Australian Politics Forum - The Aboriginal Voice referendum

Karnal

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 95307
Gender: male

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #825 - Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 6:29pm

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 5:57pm:

The voice is dead - only a total fool would take that chance.

Quote:

The majority of Australians will support a constitutionally enshrined Voice to Parliament when a referendum is held on the issue later this year, a new poll has revealed.

The Newspoll, which was conducted for The Australian and released on the eve of parliament resuming, showed 56 per cent of voters were in favour of the change, with 37 per cent against the proposal.

https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/politics/newspoll-reveals-voice-to-par...

Quote:

With 65% of respondents supporting the change, survey suggests Peter Dutton’s soft no campaign is failing to shift sentiment.

The latest fortnightly survey of 1,000 respondents suggests a soft no campaign by the Liberal leader, Peter Dutton, unleashed over the summer break has, thus far, failed to shift voter sentiment, with 65% of respondents supporting the change, a two-point increase from the percentage recorded last December.

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/feb/07/guardian-essential-poll-m...

Quote:

A bit more detail than usual from Roy Morgan this week, plus a small-sample Ipsos poll suggesting Indigeous Australians are overwhelmingly on board with the voice to parliament.

Other than that, an Ipsos poll of 300 Indigenous Australians released by pro-Indigenous voice group Uluru Dialogue last week found 80% support for the proposal, including 57% who were very sure and 21% who were fairly sure, with only 10% opposed

https://www.pollbludger.net/2023/02/04/roy-morgan-and-ipsos-indigenous-voice-pol...

Back to top

IP Logged

Frank

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 44754
Gender: male

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #826 - Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 7:10pm

Karnal wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 6:29pm:

The latest fortnightly survey of 1,000 respondents suggests a soft no campaign by the Liberal leader, Peter Dutton, unleashed over the summer break
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/feb/07/guardian-essential-poll-m...

Who writes this shite? Oh - the Granuiad, of course.

Remember, wee paki, when Hill and Bill were dead certs?

Anyway, you can pledge your support here and donate and volunteer:
https://www.fairaustralia.com.au/pledge

The Voice to parliament makes zero sense as a means to recognise Aborigines OR to find out what they need.

Back to top

Estragon: I can’t go on like this.
Vladimir: That’s what you think.

IP Logged

Grappler Truth Teller Feller

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 83844
Proud pre-1850's NO Voter
Gender: male

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #827 - Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 11:14pm

Aboriginal voice referendum? We're still raking the hot ashes to try to find the Black Boxes....

Albo Crash Investigations...

It's a beautiful sunny day down at the international tennis in Melbourne, capital city of the state of Victoria in Australia.... the Prime Minister of Australia is relaxing while watching the tennis while high above in the clear untroubled skies of a southern summer... the Referendum Airlines Voiceliner makes its way steadily to Canberra. This is its final flight - once arrived at Canberra it will be mothballed and put into the Museum of Fancy Ideas Political and will become a permanent exhibition and attraction for any non-White Aboriginal person to visit in the hope of getting a fat gig in running it.....

On the flight deck all is working properly... instruments are all perfect and the Voiceliner is living up to its Hyperbole engine's reputation for reliability and an untroubled flight....... all engine instruments are running perfectly...... suddenly a loud noise is heard.... the Voiceliner veers suddenly to the left in an extreme bank then the pilots grapple with the controls... and the Voiceliner makes a huge swing to the right..........and begins to plummet to the ground..... the cockpit warning system can be heard in the background calling out... Pull.. UP... Pull... UP... Imminent Collision with Indigenous Neo-Fascism... PULL UP!!! ........ seconds later....

What has gone wrong suddenly out of the clear blue skies?

Back to top

« Last Edit: Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 11:19pm by Grappler Truth Teller Feller »

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

IP Logged

Boris Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3977 Gender:	Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum Reply #828 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:29am The Voice is an evil plot to destroy Australia
Back to top	IP Logged

Gnads

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 29297
Gender: male

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #829 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:37am

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 11:14am:

Gnads wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 7:38am:

thegreatdivide wrote on Feb 19^th, 2023 at 4:08pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Feb 19^th, 2023 at 2:24pm:

You need to get off that one horse - your saddle sores are making you stick to the saddle.... and you are interfering with the free flow of discussion ON the point....

Interfering? I think you'll find Voltaire would not accuse me of that....

Quote:

You go give the Abos your economic solutions and how they can participate in them willingly....

I worked because I had to, like most of us (unlike Mozart who had a direct line to the infinite all his life...and yet his widow couldn't afford to pay for his funeral....understand?)

Quote:

they'll line up as long as the free funding is there, they won't show up but will expect to be paid, idiots will pay them for that, then they'll dry up like the Todd River once the cash is gone, leaving behind not one trace of skill or motivation to improve their own community in the bush......

Participating - and being paid - for useful work is NOT "free funding".

And you need more than one generation to change a culture.

Quote:

Seventeen out of Nineteen initiatives to close gaps have failed in the last thrust..... gone backwards.... why do you imagine that is? Whartey got his knee on their necks in the streets of the Alice or something?

No: whartey is confusing real resources with money, and hence cancelling successful participatory schemes like the CDEP, because "it cost too much"... showing a complete lack of understanding of how money is created....

Quote:

Now watch the evasion, people ........ economic models... failed stuff long dead..... no change ....

No evasion: "it's the economy, stupid".

You don't believe it? That's a problem you must deal with.

And begin by learning the difference between real resources, and money: real resources (inc. labour) are finite, but not limited by money, which means the issue is resource allocation), NOT money which is created out of thin air.

But by all means carry on with your 'anti voice' crusade, if you think 'NO" will achieve something positive.

And what are the positives of a "Yes" vote?

Note I haven't edited your post but quoted the full thing & highlighted what I wanted to respond to?

A communication to the black community that the nation cares about closing the egregious gap (ie, the 3rd world poverty among blacks).

You don't send communiques through making amendments to the constitution based on race.

Any examples of 3rd world poverty have been created by those living in them.

They are already adequately represented across the board.

Back to top

"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

IP Logged

Gnads

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 29297
Gender: male

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #830 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:43am

Agnes. wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 1:17pm:

I think they ought to have the power to decide which ungrateful/insulting/asshole on internet forums ought to be exposed for who they really are rather than have the priviledge of hiding behind fake names that protect them from the horrible things they would never have the guts to say the face of a single black man in person- they should have the right to cancel assholes and ruin them forever!

A voice should have some power behind it !

Just like you ey?

And your answer a veiled threat

Aboriginals are already more than adequately represented in Parliament.

No additional voice to Parliament should be based on race or have any power exertable by non elected(by all Australian people) individuals.

Back to top

"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

IP Logged

Gnads

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 29297
Gender: male

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #831 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:47am

Karnal wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 4:06pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 3:26pm:

Here are Marcia Langton's own words:-

“If a decision is made without listening to the Voice it could be challenged in the High Court and potentially stopped from being implemented until the Voice has been heard. That's a possibility and why wouldn't we want that to be the case. If nothing that the Voice says is subject to the ordinary laws – in other words it's completely gutted and has no safe standing, if you like, then the government can ignore all of the Voice's decisions with impunity. And I think that's what Craven's aiming for, he's aiming for... you know.. a toothless tiger.”

Plenty of real meat there for discussion, children..... let's hear it by start of class tomorrow morning.

Oh?

Quote:

Marcia Langton warns of risk of ‘nasty, eugenicist’ debate about race ahead of voice referendum

“We have to take these matters seriously. This is too important to play nasty electoral politics about … it would be terribly unfortunate for all Australians if the debate sinks into a nasty, eugenicist, 19th century-style of debate about the superior race versus the inferior race.”

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2022/dec/05/indigenous-voice-to-parli...

What a load of BS.

No one is doing that.

Typical Langton - saying something controversial to distract from the issue....... you?

Back to top

"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

IP Logged

mothra

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 35268
Gender: female

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #832 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:51am

Gnads wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:47am:

Karnal wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 4:06pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 3:26pm:

Here are Marcia Langton's own words:-

“If a decision is made without listening to the Voice it could be challenged in the High Court and potentially stopped from being implemented until the Voice has been heard. That's a possibility and why wouldn't we want that to be the case. If nothing that the Voice says is subject to the ordinary laws – in other words it's completely gutted and has no safe standing, if you like, then the government can ignore all of the Voice's decisions with impunity. And I think that's what Craven's aiming for, he's aiming for... you know.. a toothless tiger.”

Plenty of real meat there for discussion, children..... let's hear it by start of class tomorrow morning.

Oh?

Quote:

Marcia Langton warns of risk of ‘nasty, eugenicist’ debate about race ahead of voice referendum

“We have to take these matters seriously. This is too important to play nasty electoral politics about … it would be terribly unfortunate for all Australians if the debate sinks into a nasty, eugenicist, 19th century-style of debate about the superior race versus the inferior race.”

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2022/dec/05/indigenous-voice-to-parli...

What a load of BS.

No one is doing that.

Typical Langton - saying something controversial to distract from the issue....... you?

No-one is doing that? Have you read these threads?

Literally, they are over-laden with people doing precisely that. You too, if i'm not mistaken. At least you've defended it.

No-one is doing that my arse.

Back to top

If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.

IP Logged

Grappler Truth Teller Feller

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 83844
Proud pre-1850's NO Voter
Gender: male

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #833 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:06am

Well - Langton has a point - if this voice proposal goes through, clearly it will be a eugenistic effort to remove Whitey from proper governance of the country and hand a heap of power to a whinging minority......

Lessee now - what were those exact words again? Oh, yeah.....

"If a decision is made without listening to the Voice it could be challenged in the High Court and potentially stopped from being implemented until the Voice has been heard. That's a possibility and why wouldn't we want that to be the case. If nothing that the Voice says is subject to the ordinary laws – in other words it's completely gutted and has no safe standing, if you like, then the government can ignore all of the Voice's decisions with impunity."

So Langton's view now is that unless everyone listens to the voice, and if government choose to ignore its advice - that will be the end of the Aboriginal race?

Clearly a hysterical and paranoid conclusion... the voice will fail anyway.... she's seen to that... **chortles** .... an 'advisory' body that must have the right to stop government when it chooses...... **chortles** ..... the race that stops a nation.... what a hoot!!!

This gets better by the day - you couldn't write this as comedy....

Back to top

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

IP Logged

Gnads

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 29297
Gender: male

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #834 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:08am

mothra wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:51am:

Gnads wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:47am:

Karnal wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 4:06pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 3:26pm:

Here are Marcia Langton's own words:-

“If a decision is made without listening to the Voice it could be challenged in the High Court and potentially stopped from being implemented until the Voice has been heard. That's a possibility and why wouldn't we want that to be the case. If nothing that the Voice says is subject to the ordinary laws – in other words it's completely gutted and has no safe standing, if you like, then the government can ignore all of the Voice's decisions with impunity. And I think that's what Craven's aiming for, he's aiming for... you know.. a toothless tiger.”

Plenty of real meat there for discussion, children..... let's hear it by start of class tomorrow morning.

Oh?

Quote:

Marcia Langton warns of risk of ‘nasty, eugenicist’ debate about race ahead of voice referendum

“We have to take these matters seriously. This is too important to play nasty electoral politics about … it would be terribly unfortunate for all Australians if the debate sinks into a nasty, eugenicist, 19th century-style of debate about the superior race versus the inferior race.”

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2022/dec/05/indigenous-voice-to-parli...

What a load of BS.

No one is doing that.

Typical Langton - saying something controversial to distract from the issue....... you?

No-one is doing that? Have you read these threads?

Literally, they are over-laden with people doing precisely that. You too, if i'm not mistaken. At least you've defended it.

No-one is doing that my arse.

Rubbish. What Langton said is also rubbish.

Playing the race card because people don't agree with this "voice" is weak as piss.... & I know you are.

Back to top

"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

IP Logged

mothra

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 35268
Gender: female

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #835 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:10am

Gnads wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:08am:

mothra wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:51am:

Gnads wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:47am:

Karnal wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 4:06pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 3:26pm:

Here are Marcia Langton's own words:-

“If a decision is made without listening to the Voice it could be challenged in the High Court and potentially stopped from being implemented until the Voice has been heard. That's a possibility and why wouldn't we want that to be the case. If nothing that the Voice says is subject to the ordinary laws – in other words it's completely gutted and has no safe standing, if you like, then the government can ignore all of the Voice's decisions with impunity. And I think that's what Craven's aiming for, he's aiming for... you know.. a toothless tiger.”

Plenty of real meat there for discussion, children..... let's hear it by start of class tomorrow morning.

Oh?

Quote:

Marcia Langton warns of risk of ‘nasty, eugenicist’ debate about race ahead of voice referendum

“We have to take these matters seriously. This is too important to play nasty electoral politics about … it would be terribly unfortunate for all Australians if the debate sinks into a nasty, eugenicist, 19th century-style of debate about the superior race versus the inferior race.”

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2022/dec/05/indigenous-voice-to-parli...

What a load of BS.

No one is doing that.

Typical Langton - saying something controversial to distract from the issue....... you?

No-one is doing that? Have you read these threads?

Literally, they are over-laden with people doing precisely that. You too, if i'm not mistaken. At least you've defended it.

No-one is doing that my arse.

Rubbish. What Langton said is also rubbish.

Playing the race card because people don't agree with this "voice" is weak as piss.... & I know you are.

While i concede you may understand more than Crappler (and don't get too puffed up over that, it's not hard), you're still completely oblivious.

There is no "race card" being played because people aren't being agreed with. And this "race card" is not any sort of veto.

Back to top

If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.

IP Logged

Grappler Truth Teller Feller Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 83844 Proud pre-1850's NO Voter Gender:	Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum Reply #836 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:11am Again I thank you for introducing me, with your radical ravings, to Sky News... at least we get a sort of balance of views.... https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/other/people-have-been-warning-about-consequences...
Back to top	“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.” ― John Adams IP Logged

Grappler Truth Teller Feller

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 83844
Proud pre-1850's NO Voter
Gender: male

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #837 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:15am

mothra wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:10am:

While i concede you may understand more than Crappler (and don't get too puffed up over that, it's not hard), you're still completely oblivious.

There is no "race card" being played because people aren't being agreed with. And this "race card" is not any sort of veto.

So Langton's hysterical comment on eugenics has no relevance? If the voice doesn't get up - and it won't - the Abos will be wiped out? Nothing to do with race though, eh?

I somehow doubt that... BTW I love it when you try to hate on me - you are such a child..... and your views are laughable.... Grin

I take it you have no points to make about Langton's faux pas there apart from just refusing to engage with it at all?

An advisory only body for 3% of the population at most that must have the right to stop government at its whim..... what a hoot!!!

Back to top

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

IP Logged

Gnads

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 29297
Gender: male

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #838 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:16am

mothra wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:10am:

Gnads wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:08am:

mothra wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:51am:

Gnads wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 7:47am:

Karnal wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 4:06pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2023 at 3:26pm:

Here are Marcia Langton's own words:-

“If a decision is made without listening to the Voice it could be challenged in the High Court and potentially stopped from being implemented until the Voice has been heard. That's a possibility and why wouldn't we want that to be the case. If nothing that the Voice says is subject to the ordinary laws – in other words it's completely gutted and has no safe standing, if you like, then the government can ignore all of the Voice's decisions with impunity. And I think that's what Craven's aiming for, he's aiming for... you know.. a toothless tiger.”

Plenty of real meat there for discussion, children..... let's hear it by start of class tomorrow morning.

Oh?

Quote:

Marcia Langton warns of risk of ‘nasty, eugenicist’ debate about race ahead of voice referendum

“We have to take these matters seriously. This is too important to play nasty electoral politics about … it would be terribly unfortunate for all Australians if the debate sinks into a nasty, eugenicist, 19th century-style of debate about the superior race versus the inferior race.”

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2022/dec/05/indigenous-voice-to-parli...

What a load of BS.

No one is doing that.

Typical Langton - saying something controversial to distract from the issue....... you?

No-one is doing that? Have you read these threads?

Literally, they are over-laden with people doing precisely that. You too, if i'm not mistaken. At least you've defended it.

No-one is doing that my arse.

Rubbish. What Langton said is also rubbish.

Playing the race card because people don't agree with this "voice" is weak as piss.... & I know you are.

While i concede you may understand more than Crappler (and don't get too puffed up over that, it's not hard), you're still completely oblivious.

There is no "race card" being played because people aren't being agreed with. And this "race card" is not any sort of veto.

Really? Langton bringing in statements warning of eugenics & the superior man vs the inferior man hypothesis into the voice debate is doing exactly that... playing the race card.

And when she openly states that the "Voice" should have power to access the High Court over matters the Govt may not want to entertain she's saying that it will have a form of veto.....

all at taxpayers expense.

Back to top

"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

IP Logged

mothra

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 35268
Gender: female

Re: The Aboriginal Voice referendum
Reply #839 - Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:17am

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:15am:

mothra wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2023 at 8:10am:

While i concede you may understand more than Crappler (and don't get too puffed up over that, it's not hard), you're still completely oblivious.

There is no "race card" being played because people aren't being agreed with. And this "race card" is not any sort of veto.

So Langton's hysterical comment on eugenics has no relevance? If the voice doesn't get up - and it won't - the Abos will be wiped out?

I somehow doubt that... BTW I love it when you try to hate on me - you are such a child..... and your views are laughable.... Grin

I take it you have no points to make about Langton's faux pas there apart from just refusing to engage with it at all?

An advisory only body for 3% of the population at most that must have the right to stop government at its whim..... what a hoot!!!

Again, you're in no position to be accusing anyone else of being hysterical.

Back to top

If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.

IP Logged

Poll
Question: Will the referendum be voted in?
* This poll has now closed *
No 42 (75.0%) Yes 14 (25.0%) Total votes: 56 « Last Modified by: Redmond Neck on: Feb 25^th, 2023 at 11:17am »