scotland’s Clinical Director) in April 2020 made the unequivocal statement that, ‘The global evidence is masks in the general population don’t work’. Other senior health officials – including Professor Chris Whitty, Sir Patrick Vallance and Matt Hancock – have made similar comments.

The World Health Organisation (WHO), in their 2019 review of non-drug interventions to manage a pandemic, did not recommend face masks for healthy people. As recently as December 2020, in a WHO document titled ‘Mask use in the context of COVID-19’, it is stated that, ‘There is only limited and inconsistent scientific evidence to support the effectiveness of masking healthy people in the community’. Given these statements it is unclear as to why the WHO changed their advice in the summer of 2020, although according to a Newsnight report it may have been in response to political lobbying.

Is there evidence that masks are ineffective in reducing viral transmission?

A wealth of empirical evidence has accumulated in support of the premise that masking healthy people in community settings achieves no substantial reduction in levels of respiratory-virus transmission.

With regards to RCTs – the most robust type of evidence – a review of 14 such studies into the spread of influenza found that masks led to no significant reduction in risk of infection for neither the wearer nor others. As for the SARS-CoV-2 virus, a large RCT (often referred to as the ‘Danish mask study’), using appropriately-fitted and high-quality surgical masks, failed to realise any significant benefit for the wearer.

The potential harms of wearing masks

The negative consequences of healthy people routinely wearing a mask can be grouped under three headings: physical; social/psychological; and environmental

More here- https://www.hartgroup.org/masks-do-more-harm-than-good/

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Carl D

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #339 - Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:00am

Quote:

The World Health Organisation (WHO), in their 2019 review of non-drug interventions to manage a pandemic, did not recommend face masks for healthy people. As recently as December 2020, in a WHO document titled ‘Mask use in the context of COVID-19’, it is stated that, ‘There is only limited and inconsistent scientific evidence to support the effectiveness of masking healthy people in the community’. Given these statements it is unclear as to why the WHO changed their advice in the summer of 2020, although according to a Newsnight report it may have been in response to political lobbying.

Was that from when we were still all being told COVID-19 wasn't airborne (like smoke) and it was mostly spread by droplets that travelled no more than 1.5 metres (hence the pointless "Please keep a 1.5 metre distance from others" signs stuck all over the floor in places like supermarket checkouts, some of which are still there as I've noticed when I'm shopping)?

Oh, and when we were told COVID-19 was also spread by touching infected surfaces hence the hand sanitiser everywhere (still see a lot of that in shop entrances too).

Scares the heck out of me when I go to Belmont Forum and see vulnerable elderly people not wearing a mask but they're still diligently sanitising their hands and shopping trolley handles before going into the supermarkets (and a lot of these people leave their discarded sanitising wipes in the trolleys after they've done with them from what I see). Roll Eyes

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« Last Edit: Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:07am by Carl D »

** Repeat Covid infections exercise our immune system in the same way that repeat concussions exercise our brain **

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Dnarever

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #340 - Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:12am

Carl D wrote on Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:00am:

Quote:

The World Health Organisation (WHO), in their 2019 review of non-drug interventions to manage a pandemic, did not recommend face masks for healthy people. As recently as December 2020, in a WHO document titled ‘Mask use in the context of COVID-19’, it is stated that, ‘There is only limited and inconsistent scientific evidence to support the effectiveness of masking healthy people in the community’. Given these statements it is unclear as to why the WHO changed their advice in the summer of 2020, although according to a Newsnight report it may have been in response to political lobbying.

Was that from when we were still all being told COVID-19 wasn't airborne (like smoke) and it was mostly spread by droplets that travelled no more than 1.5 metres (hence the pointless "Please keep a 1.5 metre distance from others" signs stuck all over the floor in places like supermarket checkouts (some of which are still there as I've noticed when I'm shopping).

Oh, and when we were told COVID-19 was also spread by touching infected surfaces hence the hand sanitiser everywhere (still see a lot of that in shop entrances too).

Scares the heck out of me when I go to Belmont Forum and see vulnerable elderly people not wearing a mask but they're still diligently sanitising their hands and shopping trolly handles before going into the supermarkets (and a lot of these people leave their discarded sanitising wipes in the trolleys after they've done with them from what I see). Roll Eyes

Quote:

it was mostly spread by droplets that travelled no more than 1.5 metres

Yes it was mostly spread this way, there was also some aerosol transmission. Distancing did help and it was known that none of the protective strategies were 100% but they were all much better than nothing.

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Dnarever

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #341 - Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:14am

AusGeoff wrote on Oct 31^st, 2022 at 5:52am:

aquascoot wrote on Oct 31^st, 2022 at 5:15am:

mah

a friend of my wifes works at a pathology centre.
she wore full ppe, an n95 that was personally fitted by an expert
a face shield

AND

she still caught covid twice at work.

you cant fight off an airborne virus in a big city

it was always the best strategy to work on your own health

I guess people working in close contact with infected people hugely
raises the odds of contracting COVID, despite one's best precautions.

Of course, having said that, there's no viable evidence that the nurse
contracted the disease whilst she was actually at work. Obviously
she travelled outside of work, into shops and banks, and public transport
and friend's homes etc. After its incubation period passes, it's impossible
to determine where or when the sufferer picked up the virus—due to the
multiple locations visited.

To say she contracted it (solely) at work veers very closely towards a
"correlation does not imply causation" fallacy.

Being a friend of Aqua's wife would be a risk factor.

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #342 - Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:33am

Carl D wrote on Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:00am:

Quote:

The World Health Organisation (WHO), in their 2019 review of non-drug interventions to manage a pandemic, did not recommend face masks for healthy people. As recently as December 2020, in a WHO document titled ‘Mask use in the context of COVID-19’, it is stated that, ‘There is only limited and inconsistent scientific evidence to support the effectiveness of masking healthy people in the community’. Given these statements it is unclear as to why the WHO changed their advice in the summer of 2020, although according to a Newsnight report it may have been in response to political lobbying.

Was that from when we were still all being told COVID-19 wasn't airborne (like smoke) and it was mostly spread by droplets that travelled no more than 1.5 metres (hence the pointless "Please keep a 1.5 metre distance from others" signs stuck all over the floor in places like supermarket checkouts, some of which are still there as I've noticed when I'm shopping)?

Oh, and when we were told COVID-19 was also spread by touching infected surfaces hence the hand sanitiser everywhere (still see a lot of that in shop entrances too).

Scares the heck out of me when I go to Belmont Forum and see vulnerable elderly people not wearing a mask but they're still diligently sanitising their hands and shopping trolley handles before going into the supermarkets (and a lot of these people leave their discarded sanitising wipes in the trolleys after they've done with them from what I see). Roll Eyes

It was the Japanese who came up with the theory this virus is airborne with the Diamond Princess cruise ship which was one of the first major outbreaks. It took the WHO and CDC nearly 2 years to accept this. Our RACGP were saying it's airborne and frustrated nobody would listen so why did we ignore our experts to blindly follow the WHO and CDC?

There is no evidence masks work with flu virus which is also airborne so masking is bullshit from politicians trying to give the appearance they're doing something.

Droplets cannot be inhaled so masks do nothing with that type of transmission.

Washing your hands is probably good you don't know how many people scratch their arse before handling trolleys etc.

I told Bobby over a year ago poorly ventilated indoor places are the worst places to be with this virus. If you're paranoid about shopping go first thing in the morning. One thing Gladys did right was pensioner hour when shops opened in the morning.

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #343 - Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:36am

Dnarever wrote on Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:12am:

Carl D wrote on Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:00am:

Quote:

The World Health Organisation (WHO), in their 2019 review of non-drug interventions to manage a pandemic, did not recommend face masks for healthy people. As recently as December 2020, in a WHO document titled ‘Mask use in the context of COVID-19’, it is stated that, ‘There is only limited and inconsistent scientific evidence to support the effectiveness of masking healthy people in the community’. Given these statements it is unclear as to why the WHO changed their advice in the summer of 2020, although according to a Newsnight report it may have been in response to political lobbying.

Was that from when we were still all being told COVID-19 wasn't airborne (like smoke) and it was mostly spread by droplets that travelled no more than 1.5 metres (hence the pointless "Please keep a 1.5 metre distance from others" signs stuck all over the floor in places like supermarket checkouts (some of which are still there as I've noticed when I'm shopping).

Oh, and when we were told COVID-19 was also spread by touching infected surfaces hence the hand sanitiser everywhere (still see a lot of that in shop entrances too).

Scares the heck out of me when I go to Belmont Forum and see vulnerable elderly people not wearing a mask but they're still diligently sanitising their hands and shopping trolly handles before going into the supermarkets (and a lot of these people leave their discarded sanitising wipes in the trolleys after they've done with them from what I see). Roll Eyes

Quote:

it was mostly spread by droplets that travelled no more than 1.5 metres

Yes it was mostly spread this way, there was also some aerosol transmission. Distancing did help and it was known that none of the protective strategies were 100% but they were all much better than nothing.

Go back in this thread and read white house press release where they say aerosol transmission accounts for the vast majority of cases.

Biden was POTUS then so you can't use your TDS saying it came from Trump.

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ShellShilo

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Re: Mask mandates didn't do anything
Reply #344 - Nov 13^th, 2022 at 11:03am

Dnarever wrote on Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:12am:

Carl D wrote on Nov 13^th, 2022 at 10:00am:

Quote:

The World Health Organisation (WHO), in their 2019 review of non-drug interventions to manage a pandemic, did not recommend face masks for healthy people. As recently as December 2020, in a WHO document titled ‘Mask use in the context of COVID-19’, it is stated that, ‘There is only limited and inconsistent scientific evidence to support the effectiveness of masking healthy people in the community’. Given these statements it is unclear as to why the WHO changed their advice in the summer of 2020, although according to a Newsnight report it may have been in response to political lobbying.

Was that from when we were still all being told COVID-19 wasn't airborne (like smoke) and it was mostly spread by droplets that travelled no more than 1.5 metres (hence the pointless "Please keep a 1.5 metre distance from others" signs stuck all over the floor in places like supermarket checkouts (some of which are still there as I've noticed when I'm shopping).

Oh, and when we were told COVID-19 was also spread by touching infected surfaces hence the hand sanitiser everywhere (still see a lot of that in shop entrances too).

Scares the heck out of me when I go to Belmont Forum and see vulnerable elderly people not wearing a mask but they're still diligently sanitising their hands and shopping trolly handles before going into the supermarkets (and a lot of these people leave their discarded sanitising wipes in the trolleys after they've done with them from what I see). Roll Eyes

Quote:

it was mostly spread by droplets that travelled no more than 1.5 metres

Yes it was mostly spread this way, there was also some aerosol transmission. Distancing did help and it was known that none of the protective strategies were 100% but they were all much better than nothing.

Nothing in nature is 100% or absolute. This should be a given, NOT a cop-out. How much better than nothing were the results of these protocols? It certainly didn't stop(or slow down) the infections, transmission, hospitalizations, or the deaths from this virus.

Red flags should have been seen, when anyone suggests that they can get 26M Australians to keep 2 meters apart indefinitely. Or, to suggest that wearing a paper/cloth mask, will protect them from a virus smaller than the visible spectrum of light. Or, to hold people's job to ransom, to force them to get jabbed, to mimic a disease they don't have. And, finally, to require people to have Covid ID passport/cards, and locator apps. All red flags.

I can't believe that these were the best solutions that intelligent adults could come up with. These protocols have the mindset of a child.

As I've said before, if you tell people enough times that s**t is the best source for natural proteins, I guarantee that it will soon be on the menu in many Australian homes. There are still people who believe in Thor, and a flat earth.

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