Australian Politics Forum - People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia

greggerypeccary

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #735 - Jun 11^th, 2024 at 2:24pm

UnSubRocky wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 1:38pm:

Carl D wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:30am:

UnSubRocky wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:04am:

Chickens don't get on planes and go overseas and have their infected cough over the fruit and vege section of Woolies.

Indeed.

That will happen after "bird flu" mutates into a human to human direct transmission variant so it's just like Covid and the flu.

What? Chickens are going to get on planes and fly overseas and cough over the fruit and vege sections of supermarkets?

Geez, you are an alarmist.

Humans. Not chickens.

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ShellShilo

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #736 - Jun 11^th, 2024 at 3:13pm

Dnarever wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:13am:

Covid Deaths in Australia will soon cross 25,000.

Thru the lock down period Australia had one of the lowest death rates.

Lockdowns began in Australia on the 22nd March 2020. At that time there were only 7 recorded deaths from/with Covid-19. And, only 607 confirmed cases.

The lockdown was officially declared, "finished" in Sept. 2022. Even forced-isolation for those infected. At this time, there were 10,112,229 reported cases of covid-10. There were also 14,421 deaths with/from covid-19(0.1% mortality).

So a 2K times increase in deaths, and a 17K times increase in cases, were all during the lockdown.

Lockdowns have done more damage to the Australian society than the virus ever could. If we ignore everything else, then I agree that the rate was lower. Just NOT the numbers!

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greggerypeccary

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #737 - Jun 11^th, 2024 at 4:44pm

ShellShilo wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 3:13pm:

Dnarever wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:13am:

Covid Deaths in Australia will soon cross 25,000.

Thru the lock down period Australia had one of the lowest death rates.

Lockdowns began in Australia on the 22nd March 2020. At that time there were only 7 recorded deaths from/with Covid-19. And, only 607 confirmed cases.

The lockdown was officially declared, "finished" in Sept. 2022. Even forced-isolation for those infected. At this time, there were 10,112,229 reported cases of covid-10. There were also 14,421 deaths with/from covid-19(0.1% mortality).

So a 2K times increase in deaths, and a 17K times increase in cases, were all during the lockdown.

Lockdowns have done more damage to the Australian society than the virus ever could. If we ignore everything else, then I agree that the rate was lower. Just NOT the numbers!

That would have to be one of the most twisted pieces of "logic" I've seen in my life.

Surely you're joking Undecided

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ShellShilo

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #738 - Jun 11^th, 2024 at 5:31pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 4:44pm:

ShellShilo wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 3:13pm:

Dnarever wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:13am:

Covid Deaths in Australia will soon cross 25,000.

Thru the lock down period Australia had one of the lowest death rates.

Lockdowns began in Australia on the 22nd March 2020. At that time there were only 7 recorded deaths from/with Covid-19. And, only 607 confirmed cases.

The lockdown was officially declared, "finished" in Sept. 2022. Even forced-isolation for those infected. At this time, there were 10,112,229 reported cases of covid-10. There were also 14,421 deaths with/from covid-19(0.1% mortality).

So a 2K times increase in deaths, and a 17K times increase in cases, were all during the lockdown.

Lockdowns have done more damage to the Australian society than the virus ever could. If we ignore everything else, then I agree that the rate was lower. Just NOT the numbers!

That would have to be one of the most twisted pieces of "logic" I've seen in my life.

Surely you're joking Undecided

All I'm saying is that, the lockdown did absolutely nothing to slow the spread, and number of deaths/infections from this virus. The death rate has(for the most part) remained the same. Regardless of restrictions, isolations, vaccinations, curfews, business closures, and lockdowns.

In fact everything the government said would happen because of their restrictive policies, DIDN'T! It just became a game of double downing, endless excuses and blaming.

Maybe you can give some examples of these lowest death rates during the lockdown period? And compare them to the before and after the lockdowns? I contend that on average these rates stayed the same.

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MattE

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #739 - Jun 11^th, 2024 at 5:57pm

The lockdowns and the rules were overreach.

I remember being yelled at by someone for not wearing a mask outdoors in the fresh air. At the time it was mandatory, but the rule itself nonsensical and I didn't follow it.

The evidence overseas at the time was being outdoors was totally safe and in fact preferable. Yet, Gladys Berejiklian gave into the scare mongering media and imposed an outdoor mandate.

These silly rules have meant a lot of people no longer trust the information from health officials. They were ordered by these people to do things which everyone knew did nothing to stop the spread. They lost credibility.

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Carl D

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #740 - Jun 11^th, 2024 at 6:06pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 2:24pm:

UnSubRocky wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 1:38pm:

Carl D wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:30am:

UnSubRocky wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:04am:

Chickens don't get on planes and go overseas and have their infected cough over the fruit and vege section of Woolies.

Indeed.

That will happen after "bird flu" mutates into a human to human direct transmission variant so it's just like Covid and the flu.

What? Chickens are going to get on planes and fly overseas and cough over the fruit and vege sections of supermarkets?

Geez, you are an alarmist.

Humans. Not chickens.

Thanks, Greg.

Yeah, I should have added something like "then humans will spread it all around the world" to that post.

I did think about editing the post after I made it but I wasn't expecting anyone to make a ridiculous comment about chickens getting on planes and flying overseas. And coughing all over the fruit and veggies in supermarkets.

After all the years I've been here I really should have known better. Roll Eyes

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** Repeat Covid infections exercise our immune system in the same way that repeat concussions exercise our brain **

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Dnarever

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #741 - Jun 11^th, 2024 at 8:19pm

ShellShilo wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 5:31pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 4:44pm:

ShellShilo wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 3:13pm:

Dnarever wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:13am:

Covid Deaths in Australia will soon cross 25,000.

Thru the lock down period Australia had one of the lowest death rates.

Lockdowns began in Australia on the 22nd March 2020. At that time there were only 7 recorded deaths from/with Covid-19. And, only 607 confirmed cases.

The lockdown was officially declared, "finished" in Sept. 2022. Even forced-isolation for those infected. At this time, there were 10,112,229 reported cases of covid-10. There were also 14,421 deaths with/from covid-19(0.1% mortality).

So a 2K times increase in deaths, and a 17K times increase in cases, were all during the lockdown.

Lockdowns have done more damage to the Australian society than the virus ever could. If we ignore everything else, then I agree that the rate was lower. Just NOT the numbers!

That would have to be one of the most twisted pieces of "logic" I've seen in my life.

Surely you're joking Undecided

All I'm saying is that, the lockdown did absolutely nothing to slow the spread, and number of deaths/infections from this virus. The death rate has(for the most part) remained the same. Regardless of restrictions, isolations, vaccinations, curfews, business closures, and lockdowns.

In fact everything the government said would happen because of their restrictive policies, DIDN'T! It just became a game of double downing, endless excuses and blaming.

Maybe you can give some examples of these lowest death rates during the lockdown period? And compare them to the before and after the lockdowns? I contend that on average these rates stayed the same.

During most of the lockdown there was no vaccine.

In the early days in the US for example the onset of the virus resulted in tens of thousands of deaths with hospitals stuffed full and refiguration trucks in the streets. Without a quick lockdown we could have experienced this as well, instead over the first 15 odd months we had numbers like 2000, deaths in Vic and 1,500 in NSW.

Interesting dynamics in the USA across the board. One is that following the vaccine Deaths in republican stated have been double that of Democrat states. This is because democrat states = take the vaccine and republican states = die before taking the vaccine and they literally did. Some of the Trump lost states could have been impacted by the Trump mass spreader events.

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ShellShilo

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #742 - Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:18pm

Dnarever wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 8:19pm:

During most of the lockdown there was no vaccine.

In the early days in the US for example the onset of the virus resulted in tens of thousands of deaths with hospitals stuffed full and refiguration trucks in the streets. Without a quick lockdown we could have experienced this as well, instead over the first 15 odd months we had numbers like 2000, deaths in Vic and 1,500 in NSW.

Interesting dynamics in the USA across the board. One is that following the vaccine Deaths in republican stated have been double that of Democrat states. This is because democrat states = take the vaccine and republican states = die before taking the vaccine and they literally did. Some of the Trump lost states could have been impacted by the Trump mass spreader events.

Can we just stick to the Australian stats on this virus? Using the stats of a country with a population of over 330M, tends to be misleading. It would be irresponsible of our government to base their policy decisions on the stats from another country. We can't just ASSUME that what happens in America will also happen here.

Australia is NOT America. We don't have the density, the population, the environment, the geography, the seasons, and so many other differences. And, highlighting large numbers of deaths in a population of 330M, is intellectually dishonest and fear-mongering. People only hear 10's of thousands of deaths, instead of only 0.006% of their population(0.07% Aust.).

Lockdowns started on March 22, 2020. It COMPLETELY ended in early Sept. 2022. That's a period of over 31 months. But lets take YOUR "15 odd months", which would mean the lockdown ended on June 22nd 2021.

Before this period there were only 7 deaths from/with covid 19, and 607 cases. At the end of this period of lockdown(15 odd months), there were 910 deaths with/from this virus, and 30,366 cases. Even during this period when vaccines weren't available, there were only 900 deaths. And a 98% survival rate.

https://www.health.gov.au/resources/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-at-a-glance-22-june-2021?language=en

Maybe you can post your source for these reported thousands of deaths in just 2 states?

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Baronvonrort

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #743 - Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:35pm

ShellShilo wrote on Jun 11^th, 2024 at 11:18pm:

Can we just stick to the Australian stats on this virus?

The Branch Covidians don't like our stats.

Quote:

The median age for those who died from COVID-19 was 85.7 years (84.0 years for males, 87.6 years for females).

Most deaths due to COVID-19 have other conditions listed on the death certificate (95.9%).

On average, deaths due to COVID-19 had 3.2 other diseases and conditions certified alongside the virus.

Those with a country of birth in the Middle East had the highest age-standardised death rate at 35.4 deaths per 100,000 people.

Those with a country of birth in Sub-Saharan Africa had the lowest age-standardised death rate at 10.0 per 100,000 people.

Those born in the Eastern European region had the highest median age at death at 90.9 years.

The mortality rate from COVID-19 is 1.7 times higher in Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people compared to non-Indigenous people.

For Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander females, the rate of mortality with COVID-19 is nearly three times higher than that of non-Indigenous females.

The rate of mortality in Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people aged 45-54 and 55-64 years of age is around 4 times higher than non-Indigenous people of the same age.
Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people have a high prevalence of chronic diseases such as diabetes, renal disease, and cardiovascular disease with an earlier onset of these conditions.

https://www.abs.gov.au/articles/covid-19-mortality-australia-deaths-registered-u...

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Carl D

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #744 - Jun 12^th, 2024 at 12:11am

Perhaps we should just 'cut to the chase' here (once again) and ask why our Federal and State governments have allowed almost 25,000 people to die from a virus that should never have been allowed to escape and run rampant in Australia in the first place?

Not to mention all the seemingly endless sickness that a lot of people are now suffering from and Long Covid cases, etc.

Australia is an island and it wasn't impossible to stop Covid... in fact, we did it for almost 2 years until we had to 'give up for the economy' with a vaccines only 'strategy' that was doomed to failure after other countries (notably the US and the UK) tried the same 'strategy' before Australia and failed dismally (and disastrously).

We should also be asking (once again) why Australia (and other countries) has been allowed to get away with ignoring at least one International Covenant which we've been a signatory to for over 50 years.

International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights

Specifically Article 12, Section 2(c) and probably (d) as well.

Quote:

1. The States Parties to the present Covenant recognize the right of everyone to the enjoyment of the highest attainable standard of physical and mental health.

2. The steps to be taken by the States Parties to the present Covenant to achieve the full realization of this right shall include those necessary for:

(a) The provision for the reduction of the stillbirth-rate and of infant mortality and for the healthy development of the child;

(b) The improvement of all aspects of environmental and industrial hygiene;

(c) The prevention, treatment and control of epidemic, endemic, occupational and other diseases;

(d) The creation of conditions which would assure to all medical service and medical attention in the event of sickness.

We should also be asking (once again) why our Federal and State governments are also being allowed to get away with ignoring their own Health Acts that say pretty much the same thing as that Covenant in regards to "epidemic, endemic, occupational and other diseases".

Obviously that Covenant and our Health Acts are 'not worth the paper they're written on'. Especially if they affect the economy.

Same goes for the Australian Charter of Healthcare Rights which states quite clearly:

Quote:

Safety

■■ Receive safe and high quality health care that meets
national standards

■■ Be cared for in an environment that makes me feel safe

Going by the number of people who are being infected (and many dying) with Covid, flu and RSV, etc. in hospitals, other healthcare settings and aged care (mainly because staff won't wear masks) this is obviously also being ignored.

These are the important questions that need to be answered but I'm guessing that as long as 99.9% of the population probably have no idea about any of this our governments can continue to ignore them while people continue to die from Covid (and the flu) every year with no end in sight.

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« Last Edit: Jun 12^th, 2024 at 12:28am by Carl D »

** Repeat Covid infections exercise our immune system in the same way that repeat concussions exercise our brain **

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aquascoot Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 34272 Gender:	Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia Reply #745 - Jun 12^th, 2024 at 12:46pm i dont think ANY environment would make you feel safe carl best you stay in your bedroom
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Carl D

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #746 - Jun 12^th, 2024 at 12:58pm

aquascoot wrote on Jun 12^th, 2024 at 12:46pm:

i dont think ANY environment would make you feel safe carl

best you stay in your bedroom

Thank you for yet another useless "contribution" to the discussion.

Oh, I'll ask again while I'm here - have you found any (genuine) proof that SARS-CoV-2 is now just a "mild respiratory virus"?

No? I didn't think so.

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** Repeat Covid infections exercise our immune system in the same way that repeat concussions exercise our brain **

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aquascoot Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 34272 Gender:	Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia Reply #747 - Jun 12^th, 2024 at 1:01pm stay safe carl lead a long dull unintersting but very safe life that is the definition of human thriving
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ShellShilo

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Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia
Reply #748 - Jun 12^th, 2024 at 4:01pm

Carl D wrote on Jun 12^th, 2024 at 12:11am:

Perhaps we should just 'cut to the chase' here (once again) and ask why our Federal and State governments have allowed almost 25,000 people to die from a virus that should never have been allowed to escape and run rampant in Australia in the first place?

Not to mention all the seemingly endless sickness that a lot of people are now suffering from and Long Covid cases, etc.

Australia is an island and it wasn't impossible to stop Covid... in fact, we did it for almost 2 years until we had to 'give up for the economy' with a vaccines only 'strategy' that was doomed to failure after other countries (notably the US and the UK) tried the same 'strategy' before Australia and failed dismally (and disastrously).

We should also be asking (once again) why Australia (and other countries) has been allowed to get away with ignoring at least one International Covenant which we've been a signatory to for over 50 years.

International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights

Specifically Article 12, Section 2(c) and probably (d) as well.

Quote:

1. The States Parties to the present Covenant recognize the right of everyone to the enjoyment of the highest attainable standard of physical and mental health.

2. The steps to be taken by the States Parties to the present Covenant to achieve the full realization of this right shall include those necessary for:

(a) The provision for the reduction of the stillbirth-rate and of infant mortality and for the healthy development of the child;

(b) The improvement of all aspects of environmental and industrial hygiene;

(c) The prevention, treatment and control of epidemic, endemic, occupational and other diseases;

(d) The creation of conditions which would assure to all medical service and medical attention in the event of sickness.

We should also be asking (once again) why our Federal and State governments are also being allowed to get away with ignoring their own Health Acts that say pretty much the same thing as that Covenant in regards to "epidemic, endemic, occupational and other diseases".

Obviously that Covenant and our Health Acts are 'not worth the paper they're written on'. Especially if they affect the economy.

Same goes for the Australian Charter of Healthcare Rights which states quite clearly:

Quote:

Safety

■■ Receive safe and high quality health care that meets
national standards

■■ Be cared for in an environment that makes me feel safe

Going by the number of people who are being infected (and many dying) with Covid, flu and RSV, etc. in hospitals, other healthcare settings and aged care (mainly because staff won't wear masks) this is obviously also being ignored.

These are the important questions that need to be answered but I'm guessing that as long as 99.9% of the population probably have no idea about any of this our governments can continue to ignore them while people continue to die from Covid (and the flu) every year with no end in sight.

I don't think "Medical Fascism" is conducive to the individual's right of self-determination, and an adequate standard of living. Or, his right to "freely pursue his own economic, social and cultural development.".

The government's response to this flu, almost destroyed our country's economy. Their policies ended the dreams of thousands of small business owners. And, put hundreds of thousands of Austrlians on the dole.

Australians now know how it feels to be under authoritarian rule. Being told what they can do, when and where they can do it, and with whom(and how many) they can do it with, was just too much. Especially, when the why's keep changing every day. People could see with their own eyes, that this manufactured hype was just that!

Not only were these draconian policies immature, but they were impossible to maintain, enforce and monitor. And, you want us to go back to these restrictions, isolations, and confinements again? For YOUR greater good!

If this government tries to enslave us, or suspend our freedoms again, we will march and remove them again. This is an illness with a case mortality rate(CMR) of less than the Measles, and a survival rate of over 99%. No rational mind could see this virus as virulent or mortally dangerous.

If you're going to defend your position, then you must address the concerns of those who disagree with you. I'd be very happy to be wrong. Can you can demonstrate why my own immune system is NOT adequate to fight this virus?

But if you are just going to spew out your own version of the truth, then we're done. You remind me of how Joe McCarthy found his "shtick" in Wheeling W. Virginia. But at the end of the day he was just another fraud, committed for attention and self-aggrandisement.

https://www.pbslearningmedia.org/resource/amex31m-soc-speechredscare/the-speech-that-launched-the-1950s-red-scare-mccarthy/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svUyYzzv6VI

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Carl D Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 9282 Rivervale, Perth Gender:	Re: People are still dying of Covid19 in Australia Reply #749 - Jun 12^th, 2024 at 4:56pm ShellShilo wrote on Jun 12^th, 2024 at 4:01pm: But if you are just going to spew out your own version of the truth, then we're done. Is that a promise? If you're really done here could you take aquascoot with you? That would be great. Thanks.
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