Australian Politics Forum - Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission

AusGeoff Gold Member Offline Sage of Gippsland Posts: 5999 Victoria Gender:	Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission Reply #15 - Aug 5^th, 2023 at 11:33pm Full-size image at https://www.aeronomie.be/sites/default/files/inline-images/Credit-MarcoSaporiti_...
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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 17404 Gender:	Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission Reply #16 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 1:40pm oh look a static world with no convection.
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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 17404 Gender:	Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission Reply #17 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 2:07pm " The atmosphere and ocean work non-stop to even out solar heating imbalances through evaporation of surface water, convection, rainfall, winds, and ocean circulation. This coupled atmosphere and ocean circulation is known as Earth’s heat engine." https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/features/EnergyBalance
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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 46054 Gender:	Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission Reply #18 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 3:53pm even . . . out . . . imbalances. NOT “cool the atmosphere!”
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lee

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Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission
Reply #19 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 5:25pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 3:53pm:

NOT “cool the atmosphere!”

"The first is the transfer of 'thermal' energy (often referred to rather loosely as 'heat') by a combination of conduction and convection. This is essentially the same mechanism that heats a saucepan of water on the stove; see Box 4. The situation in the atmosphere is more complicated, but the basic principle is the same. Warm air, heated by contact with the ground or a warm sea, rises upwards carrying heat transferred from the surface aloft. This allows more cool air to come into contact with the surface and be heated in its turn. Working together, conduction/convection drive a significant flow of heat across the boundary between the surface and the air."

https://www.open.edu/openlearn/nature-environment/climate-change/content-section...

Air is a fluid. Convection is merely the movement of the fluid. The lapse rate is proof of this cooling effect. Wink

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 46054 Gender:	Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission Reply #20 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 5:37pm Where does the “more cool air” come from? Transfers within the troposphere do not affect overall heat in atmosphere–surface–ocean. How do you transfer heat to the vacuum of space, lee? I educated you about this not all that long ago.
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lee

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Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission
Reply #21 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 5:55pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 5:37pm:

Where does the “more cool air” come from?

Ah you mean the air temperature is the same winter or summer, high or low latitude? Grin

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 5:37pm:

Transfers within the troposphere do not affect overall heat in atmosphere–surface–ocean.

That's not what the purveyors of the mythical tropical hotspot proclaim. Wink

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 5:37pm:

How do you transfer heat to the vacuum of space, lee?

That and only that is by radiation only.

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 46054 Gender:	Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission Reply #22 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 6:13pm And what actually cools the atmosphere/surface/oceans? Hint: it is not convection. You must remember: energy cannot be created or destroyed. Does convection destroy energy, lee? You REALLY are desperate, aren’t you?
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lee

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Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission
Reply #23 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 6:44pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 6:13pm:

And what actually cools the atmosphere/surface/oceans?

It is convection..

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 6:13pm:

Hint: it is not convection.

You are wrong.

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 6:13pm:

You must remember: energy cannot be created or destroyed. Does convection destroy energy, lee?

Energy is transformed. By collision of molecules. And because of that collision it dissipates. Otherwise you would have a lossless system. Wink

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 6:13pm:

You REALLY are desperate, aren’t you?

Never mind JM. It was good that you came here instead of your echo chamber. But you lose. Wink

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 46054 Gender:	Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission Reply #24 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 7:11pm Nope, you cannot destroy energy lee. Energy can only be lost from the atmosphere by radiation to space.
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lee

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Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission
Reply #25 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 7:31pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 7:11pm:

Nope, you cannot destroy energy lee.

Energy is not destroyed. When molecules collide there is a change of angular motion and that takes energy. Therefore there is a lower energy transmitted to the next molecule.

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 7:11pm:

Energy can only be lost from the atmosphere by radiation to space.

Nope. as explained above.

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Jovial Monk

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Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission
Reply #26 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 8:08pm

Nope. Energy is still there—you cannot destroy it.

Energy can only be lost by the surface-ocean-atmosphere by radiation to space.

No matter how you try, energy cannot be created or destroyed.

The cooling of the atmosphere takes place in the upper layers of the stratosphere. All the rest is wishful thinking by people who have no notion of science.

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lee

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Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission
Reply #27 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 8:13pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 8:08pm:

Nope. Energy is still there—you cannot destroy it.

That's what I said. Roll Eyes

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 8:08pm:

Energy can only be lost by the surface-ocean-atmosphere by radiation to space.

Nope. Collision of molecules reduces energy and changes form.

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 8:08pm:

No matter how you try, energy cannot be created or destroyed.

And once again I agree. It can be changed from one form to another. Why is that so hard to understand? It is basic physics. Roll Eyes

Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 8:08pm:

The cooling of the atmosphere takes place in the upper layers of the stratosphere. All the rest is wishful thinking by people who have no notion of science.

So says the person who says it is AGW since the industrial revolution. Grin

I know you take your cues from Dr Strong who uses a climate model to tell him SST. Wink

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 46054 Gender:	Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission Reply #28 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 8:41pm LOL! lee so hopeful, thought he had found a refutation of AGW Collision of molecules would release heat. As you know, CO2 has been the main driver of climate since the Cambrian. It can be masked but is still working.
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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 17404 Gender:	Re: Cooling of Atmosphere Due to CO2 Emission Reply #29 - Aug 6^th, 2023 at 9:01pm Jovial Monk wrote on Aug 6^th, 2023 at 8:41pm: lee so hopeful, thought he had found a refutation of AGW Then perhaps you can cite the paper relied upon by the IPCC that proves the AGW "fingerprint"
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