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Zionism (Read 26499 times)
tickleandrose
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Re: Zionism
Reply #120 - Dec 30th, 2022 at 9:24am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 9:21am:
tickleandrose wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 8:52am:
Briefly, yes.  I did a few injections for a couple of holocaust survivors in the nursing homes.  But... definitely not on friend basis. 

Did they discuss the Holocaust?

Workers in care homes who attended to Holocaust survivors reported how many of them regressed to the Nazi era and became terrified and/or suspicious of anyone who appeared to be in uniform. Some tended to hide food under their mattress or other places.

And definitely don't risk speaking to them in German, even if they appear to have a German accent.



I have only visit them briefly for a couple of injections.  No in depth conversation beyond, hi, how are you, how are you feeling etc.   Most of the history are provided by the nursing home staffs.
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Redmond Neck
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Re: Zionism
Reply #121 - Dec 30th, 2022 at 9:28am
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 8:54am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 6:33am:
Redmond Neck wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 6:29am:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 6:26am:
Redmond Neck wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 6:12am:
I always think the saying

"Their NAZI masters taught them well!"

is very appropriate in regards to the Israeli jews and their treatment of the Palestinians!

Angry

You should try a new think.

All European nations for the last 2000 years have had periods of pogroms, mass murders, mass expulsions and extreme prejudice towards Jews.

Incited largely by Papal edicts and, later, by protestant reformers (like Martin Luther, no less), Christo-Europeans have spent millennia on and off indulging in orgies of murder sprees against Jews.

The Nazis were only the last in a very long line of Christo-western peoples that stretches back to the days of the Roman Empire who have dealt to Jewish people.



Irrespective of who taught them they are assholes in regards to their treatment of the Palestinians.

So jam that up your clacker jew lover!

Jew lover, eh! Your Papal and protestant reformers have fried you well.


RedBack is clearly a very sincere Jew hater. 😞🥺


Nonsense!! 

I just believe in calling a spade a spade as the saying goes!

Angry
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« Last Edit: Dec 30th, 2022 at 9:54am by Redmond Neck »  

BAN ALL THESE ABO SITES RECOGNITIONS.

ALL AUSTRALIA IS FOR ALL AUSTRALIANS!
 
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Zionism
Reply #122 - Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:02am
 
Redmond Neck wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 9:28am:
Quote:
RedBack is clearly a very sincere Jew hater. 😞🥺


Nonsense!! 

I just believe in calling a spade a spade as the saying goes!

Common with white trash. Xenophobia is so bone-deep, they can't recognise it - like, a fish doesn't know what water is, as the saying goes.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Zionism
Reply #123 - Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:44am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Dec 29th, 2022 at 4:51pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Dec 29th, 2022 at 4:00pm:
MeisterEckhart wrote on Dec 29th, 2022 at 12:56pm:
The only city in Palestine that was of great interest and concern to Arabs was Jerusalem.

The rest of Palestine was left as a wasteland.

“The further we went the hotter the sun got, and the more rocky and bare, repulsive and dreary the landscape became…There was hardly a tree or a shrub anywhere. Even the olive and the cactus, those fast friends of a worthless soil, had almost deserted the country”. Mark Twain - noting the desolation of Palestine during his visit there in 1867.


Yes, well of course deserts tend to appear desolate to a jaded traveller, ditto for Egypt beyond Cairo. etc.

The fact that immigrant Jews in possession of European technologies were able to "make the desert bloom" in the 20th century is another matter. 

You're assuming Twain never saw a desert in the US, to be shocked by one in the middle east. Twain was referring to the holy land outside of Jerusalem being a wasteland inhabited by almost no one.

Twain was comparing descriptions of Judea and Galilee, as written by the likes of Josephus, to what he saw on his visit.



We don't know that Twain was referring to the same regions of the Levant that Josephus was.

Certainly the Dead Sea scrolls were discovered in caves in a desert...and half a millennium later the mighty city of Rome itself was reduced to a poverty-stricken village of 10,000 people, so comparisons/conclusions re the prosperity of a region at different times are fraught. 


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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Zionism
Reply #124 - Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:57am
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:44am:
We don't know that Twain was referring to the same regions of the Levant that Josephus was.


Yeah, we do. Josephus was writing about Judea and Gallilee, which is what Twain was writing about.

Twain also noted 'Palestine is desolate and unlovely'.
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Re: Zionism
Reply #125 - Dec 30th, 2022 at 11:05am
 
wombatwoody wrote on Dec 29th, 2022 at 11:07pm:
* It's not even a democracy for Jews.

Uri Avnery:  Unlike modern Christianity, but very much like Islam, the Jewish religion is not just a matter between Man and God, but also a matter between Man and Man. It does not live in a quiet corner of public life. Religious law encompasses all aspects of public and private life. Therefore, for a pious Jew – or Muslim – the European idea of separation between state and religion is anathema.  The Jewish Halakha, like the Islamic Shari’a, regulates every single aspect of life. Whenever Jewish law clashes with Israeli law, which one should prevail? Religious fanatics in Israel insist that religious law stands above the secular law (as in several Arab counties), and that the state courts have no jurisdiction over the clerics in matters that concern religion (as in Iran). When the Supreme Court ruled otherwise, a most respected Orthodox rabbi easily mobilized a hundred thousand protesters in Jerusalem. The entire religious community, with all its diverse factions, now belongs to the rightist, ultra-nationalist camp. Transforming Israel into a Halakha state means castrating the democratic system and turning Israel into a second Iran governed by Jewish ayatollahs. - Uri Avnery, The Jewish Ayatollahs



Hence the world wide alarm re the election of extreme  Zionists and religious orthodox Jews in the new Netanyahu govt.


Quote:
Justice Minister Yaakov Neeman ... wants Torah law, or in other words, he wants Israel to be a country governed by Jewish religious law, halakha. In any event, Israel is already a semi-theocracy. The Israelis who were frightened by the minister's remarks and who love viewing their country as liberal, Western and secular are forgetting that our life here is more religious, traditional and halakhic than we are prepared to admit... Let's admit that we live in a country with many religious and halakhic attributes. Let's remove the concocted secularist guise with which we have wrapped ourselves. Shocked by Neeman's remarks? They are not so far removed from the reality of our lives. Israel is not what you thought. It's definitely not what we try to present to ourselves and the rest of the world.

https://www.haaretz.com/2009-12-10/ty-article/gideon-levy-lets-face-the-facts-is...


Israel is slowly but inexorably turning into a conservative theocracy ... Israel is no democracy... it has become less and less democratic with regard to the rights of its Jewish population.... Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman attacked groups that seek to uphold civil liberties in Israel, for Jews as well as for Arabs, as “collaborators in terror.”

https://forward.com/opinion/147521/israel-turning-into-theocracy/


One of the major successes of Israeli theopolitics has been the institutionalization of the Orthodox rabbinate within the state. The Orthodox rabbinate in Israel has been established as a monopoly—neither Reform nor Conservative rabbinic ordinations are recognized—and it is, in part, supported by the state. This monopoly and state support, in conjunction with the coercive tactics of the religious parties in the Knesset, has given the Orthodox rabbinate a good deal of power. It uses this power to further the observance of Orthodox norms, often violating the civil rights of the nonobservant Israeli.

- Norman L. Zucker, The Establishment of the Orthodox Rabbinate


Quote:
What exactly do you think they are being deprived of?


Already told you, see above re the Bedouin and the many discriminatory laws.

And:


The Archbishop of New York announces that any Catholic who rents out an apartment to a Jew commits a mortal sin and runs the risk of excommunication.

A protestant priest in Berlin decrees that a Christian who employs a Jew will be banished from his parish.

Impossible? Indeed. Except in Israel – in reverse, of course.

The rabbi of Safed, a government employee, has decreed that it is strictly forbidden to let apartments to Arabs, including the Arab students at the local medical school. Twenty other town rabbis, whose salaries are paid by the taxpayers, mostly secular, including Arab citizens, have publicly supported this edict.

The same goes for another group of rabbis, who prohibited employing Goyim.

(In ancient Hebrew, “Goy” just meant a people, any people. In the Bible, the Israelites were called a “holy Goy”. But in the last centuries, the term has come to mean non-Jews, with a decidedly derogatory undertone.)

- Uri Avnery, The Jewish Ayatollahs


....The ugly side of the Jewish "democracy" aka Israel.
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wombatwoody
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Re: Zionism
Reply #126 - Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:39pm
 
freediver wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 9:11am:
wombatwoody wrote on Dec 29th, 2022 at 11:07pm:
freediver wrote on Dec 26th, 2022 at 7:55am:
I just realise that you have failed


Sorry old boy, you're the failure. You fail to understand that Israel cannot be a democracy for all its citizens. It can be a democracy* for Jews only.


Let's start with what you think it is. You still have not offered any kind of explanation.


What a laughable attempt at saving face.
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We are benefiting from ... the attack on the Twin Towers and Pentagon, and the American struggle in Iraq.

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wombatwoody
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Re: Zionism
Reply #127 - Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:51pm
 
freediver wrote on Dec 28th, 2022 at 8:37am:
The Muslims cannot tolerate a "Jewish" state on "Muslim" land


They lived in peace until racist Zionism appeared on the scene.

Quote:
even if Muslims there have more rights and freedoms than in any of the other middle eastern countries.


Then one would think they would be clamoring to move to Israel to enjoy all those 'rights and freedoms' but is that what we see?


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We are benefiting from ... the attack on the Twin Towers and Pentagon, and the American struggle in Iraq.

Benjamin Netanyahu, quoted in Ma’ariv, 16 April 2008
 
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freediver
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Re: Zionism
Reply #128 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 5:43am
 
wombatwoody wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:51pm:
freediver wrote on Dec 28th, 2022 at 8:37am:
The Muslims cannot tolerate a "Jewish" state on "Muslim" land


They lived in peace until racist Zionism appeared on the scene.

Quote:
even if Muslims there have more rights and freedoms than in any of the other middle eastern countries.


Then one would think they would be clamoring to move to Israel to enjoy all those 'rights and freedoms' but is that what we see?




Muslims will live in peace so long as they get to impose Islamic law on the Jews and be in charge. They like to take their time wiping them out. How many Jews do you think live in the middle east outside of Israel under this "peace" you talk about?

And newsflash: they are literally queueing at the border gates to get into Israel. They have no problem being hypocrites about it. If they managed to wipe out Israel, the local Muslims would probably end up suffering more, like they do everywhere else. It's what Islam is all about.

wombatwoody wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:39pm:
freediver wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 9:11am:
wombatwoody wrote on Dec 29th, 2022 at 11:07pm:
freediver wrote on Dec 26th, 2022 at 7:55am:
I just realise that you have failed


Sorry old boy, you're the failure. You fail to understand that Israel cannot be a democracy for all its citizens. It can be a democracy* for Jews only.


Let's start with what you think it is. You still have not offered any kind of explanation.


What a laughable attempt at saving face.


It's a simple question woody. WTF are you ranting about? What is it that Israel deprives it's Muslim Arab citizens of that makes you think it is not a democracy?
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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Zionism
Reply #129 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 6:44am
 
wombatwoody wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:51pm:
freediver wrote on Dec 28th, 2022 at 8:37am:
The Muslims cannot tolerate a "Jewish" state on "Muslim" land


They lived in peace until racist Zionism appeared on the scene.

Another example of a poster on a politics forum knowing little to nothing of the world.

Middle eastern peoples are mostly tribal - that in itself means they spend most of their lives scrapping it out with each other.

Then there's the Shia / Sunni divide, which has kept them busy at each other's throats for hundreds of years.

Then there's the issue of the Kurds.

Then there's the issue of Muslim sectarian minorities - the Zaydi of Yemen, the Alawites of Syria, the Turkic and Kurdish Alevites.

And, the big one, in terms of political and military clout, there are the Wahabis of Saudi Arabia.

And then Christian sects - the Copts of Egypt, the Maronites of Lebanon, the Syriacs of Syria.

On top of all that, there has been the claim over Jerusalem, where the western Catholics, the Eastern Orthodox and Muslims have slugged it out for hundreds of years.

By the time Jews arrived in massive numbers after WW2, Palestine (except for Jerusalem) was, for centuries, a wasteland neither of interest to Christians nor Muslims.

So, as far as internecine religious, political, societal and cultural sectarian conflict over hundreds of years is concerned, the middle east is the top contender for the gold standard.
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Re: Zionism
Reply #130 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 8:06am
 
Refugees and immigration: Good for Australia. Bad for Palestine.
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Re: Zionism
Reply #131 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 1:29pm
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:57am:
thegreatdivide wrote on Dec 30th, 2022 at 10:44am:
We don't know that Twain was referring to the same regions of the Levant that Josephus was.


Yeah, we do. Josephus was writing about Judea and Gallilee, which is what Twain was writing about.

Twain also noted 'Palestine is desolate and unlovely'.


And Rome was the greatest city on earth with a population of over a million people  for over 200 years, before 'devolving' into a poverty-stricken village of 10,000 people by 600AD.

And speaking of 'desolation', Josephus reported on Rome's complete destruction of Jerusalem in 78 AD.

But now with the 'democratic' election of Netanyahu's new coalition, Palestinians are again at the tender mercies of extreme nationalist/religious Zionist nut jobs,  while Biden is still bleating about a 2 state solution. 

We know what Netanyahu thinks of that.

Plenty of alarm among the Israeli Left, not to mention other world leaders; all courtesy of 'democracy'....which I see fraudiver still wants people to define...




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MeisterEckhart
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Re: Zionism
Reply #132 - Dec 31st, 2022 at 4:05pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Dec 31st, 2022 at 1:29pm:
But now with the 'democratic' election of Netanyahu's new coalition, Palestinians are again at the tender mercies of extreme nationalist/religious Zionist nut jobs,  while Biden is still bleating about a 2 state solution. 

We know what Netanyahu thinks of that.

Plenty of alarm among the Israeli Left, not to mention other world leaders; all courtesy of 'democracy'....which I see fraudiver still wants people to define...

Yes. Netanyahu is determined to land peace treaties with all middle eastern (particularly arab) states.

Luckily for him, the Arab states are nearly all onside with his plan.

As for the Palestinians, funny how the Arab states refuse to grant them citizenship - and King Abdullah of Jordan seems like a nice guy.
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Re: Zionism
Reply #133 - Jan 1st, 2023 at 3:06am
 
Well - if Ngunnawalya can claim ownership of lands lost two hundred years ago - what is the problem with people dispossessed 2000 years ago claiming the same right?

Free Ancestral Lands For Everyone!!!

I own half of Ireland, half of Scotland, a heap of Denmark, heap of Sweden, a vast swathe of Europe, chunks of England and Wales, vast areas of Australia ..... everywhere my ancestors walked over etc....

Where are MY land rights??

Oh - I forgot - with 10% European Jewish - where's my claim to the Holy Land etc?

Just making a point here..... sorry 'bout that ....
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Re: Zionism
Reply #134 - Jan 1st, 2023 at 3:12am
 
MeisterEckhart wrote on Dec 31st, 2022 at 4:05pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Dec 31st, 2022 at 1:29pm:
But now with the 'democratic' election of Netanyahu's new coalition, Palestinians are again at the tender mercies of extreme nationalist/religious Zionist nut jobs,  while Biden is still bleating about a 2 state solution. 

We know what Netanyahu thinks of that.

Plenty of alarm among the Israeli Left, not to mention other world leaders; all courtesy of 'democracy'....which I see fraudiver still wants people to define...

Yes. Netanyahu is determined to land peace treaties with all middle eastern (particularly arab) states.

Luckily for him, the Arab states are nearly all onside with his plan.

As for the Palestinians, funny how the Arab states refuse to grant them citizenship - and King Abdullah of Jordan seems like a nice guy.


You are so right - ONLY the Arab nations choose to make them outcasts.

Addendum:-  so ytF do you take arms against Israelis/Jews/and so forth?  Truly you are one very confused being.....
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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