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Can you quote me?

Do you actually disagree with what I say, or do you merely dislike the consequences of it being true? Israel is a beacon of freedom and democracy in one of the most backwards places on earth. While their neighbours are still throwing gays off buildings, Israel recognises gay marriages.

Are you attempting to disagree with what I say Wombat?

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Can you quote me?

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21% of Israel's population are (non-Jewish) Arabs.

freediver wrote on Mar 8^th, 2023 at 6:27pm:


You think repeating a lie often enough will make it true?

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 9^th, 2023 at 1:04pm:


The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine.  Ilan Pappe. Oneworld Publications, Oxford, 2006.

By Stephen Lendman
PalestineChronicle.com

Ilan Pappe is an Israeli historian and senior lecturer at Haifa University. He's also Academic Director of the Research Institute for Peace at Givat Haviva and Chair of the Emil Touma Institute for Palestinian Studies. Pappe is an expert on Israel and Zionism and the Palestinians' Right of Return to their homeland, is considered "an honourable academic with integrity and conscience," and is a member of the Advisory Board of the Council for Palestinian Restitution and Repatriation (CPRR), an organization declaring that "every Palestinian has a legitimate, individual right to return to his or her original home and to absolute restitution of his or her property."

Pappe is also one of Israel's "new historians" whose scholarship and writings are based on access to material now available from British Mandate period and Israeli archives that provide the most accurate and authentic documented history of Israel before and after it became a state and which now serve to debunk the myths about the years leading up to the Jewish State's founding and those following it to this day.

He proves from official records how the Israeli state came into being with blood on its hands from lands forcibly seized from its Palestinian inhabitants who'd lived on it for hundreds of years previously. Since the 1940s, they were ethnically cleansed and slaughtered without mercy so their homeland would become one for Jews alone.

The shameful result is that Palestinians then and today have almost no rights including being able to live in peace and security on their own land in their own state that no longer exists. Survivors then and their offspring either live in Israel as unwanted Arab citizens with few rights or in the Occupied Palestinians Territories (OPT) where their lives are suspended in limbo in an occupied country in which they're subjected to daily institutionalized and codified racism and persecution. They have no power over their daily lives and live in a constant state of fear with good reason. They face economic strangulation; collective punishment for any reason; loss of free movement; enclosures by separation walls, electric fences and border closings; regular curfews, roadblocks, checkpoints, loss of their homes by bulldozings and crops and orchards by wanton destruction and seizure; arrest without cause, and routine subjection to torture while in custody.

They're targeted for extra-judicial assassination and indiscriminate killing; taxed punitively and denied basic services essential to life and well-being including health care, education, employment and even enough food and water at the whim of Israeli authorities in a deliberate effort to destroy their will to resist and eliminate those who won't by expulsion or extermination. Palestinians have no power to end these appalling abuses and crimes against humanity or receive any redress for them in Israeli, the West or through the International Criminal Court Israel ignores when it rules against its interests.

Pappe calls the book his "J'Accuse against the politicians who devised the plan and the generals who carried out the ethnic cleansing" naming the guilty, the villages and urban areas destroyed, and the cruelest crimes committed against defenseless people only wanting to live in peace on their own land and were willing to do it with Jews as neighbors but not as overlords or oppressors.

This review is lengthy so readers will know in detail what Israeli authorities successfully suppressed for decades. Pappe courageously revealed it in a book begging to be read and discussed by all people of conscience and good faith. They need to take the lead building a groundswell consensus to stand up to this long-festering injustice against defenseless people fighting for their rights and existence against overwhelming odds.

Pappe provides them help with his extensive documentation and other suggested reading on the origins of Zionist ideology leading to the ethnic cleansing in the 1940s and thereafter. He particularly mentions two of Nur Masalha's important books - Expulsion of the Palestinians: The Concept of Transfer in Zionist Political Thought, 1882 - 1948 and The Politics of Denial: Israel and the Palestinian Refugee Problem. Readers are encouraged to explore this issue further with these and other books exposing ugly truths long suppressed in the West and needing to be freely aired.

It's kind of ironic that the Muslims drinking their own "evil Jew" coolaid lead to them fleeing their homes and loosing a place in the most liberal and democratic country the region had ever seen.

thegreatdivide wrote on Mar 9^th, 2023 at 9:37pm:


You were talking out your arse. Are you suggesting Israel kicked out almost the whole arab population, then they snuck back in?

wombatwoody wrote on Mar 9^th, 2023 at 11:04pm:


What lie? Are you trying to tell us that the Profit Muhammad was not fond of slaughtering Jews, or that he did not blame them just like you do now?

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I did not make the claim you attributed to me. You are lying again.

freediver wrote on Mar 10^th, 2023 at 7:28am:


You are revealing your ideological blindness: in 1947 Moslems outnumbered Jews in all of Palestine.

Extremist Jews started murdering people in the part of Palestine designated by the UN as the future Jewish state.

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....which is irrelevant to the terrorism conducted in Jewish designated Palestine by the Stern gang terrorists et al in 1947. No one said the entire Moslem population fled, dummy.

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Not so,  dummy (rather than fraudulent in this instance, now you are just being dumb) as explained above. 

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No, dummy; some Muslim villagers would have escaped the Jewish terror propagated by the likes of the Stern gang, and remained in their villages. 

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Wrong again, dummy. The Moslems never accepted the UN partition of Palestine, true; but the ascription of blame for the subsequent violence on both sides is best avoided by ideologues like you.

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You obviously think so.

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The first point is your rhetorical rant; yes, the prophet despised those whom he considered infidels, taking his example from the 'jealous' OT god (of Abraham) whom he considered to be 'the One True God"....

As for blame, see above. You are not equipped to ascertain blame for the violence and expulsion of Muslims from certain parts of Palestine in 1947.

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Murdering who? Why is it that over 20% of Israel's population is non-Jewish Arabs who now enjoy more rights and freedoms than in any of the Muslim majority countries in the region?

The Jews fought against any Muslims who took up arms against them. Those who wanted to stay in peace did so, and are now reaping the rewards. By and large, the biggest cause of Muslims fleeing into Palestine was Muslims drinking their own "evil Jew" coolaid. You even posted the evidence yourself, but somehow deluded yourself into thinking this evidence incriminated the Jews. It was basically a huge idiot filter for the state of Israel.