Australian Politics Forum - Time for a republic.

chimera Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 10763 armidale Gender:	Re: Time for a republic. Reply #315 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 10:08am There must be an equation somewhere . C= ( t x LP/ c +b) [$p^3 x H ^n-fZ (O x S ^P-S, vBP)].
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Dnarever

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #316 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 11:53am

chimera wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 8:14am:

'In the U.S. government, checks and balances refers to the separation of power in the government, which is ensured through the establishment of three different branches: the executive branch, the judicial branch, and the legislative branch'.

It was not illegal for Scomo to have other ministries but it would be if he appointed Bobby as Minister for Royals. And Scomo was elected so republic-style by itself won't prevent rorts. But an independent head can check on dodgy deals and use law to keep the gents honest.

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separation of power in the government, which is ensured through the establishment of three different branches: the executive branch, the judicial branch, and the legislative branch'.

We have just seen how a criminal President can completely side step any accountability when they appoint a compliant AG and his party can block accountability in the legislative branch as we seen with Trump / Barr and the dishonest republican senate.

The us system is dependant on a level of integrity that no longer exists - its broken.

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chimera

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #317 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 2:24pm

Now they think the judge appointed by Trump is blocking the FBI from checking the Trump secret files. And that is said to be damaging the US national security about nuclear intelligence. So now the executive DOJ is against the judicial branch. There must be effects within the military. Probably it will be copied here as with all Yank culture.

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Dnarever

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #318 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 2:41pm

AiA wrote on Sep 14^th, 2022 at 10:01pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 14^th, 2022 at 8:45pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Sep 14^th, 2022 at 8:35pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 14^th, 2022 at 8:30pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Sep 14^th, 2022 at 8:27pm:

Exactly.

They appear to be on the same page as me.

Remove monarch, Governor General becomes Head of State, and the term 'Governor General' is replaced with 'Head of State'.

Makes perfect sense.

We don't want a "President".

The USA, France and many other countries have presidents -
it obviously works.

Of course it (the position) works - it's just a name though.

A bunch of random symbols linked together.

But Australians are pretty stupid - when they see those randoms symbols linked together - President - they think of the USA and Trump/Biden/Clinton/Nixon/et al.

They think our republic will be the same as the US republic.

It won't.

As such, we should not use that term.

Just use 'Head of State'.

Did you ever watch the TV series " Alistair Cook's America "?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alistair_Cooke%27s_America

He explained that the founding fathers of America chose a political system
based on the best systems from around the world but mostly Europe.
Notice they didn't include Kings and Queens or any monarchy?

True, but the system they designed is now revealing its flaws. Would a monarchy unify America? We will never know.

Worth noting that they had just fought a war of independence against the British and that there was a reaction to that in their decision making. You could not say that their position was rational or balanced.

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Dnarever

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #319 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 2:44pm

chimera wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 2:24pm:

Now they think the judge appointed by Trump is blocking the FBI from checking the Trump secret files. And that is said to be damaging the US national security about nuclear intelligence. So now the executive DOJ is against the judicial branch. There must be effects within the military. Probably it will be copied here as with all Yank culture.

Quote:

Now they think the judge appointed by Trump is blocking the FBI from checking the Trump secret files.

They do not think that, it is the judges ruling it is a fact that the Judge did do that.

Quote:

So now the executive DOJ is against the judicial branch.

Appealing a poor decision to a higher court is normal practice, it is the method used to get poor decisions hopefully corrected.

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Bobby.

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #320 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 3:01pm

AiA wrote on Sep 14^th, 2022 at 10:01pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 14^th, 2022 at 8:45pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Sep 14^th, 2022 at 8:35pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 14^th, 2022 at 8:30pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Sep 14^th, 2022 at 8:27pm:

Exactly.

They appear to be on the same page as me.

Remove monarch, Governor General becomes Head of State, and the term 'Governor General' is replaced with 'Head of State'.

Makes perfect sense.

We don't want a "President".

The USA, France and many other countries have presidents -
it obviously works.

Of course it (the position) works - it's just a name though.

A bunch of random symbols linked together.

But Australians are pretty stupid - when they see those randoms symbols linked together - President - they think of the USA and Trump/Biden/Clinton/Nixon/et al.

They think our republic will be the same as the US republic.

It won't.

As such, we should not use that term.

Just use 'Head of State'.

Did you ever watch the TV series " Alistair Cook's America "?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alistair_Cooke%27s_America

He explained that the founding fathers of America chose a political system
based on the best systems from around the world but mostly Europe.
Notice they didn't include Kings and Queens or any monarchy?

True, but the system they designed is now revealing its flaws. Would a monarchy unify America? We will never know.

I doubt it -
the people of the USA would never accept an entitled Royal family.

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Bobby.

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #321 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 3:04pm

Dnarever wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 2:41pm:

Worth noting that they had just fought a war of independence against the British and that there was a reaction to that in their decision making. You could not say that their position was rational or balanced.

If the USA would have chosen a monarchy I suppose
it would have been one from Europe which
is the last thing they wanted.

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Bobby.

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #322 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 3:06pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 9:13am:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 9:06am:

chimera wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 8:14am:

'In the U.S. government, checks and balances refers to the separation of power in the government, which is ensured through the establishment of three different branches: the executive branch, the judicial branch, and the legislative branch'.

It was not illegal for Scomo to have other ministries but it would be if he appointed Bobby as Minister for Royals. And Scomo was elected so republic-style by itself won't prevent rorts. But an independent head can check on dodgy deals and use law to keep the gents honest.

Power does strange things to people.
I've seen examples in the workplace of managers
that would try to micro manage everything and become
a total nuisance to the point of delaying urgent jobs
over minor points when there were more
important things for them to worry about.
ScoMo obviously wanted to be involved in everything
and didn't trust his own team of ministers.

Power is like acid - there is almost nothing they cannot corrupt.

People seem to love power -
it makes them feel wonderful.
I think it's a mental illness -
that's what we're seeing with Putin right now.

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chimera

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #323 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 3:11pm

Dnarever,

Apparently the DOJ doesn't tell a judge what the deadline is. But they do now.
NYTimes.'On Thursday, the Justice Department shot back, telling Judge Cannon in yet another filing that the intelligence assessment and the criminal inquiry were “inextricably linked.” Prosecutors asked her to lift her ban on using the seized materials and requested she restrict the scope of the special master’s review to unclassified documents, excluding about 100 seized files bearing classification labels.

Moreover, prosecutors informed her that if she did not grant by Thursday their request to stay the portion of her ruling that is keeping investigators from working with the documents marked as classified, they would ask the Court of Appeals for the 11th Circuit, in Atlanta, to intervene and block it.'

That is aggro, not lawyer talk.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #324 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 4:24pm

chimera wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 3:11pm:

Dnarever,

Apparently the DOJ doesn't tell a judge what the deadline is. But they do now.
NYTimes.'On Thursday, the Justice Department shot back, telling Judge Cannon in yet another filing that the intelligence assessment and the criminal inquiry were “inextricably linked.” Prosecutors asked her to lift her ban on using the seized materials and requested she restrict the scope of the special master’s review to unclassified documents, excluding about 100 seized files bearing classification labels.

Moreover, prosecutors informed her that if she did not grant by Thursday their request to stay the portion of her ruling that is keeping investigators from working with the documents marked as classified, they would ask the Court of Appeals for the 11th Circuit, in Atlanta, to intervene and block it.'

That is aggro, not lawyer talk.

They're giving the idiot judge a chance to redeem herself before she makes a bigger twat of herself by having her ruling overturned, marking her as a quack judge. Either way, her career is marked.

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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 102284 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Time for a republic. Reply #325 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 4:29pm The royal family contains many fake people: The Princess Royal did not serve in the military herself, but like many royals she holds a number of military honours and titles and wears a military uniform when she wants to look important. https://inews.co.uk/news/princess-anne-was-military-royal-uniform-why-service-ex...
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Frank

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #326 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 4:30pm

Bobby. wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 3:04pm:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 2:41pm:

Worth noting that they had just fought a war of independence against the British and that there was a reaction to that in their decision making. You could not say that their position was rational or balanced.

If the USA would have chosen a monarchy I suppose
it would have been one from Europe which
is the last thing they wanted.

Both the American and French presidential system are pretty monarchical in the sense of political power. Far more powerful than our constitutional monarch who has zero political power.

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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
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Bobby.

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #327 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 4:35pm

Frank wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 4:30pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 3:04pm:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 15^th, 2022 at 2:41pm:

Worth noting that they had just fought a war of independence against the British and that there was a reaction to that in their decision making. You could not say that their position was rational or balanced.

If the USA would have chosen a monarchy I suppose
it would have been one from Europe which
is the last thing they wanted.

Both the American and French presidential system are pretty monarchical in the sense of political power. Far more powerful than our constitutional monarch who has zero political power.

Yes - the French President Francois Mitterrand authorised a murder plot:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinking_of_the_Rainbow_Warrior

In 2005, French newspaper Le Monde released a report from 1986 which said that Admiral Pierre Lacoste, head of DGSE at the time,
had "personally obtained approval to sink the ship from the late president François Mitterrand

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MeisterEckhart Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 11559 Gender:	Re: Time for a republic. Reply #328 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 4:39pm Well, Charles is sure shaping up as... a pissed-off Karen - "Every stinking time" God save the (new) Queen. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUWcyqOm8AY
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Frank

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Re: Time for a republic.
Reply #329 - Sep 15^th, 2022 at 4:39pm

What is an Australian? Born here? Not born here but has passport holder after 3 year residency? Speaks no English but has an Australian passport? 4th + generation Anglo? Part Aboriginal? Italian mother, Greek father? Temporary resident for 6 years? Overseas born to one Australian parent? What?

What IS an Australian for HOS purposes? The same people who denigrate nationalism in every other context are fervent nationalists when it come to the HOS. The same people who identify Australians as beer swilling racists are calling for "one of us' to be HOS.

Also
How to select a HOS if hereditary monarchy is to be replaced? How do you make the choice as non-political as what you want to replace? The biggest problem with the Americal model is that it combines the HOS and the head of government in the same person.

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Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
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Poll
Question: Do you want royalty banished from our political system?
* This poll has now closed *
Yes 15 (48.4%) No 16 (51.6%) Total votes: 31 « Created by: Bobby. on: Sep 11^th, 2022 at 5:03pm »