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Alice is finished. (Read 6862 times)
Brian Ross
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #150 - May 19th, 2023 at 1:22pm
 
Boris wrote on May 18th, 2023 at 10:36pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 18th, 2023 at 10:21pm:
Once more a Twit's use of Twitter, hey, Matty?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


So what are you saying?

It's all lies?

It is all true

But you just dismiss reality because it does not fit your narrative


It fits your narrative, you Racist Troll,  Matty. Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour.  Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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UnSubRocky
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #151 - May 19th, 2023 at 1:29pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 1:12pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on May 18th, 2023 at 6:37pm:
Have you any solutions for the public drunkenness or homelessness among indigenous Australians, Brian?


Can you advance any, beyond graps apartheid, expulsion or vigilante-violence policies?


Shut down all indigenous advancement programs, welfare benefits, indigenous race based scholarships, that non-indigenous are not receiving. Put indigenous people on the same level of rights and responsibilities that every other Australian is allowed. Convict indigenous offenders on the same rate as non-indigenous offenders. Ignore any further indigenous land claim applications.

When the 'playing field' of Australian society evenly matched, we should be able to see the indigenous themselves integrated fully in society. Then they will look to themselves to earn the respect of society by trying to gain employment, education, co-existing peacefully and not segregating themselves. And the treatment is based on a needs-by basis.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #152 - May 19th, 2023 at 1:41pm
 
UnSubRocky wrote on May 18th, 2023 at 8:28pm:
I dunno, Brian. I very much doubt being extremely drunk and relieving oneself in public is something that comes from what happened 100 years ago.


When individuals in a particular GROUP do it more than individuals in other groups do it, it might indeed have something to do with learned generational disadvantage resulting from past, misplaced  'protection' policies imposed by the authorities. 
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #153 - May 19th, 2023 at 1:54pm
 
UnSubRocky wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 1:29pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 1:12pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on May 18th, 2023 at 6:37pm:
Have you any solutions for the public drunkenness or homelessness among indigenous Australians, Brian?


Can you advance any, beyond graps apartheid, expulsion or vigilante-violence policies?


Shut down all indigenous advancement programs, welfare benefits, indigenous race based scholarships, that non-indigenous are not receiving. Put indigenous people on the same level of rights and responsibilities that every other Australian is allowed. Convict indigenous offenders on the same rate as non-indigenous offenders. Ignore any further indigenous land claim applications.


Ok, so you have established the fabled "equality" beloved of conservatives.

Yet that leaves us with the poverty experienced by the bottom 10% of all Australians, with blacks experiencing much higher rates of poverty.  Let's read on....

Quote:
When the 'playing field' of Australian society evenly matched, we should be able to see the indigenous themselves integrated fully in society.


You mean like the c.10% of non-blacks living in poverty in Oz? 

Quote:
Then they will look to themselves to earn the respect of society by trying to gain employment, education, co-existing peacefully and not segregating themselves.


"Trying to gain" doesn't mean actually gaining; and poverty is the outcome for those who can't gain employment.

Quote:
And the treatment is based on a needs-by basis.


meaning govt. will have to provide work, as employer of last resort, to eradicate poverty.
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UnSubRocky
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #154 - May 19th, 2023 at 1:54pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 1:41pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on May 18th, 2023 at 8:28pm:
I dunno, Brian. I very much doubt being extremely drunk and relieving oneself in public is something that comes from what happened 100 years ago.


When individuals in a particular GROUP do it more than individuals in other groups do it, it might indeed have something to do with learned generational disadvantage resulting from past, misplaced  'protection' policies imposed by the authorities. 


Rubbish. Plenty of people have had abusive, drunk, and/or poor parents in their lives. That does not mean that they are going to adopt the same traits. When you have a group of people of the similar background adopt an inconsequential lifestyle, it is usually the result of knowing that they have nothing for to be responsible. So, if they are going to get drunk, disorderly, and then piss themselves in public, the only consequence they will receive in a stay in a drunk tank, a feed the next day, and a trip home.

Coddling indigenous Australians over the last 50 years has resulted in a bunch of spoiled, irresponsible layabouts. If Australia treated indigenous Australians the same as the government did 100 years ago, you could bet that there would be no drunken, lazy indigenous people about, even though they (indigenous Australians) probably would have good reason to have some Dutch courage from time to time.
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Jasin
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #155 - May 19th, 2023 at 2:01pm
 
How do you kill an Australian?

Leave them alone and they'll do it themselves.
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AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY.
 
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UnSubRocky
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #156 - May 19th, 2023 at 2:04pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 1:54pm:
Yet that leaves us with the poverty experienced by the bottom 10% of all Australians, with blacks experiencing much higher rates of poverty.


If indigenous people achieve at least my level of poverty, then that is the beginning of a "good enough" platform to build upon. Those living below the poverty line should have their cases investigated to find solutions to their problems. But government organisations can't be left to do the heavy lifting to get them above the poverty line.

thegreatdivide wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 1:54pm:
"Trying to gain" doesn't mean actually gaining; and poverty is the outcome for those who can't gain employment.


Then they should at least try to gain employment in whatever is in their capacity. Fifty years of trying to help indigenous people integrate into Australian society should have achieved more than just layabout status for a considerable number of indigenous Australians.

Quote:
meaning govt. will have to provide work, as employer of last resort, to eradicate poverty.


Meaning that indigenous people should be able to learn to read, have at least a tenth grade level of education, know how to bathe and look after themselves with nutrition. If an indigenous person is no older than 50 years old, they should have this understanding, with no excuses. If an indigenous person is older than 50 years old, they should have learned all this, regardless of whatever problems they had to endure before the 1970s. When indigenous people have these life skills, they then become employable. If they do not have these basic life skills, they are not trying to help themselves.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #157 - May 19th, 2023 at 2:09pm
 
UnSubRocky wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 1:54pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 1:41pm:
UnSubRocky wrote on May 18th, 2023 at 8:28pm:
I dunno, Brian. I very much doubt being extremely drunk and relieving oneself in public is something that comes from what happened 100 years ago.


When individuals in a particular GROUP do it more than individuals in other groups do it, it might indeed have something to do with learned generational disadvantage resulting from past, misplaced  'protection' policies imposed by the authorities. 


Rubbish. Plenty of people have had abusive, drunk, and/or poor parents in their lives. That does not mean that they are going to adopt the same traits.


But only blacks have experienced destruction of an entire culture, via misplaced "protection" policies - spot the diffrence?  The experience is unique for blacks.

Quote:
When you have a group of people of the similar background adopt an inconsequential lifestyle, it is usually the result of knowing that they have nothing for to be responsible.


2 errors: people don't voluntarily adopt an "inconsequential" lifestyle, it has many possible external and internal causes; and indeed an externally inposed "protection" regime over generations will teach people they have no personal reponsibility to advance themselves - because they are "protected".

Quote:
Coddling indigenous Australians over the last 50 years has resulted in a bunch of spoiled, irresponsible layabouts.


Correct, that's what imposing (via the system)  welfare dependency does.

Quote:
If Australia treated indigenous Australians the same as the government did 100 years ago, you could bet that there would be no drunken, lazy indigenous people about, even though they (indigenous Australians) probably would have good reason to have some Dutch courage from time to time.


In sheltered workshops.... not a viable long term solution to present problems.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #158 - May 19th, 2023 at 2:20pm
 
UnSubRocky wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 2:04pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 1:54pm:
Yet that leaves us with the poverty experienced by the bottom 10% of all Australians, with blacks experiencing much higher rates of poverty.


If indigenous people achieve at least my level of poverty, then that is the beginning of a "good enough" platform to build upon. Those living below the poverty line should have their cases investigated to find solutions to their problems. But government organisations can't be left to do the heavy lifting to get them above the poverty line.


It's simple: no job, all the "heavy lifting" in the world is pointless. You have partime and fulltime work.

Quote:
Then they should at least try to gain employment in whatever is in their capacity. Fifty years of trying to help indigenous people integrate into Australian society should have achieved more than just layabout status for a considerable number of indigenous Australians.
 

See above.

Quote:
Meaning that indigenous people should be able to learn to read, have at least a tenth grade level of education, know how to bathe and look after themselves with nutrition.
 

Chicken and egg problem; dysfunctional communities mired in poverty and welfare dependency - because govt.  is faling to ensure jobs for everyone - aren't conducive to acquisition of skills.

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UnSubRocky
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #159 - May 19th, 2023 at 2:23pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 2:09pm:
But only blacks have experienced destruction of an entire culture, via misplaced "protection" policies - spot the diffrence?  The experience is unique for blacks.


Oh-oh-oh! My British culture was destroyed when my paternal great-great-grandfather got off the boat in Australia in the 1880s. Oh-oh-oh! My German culture was destroyed when my maternal great-great-grandfather got off the boat in Australia in the 1890s. How ever will I cope? <sarcasm>Well, I guess that explains my drinking.</sarcasm>

Quote:
2 errors: people don't voluntarily adopt an "inconsequential" lifestyle, it has many possible external and internal causes; and indeed an externally inposed "protection" regime over generations will teach people they have no personal reponsibility to advance themselves - because they are "protected".


They (indigenous people) have been lulled into a false sense of security by protective measures from successive governments. And that leaves indigenous people at fault for not making a go of their lives and living a moderately well off life. The safety net of not being held accountable will break at some point beyond tolerance levels.
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UnSubRocky
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #160 - May 19th, 2023 at 2:25pm
 
How can anyone live in an area where there is no job and then complain about their circumstances? If you have no job and live in an area that has no jobs, you either move to a place where there are jobs. Else, you do not complain about your circumstances of being poor/destitute.
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Boris
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #161 - May 19th, 2023 at 2:27pm
 
But only blacks have experienced destruction of an entire culture, via misplaced "protection" policies - spot the diffrence?  The experience is unique for blacks.


They do not have a culture - only savagery and barbarity



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Brian Ross
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #162 - May 19th, 2023 at 2:48pm
 
Oh, dearie, dearie, me, spoken like a true Racist Troll, Matty.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour.  Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Boris
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #163 - May 19th, 2023 at 3:30pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 2:48pm:
Oh, dearie, dearie, me, spoken like a true Racist Troll, Matty.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


devaluation dehumanisation invalidation
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Brian Ross
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Re: Alice is finished.
Reply #164 - May 19th, 2023 at 4:06pm
 
Boris wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 3:30pm:
Brian Ross wrote on May 19th, 2023 at 2:48pm:
Oh, dearie, dearie, me, spoken like a true Racist Troll, Matty.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


devaluation dehumanisation invalidation


Easy, stop acting like a "Racist Troll," Matty.  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour.  Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe?  Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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