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Poll closed Poll
Question: Do you want royalty banished from our political system?
*** This poll has now closed ***


Yes    
  15 (48.4%)
No    
  16 (51.6%)




Total votes: 31
« Created by: Bobby. on: Sep 11th, 2022 at 5:03pm »

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Time for a republic. (Read 7916 times)
MeisterEckhart
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #240 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:57am
 
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:56am:
We want the President with real balls...

No, we don't. A standoff between HOS and HOG is the last thing any nation needs.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #241 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:58am
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:57am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:52am:
Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:50am:
Quote:
'Updating' to a republic to 'go with the times' is like corporate re-branding. Unworthy of a confident, mature country.
Today is made of yesterday, every country IS its history. Restarting history is folly. Australia is a constitutional monarchy.


Frank every country is its history AND present. Together these function symbiotically and synergistically to propel a country into the future.

I feel that you're treating this issue like a type of divorce. It's not.


Can you name a country that does not distinguish between HOG and HOS?


How is that question even relevant to Australia?

What model are you basing your belief on that we do not need a HOS in Australia?
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Lisa Jones
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #242 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 11:04am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:56am:
Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:55am:
Frank wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:50am:
Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:43am:
chimera wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 7:20am:
We don't get a car licence on our merits of community service and football skills. It's a system where anyone can be licensed according to set rules (but can't drive if they fail the rules). Corruption is possible but rare.

The Constitution has a smart system where the GG is out of politics, well paid and shuts up. Same with UK, it's worked since being developed since the 1600s.


Now you know why we're all asking these 2 questions:

1. Do we need a GG?

2. Do we need a Head of State?


Because the State and the Government are two different things.



Yes I know.

GG - Executive
Government - Legislative
Courts - Juducial

Doctrine of Separation of Powers yadda yadda yadda.

I'm still asking the question : do we STILL need a GG at all given he gets paid to shut up?

The HOS is required to be impartial - above the politics of the day.


So the HOS gets paid a sh1t load of money to shut up and be impartial.

Again I ask : WHY does Australia need a Head Of State?

Also are you a baby boomer by any chance? And do you have an Anglo Celtic Saxon heritage?
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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)
 
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Lisa Jones
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #243 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 11:05am
 
Flip
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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)
 
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Lisa Jones
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #244 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 11:05am
 
Flip
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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)
 
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Lisa Jones
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #245 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 11:07am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:58am:
Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:57am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:52am:
Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:50am:
Quote:
'Updating' to a republic to 'go with the times' is like corporate re-branding. Unworthy of a confident, mature country.
Today is made of yesterday, every country IS its history. Restarting history is folly. Australia is a constitutional monarchy.


Frank every country is its history AND present. Together these function symbiotically and synergistically to propel a country into the future.

I feel that you're treating this issue like a type of divorce. It's not.


Can you name a country that does not distinguish between HOG and HOS?


How is that question even relevant to Australia?

What model are you basing your belief on that we do not need a HOS in Australia?


I'll answer that. Later.

Meantime how about you start answering my questions.

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)
 
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chimera
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #246 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 11:09am
 


'Again I ask : WHY does Australia need a Head Of State?'
That suggests you are unable to learn.
Think basketball, you know, skinny beanpoles squealing and hoicking a ball up high and down again, giggle scream.
They have a referree. re f err ee. with a shiny whistle.
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #247 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 11:12am
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 11:04am:
So the HOS gets paid a sh1t load of money to shut up and be impartial.

Again I ask : WHY does Australia need a Head Of State?

Also are you a baby boomer by any chance? And do you have an Anglo Celtic Saxon heritage?

Why does Australia need a Head Of State? To defend the constitution against those in government who would usurp it.

I am Gen-X (apparently). I have a Celtic heritage in two of its permutations - far-western European culture and central European culture.
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Marla
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #248 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 11:32am
 
There it is again. That pseudo-intellectual dog yapping away
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I know progress has no patience but something's got to give
 
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #249 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 11:42am
 
Marla wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 11:32am:
There it is again. That pseudo-intellectual dog yapping away

Ah, the white trash yank, comes-to at sundown and pops her first adderall.
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greggerypeccary
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #250 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 12:02pm
 
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:56am:
We want the President with real balls...


I wish people would stop using the term 'President'.

All we need to do is ditch the monarchy and rename the GG 'Head of State'.

Or keep the name Governor General, whatever.

But we don't have to use the term 'President' - that just confuses people.

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Dnarever
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #251 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 12:39pm
 
aquascoot wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 5:23am:
Dnarever wrote on Sep 13th, 2022 at 10:08pm:
Bobby. wrote on Sep 11th, 2022 at 6:46pm:
Dnarever wrote on Sep 11th, 2022 at 6:40pm:
Bobby. wrote on Sep 11th, 2022 at 12:32pm:
To keep the royals is the same as saying that there's something wrong with us
that we can't cope without an anachronistic, outdated system from
1000 years ago that has privilege by birth and not merit as the core of its belief.
It's saying that we're too stupid to elect our own representatives
and govern ourselves.

It's time to become a republic.
Now - who would we have as the equivalent of our Governor General?
How would we decide?
Would we vote as the Americans do for their president?

We wouldn't accept just any wording for a new constitution.
The problem would be to elect someone honest enough
to be our governor general.
I don't like the idea as per now of the Prime Minister deciding for us -
and then both of them having the power to sack each other.

We had an example of an outrageous abuse of power that
Scott Morrison was made a minister of 5 portfolios
in such secrecy that not even his own ministers knew -
let alone the public.
That must have been because the Governor General
was in fear of losing his job if he didn't agree?
That is something you'd expect to find in a
banana republic or a 3rd world country.
It's totally unacceptable.


Quote:
To keep the royals is the same as saying that there's something wrong with us


I see this as the worst reason available but the one that everyone rolls out without anything reasoned to support it.

For a start I would say that the exact opposite is true.

I don't see us as a small snivelling people frightened by our own shadow crying about perceptions that nobody really believes or cares about.




So you believe in privilege by birth not merit?


Merit is the system with the least merit. Mostly merit is translated to someone I like better. A correct identification on merit is extremely rare and in many cases non existent.


certainly in many chode professions, this is true.
academia, the public service, social work, the disability sector, aged care, teaching, robotic jobs working for a boss....its almost impossible to sort out merit.

in the trades, mechanics, electricians, plant operators, fencers, accountants, neurosurgeons, dentists, cattle raising, cropping, SAS pre selection, sports

in these areas, you can establish a reputation,
the market can judge you
you open yourself up to the criticiasm of the market
you rise or fail according to your merit.

comservative professions, athletic prowess, business ...these areas allow the superior man to shine.

the inferior man will become a cog in the mattrix for the very reason that he does not have grit guts and self beleif.

if you are a chode, the idea of working a lame ass job and then whining about trump and hating on successful sportsmen and business people has appeal.
it stops you reflecting on your own cowardice and laziness


So in short you are saying that Merit would not be a meaningful metric to help chose a President.

A little of what you said I would partially agree with.

I give an example: Sports is an obvious positive where the cream rises to the top but it is still potentially corrupt and strongly influenced by personal preference and friendships.

Look at selections for the NSW State of Origin team over the decades. There has been a consistent bais towards certain players from certain clubs. Not so much with the current administration over last few years but still a thumb on the scales.

Quote:
you open yourself up to the criticiasm of the market


Mr 20% below average electrician puts an add in the paper and will get more customers then he / she can handle as will Mr 90% above average accountant.

For most of these guys any perception of Merit is almost meaningless to their outcomes and just as likely unknown. As long as the job is done properly there is no assignment or differentiation based on merit at all in most cases.
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Dnarever
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #252 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 12:41pm
 
greggerypeccary wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 12:02pm:
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:56am:
We want the President with real balls...


I wish people would stop using the term 'President'.

All we need to do is ditch the monarchy and rename the GG 'Head of State'.

Or keep the name Governor General, whatever.

But we don't have to use the term 'President' - that just confuses people.



I like your view on not using the word President but the reality is that is most likely or almost certain to be the result no matter how much we would prefer different.
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Bobby.
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #253 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 12:41pm
 
Frank wrote on Sep 13th, 2022 at 10:27pm:
Bobby. wrote on Sep 13th, 2022 at 7:43pm:
Frank wrote on Sep 13th, 2022 at 7:20pm:
Bobby. wrote on Sep 13th, 2022 at 6:53pm:
freediver wrote on Sep 13th, 2022 at 6:10pm:
Bobby. wrote on Sep 13th, 2022 at 11:04am:
But FD said  "no-one is falling for it"


Half the country wants to stick with the current system.
The other half doesn't like any of the proposed alternatives.



Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is
no basis for a system of government.
Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses,
not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.




That is soo stupid, Bobby, that I am guessing you are knowingly unserious.




Monty Python had a way of getting to the truth with satirical comedy.


Don't be stupid. The HOS is not a 'system of government'.  The whole point is to have someone apolitical ABOVE the government. Someone who is NOT elected just like the government but is there for everyone, not just those who voted for him.




How was the GG there for us when he was doing secret deals with ScoMo?
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Dnarever
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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #254 - Sep 14th, 2022 at 12:43pm
 
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Sep 14th, 2022 at 10:56am:
We want the President with real balls...



Yes the President would have to be male - naturally.

Maybe one day we will find our own Maggy Thatcher NO ?
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