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Poll closed Poll
Question: Will the referendum be voted in?
*** This poll has now closed ***


No    
  42 (75.0%)
Yes    
  14 (25.0%)




Total votes: 56
« Last Modified by: Redmond Neck on: Feb 25th, 2023 at 11:17am »

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The Aboriginal Voice referendum (Read 91908 times)
Grappler Truth Teller Feller
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #630 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 1:17am
 
.
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #631 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 1:18am
 
[quote author=somers_trail link=1664785668/628#628 date=1674968961]Lidia Thorpe in the last few days is a good example of why we needn't dismiss phrenology out of hand.[/quote]

Re-consider eugenics?  I dunno...
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #632 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 5:53am
 
I was being Swiftian in the phrenology quip.

If Thorpeists try to make the Voice referendum about sovereignty – as they are doing at the moment – than the referendum will fail as many people Australians rightly contest that notion. Someone should also tell Lidia and ATSI people like her (I refuse to use her term “blak”) that collective guilt and ethnic guilt is for the Nazis.
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #633 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 7:24am
 
For the purposes of the "voice in parliament," how does the government intend to define and Aboriginal person?
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #634 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 7:48am
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Jan 29th, 2023 at 2:05pm:
Frank wrote on Jan 28th, 2023 at 1:54pm:
The paradox is that it is such a stupid and sinister idea that there will be immense damage to reconciliation whether it fails or succeeds.


Reconciliation of the two cultures is impossible.





Complete nonsense.

There has been a lot of open and honest soul searching by white Australia as well as great and genuine efforts at acknowledging and correcting past mistakes and sins.

Aboriginal Australia must also look at its own past, and not just in relation to white Australia, and acknowledge and corect its own savage and barbaric elements.

There cannot be a reconciliation if one side alone is all bad and the other all good because that is a lie and no reconciliation is possible on the foundationof lies, from either side.

Truth telling must include the truth about both Aboriginal and European cultures. Jacinda Price and others like her have stated that and are vilified for it.
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« Last Edit: Jan 30th, 2023 at 5:01pm by Frank »  

Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.
 
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #635 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 10:10am
 
I notice Bandt is attempting to blackmail Albo into kissing his ring over oil and gas. Can we forcibly send Bandt to Tehran?
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #636 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 10:33am
 
[quote author=somers_trail link=1664785668/632#632 date=1675022032]I was being Swiftian in the phrenology quip.

If Thorpeists try to make the Voice referendum about sovereignty – as they are doing at the moment – than the referendum will fail as many people Australians rightly contest that notion. Someone should also tell Lidia and ATSI people like her (I refuse to use her term “blak”) that collective guilt and ethnic guilt is for the Nazis.[/quote]


Good thinking.  Sent a question in for Q & A tonight... see if they'll bite.  People have tried on this "I am a sovereign person" thing while driving unregistered car etc - and ended up in a cell without bail.

There is/was no Aboriginal sovereignty - all are recognised equally as citizens under the constitution and that's the end to it.

Just remember that we don't all follow the same lines of 'study' etc - so references to some things may not be understood, which is no reflection on the person not understanding it.

I've studied terrorism and still have difficulty getting people to see the very real differences between Islam and Islamism, and between the Asian/Pacific Basin and the Asian/Pacific Region.  Just floats over their heads ....

Stoopid is as stoopid does, suh!  But simply not knowing something doesn't make a person stupid.... we need to look at all factors... it's kinda like gender/transgender theory - a person can listen to the Voices in their head telling them they're the Daughter of Sam and not his Son, but when those Voices are telling them the only Truth, there is a problem
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« Last Edit: Jan 30th, 2023 at 10:47am by Grappler Truth Teller Feller »  

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #637 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 10:35am
 
Somers Trail wrote on Jan 30th, 2023 at 10:10am:
I notice Bandt is attempting to blackmail Albo into kissing his ring over oil and gas. Can we forcibly send Bandt to Tehran?


all those who loathe Australia and its Day should be there telling the Tehran government to shove their national day and their cultures and their control over society and give everyone a separate Voice....


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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #638 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 1:17pm
 
we have to recognise that - as with Christianity and European culture - Islam and the toxic elements of the culture of most Islamic countries have become combined over time. One can no longer be reformed without reforming the other.
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #639 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 1:19pm
 
Anyway - now they want to 'recognise migrants'... say what?

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/jan/29/voice-to-parliament-no-ca...

"The no campaign in this year’s voice referendum will propose a symbolic constitutional recognition of both Indigenous people and migrants, instead of an Indigenous voice to parliament, Warren Mundine has revealed.

Mundine, a leading organiser of the no campaign, said it will run on a slogan of “recognise a better way”, proposing to insert an acknowledgment in the preamble of the constitution, via another referendum.

This approach was previously rejected by multiple rounds of consultation including the 2017 Uluru statement from the heart, which called for a voice to parliament.

With the yes campaign due to launch with a week of grassroots action from 20 February, the no campaign is gaining support from rightwing organisations Advance Australia and the Conservative Political Action Conference Australia for a campaign to launch in late February or early March.

On Sunday Mundine said he was bringing together opposition groups as head of Recognise a Better Way and the president of the Voice No Committee, of which former deputy prime minister John Anderson is also a member.

Mundine, a Yuin, Bundjalung and Gumbaynggirr man, was the national Labor president but quit the party in 2012, contesting the seat of Gilmore in 2019 for the Liberals.

In a sign the campaign will aim to pit culturally and linguistically diverse voters against the voice, Mundine said “we’re talking with the migrant community as well”.

“It’s about recognition of all the people who have come to Australia, who have been here first and how we built this great country of ours.”

Asked if this would include recognition of migrants in the constitution, Mundine said “migrants and refugees who have come here – recognise their story, about the circumstances of how they’ve come here and their contribution to Australia”.

“People have escaped from some horrific situations overseas, come to Australia and built an incredible life for themselves and their families.”


This raises questions of its own - such as how far back do we go.... essentially since 1788 we're all migrants.... including every drop of non-Abo blood in our homegrown Sallows ... so what is the point.  I understand the desire to capture the migrant vote by giving them some sort of recognition... but is that what this should be about?

Everyone is recognised in the constitution already....
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #640 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 1:26pm
 
If may be flippant, do they want us to put in something about Con the Fruiterer?

Mister Squiggle and his friends are alien immigrants as well.
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #641 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 1:36pm
 
Why not just give a Voice to the bloody lot and give away our elected Parliamentary system entirely... just let 'em yell it out ...
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #642 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 1:38pm
 
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Jan 30th, 2023 at 1:19pm:
Anyway - now they want to 'recognise migrants'... say what?

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/jan/29/voice-to-parliament-no-ca...

"The no campaign in this year’s voice referendum will propose a symbolic constitutional recognition of both Indigenous people and migrants, instead of an Indigenous voice to parliament, Warren Mundine has revealed.

Mundine, a leading organiser of the no campaign, said it will run on a slogan of “recognise a better way”, proposing to insert an acknowledgment in the preamble of the constitution, via another referendum.

This approach was previously rejected by multiple rounds of consultation including the 2017 Uluru statement from the heart, which called for a voice to parliament.

With the yes campaign due to launch with a week of grassroots action from 20 February, the no campaign is gaining support from rightwing organisations Advance Australia and the Conservative Political Action Conference Australia for a campaign to launch in late February or early March.

On Sunday Mundine said he was bringing together opposition groups as head of Recognise a Better Way and the president of the Voice No Committee, of which former deputy prime minister John Anderson is also a member.

Mundine, a Yuin, Bundjalung and Gumbaynggirr man, was the national Labor president but quit the party in 2012, contesting the seat of Gilmore in 2019 for the Liberals.

In a sign the campaign will aim to pit culturally and linguistically diverse voters against the voice, Mundine said “we’re talking with the migrant community as well”.

“It’s about recognition of all the people who have come to Australia, who have been here first and how we built this great country of ours.”

Asked if this would include recognition of migrants in the constitution, Mundine said “migrants and refugees who have come here – recognise their story, about the circumstances of how they’ve come here and their contribution to Australia”.

“People have escaped from some horrific situations overseas, come to Australia and built an incredible life for themselves and their families.”


This raises questions of its own - such as how far back do we go.... essentially since 1788 we're all migrants.... including every drop of non-Abo blood in our homegrown Sallows ... so what is the point.  I understand the desire to capture the migrant vote by giving them some sort of recognition... but is that what this should be about?

Everyone is recognised in the constitution already....


Mundine is struggling for relevance.

I was initially opposed to 'the Voice' but I am now in favour.  I was pushed over the line by the likes of Mundine, the Nats, that dumb fuqqing half Abo tattooed wanker Senator Thorpe et al, and Dutton playing dumb (pretty easy for him I know.)

"But Aussie, they already have 11 voices in Parliament."

Sure, but those 11 are not there to represent Aboriginals specifically.

So...given this is just a token (as in, 'please at least put it in the Constitution that you will talk to us') but fact of the matter is....they can be totally ignored if that is what is wanted.

"But what about the Wogs, the Chinks etc etc."

Well, bugger them....they did not have this land taken from them like we took this land from the aboriginals.

We won they lost...but...do we have any 'charity' enough to at least acknowledge that in the Constitution?

I reckon so.
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #643 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 2:12pm
 
Frank wrote on Jan 30th, 2023 at 7:48am:
There cannot be a reconciliation if one side alone is all bad and the other all good because that is a lie and no reconciliation is possible on the foundationof lies, from either side.


That's what I said: it's impossible to reconcile a h-g culture to a modern money-based culture.

Quote:
Truth telling must include the truth about both Aboriginal and European cuktures. Jacinda Price and others like her have started ghat and are vilified for it.


Price certainly has said the nation - obviously via its government,  "must act to close the gap. " 
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Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #644 - Jan 30th, 2023 at 2:15pm
 
Somers Trail wrote on Jan 30th, 2023 at 10:10am:
I notice Bandt is attempting to blackmail Albo into kissing his ring over oil and gas. Can we forcibly send Bandt to Tehran?


How is Bandt blackmailing Albo over the voice? Both support a  Yes vote.
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