Australian Politics Forum - abos arent a race

freediver

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #105 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:34pm

John Smith wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:15pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 5:41pm:

Bias_2012 wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 12:40pm:

Albosqueaky thinks Abos are a race. He's holding a referendum to prove it

Brian Ross doesn't think they are a race, he said all humans are the same, that there are no races ... yet he calls us racist if we talk about them. How can anyone be racist if there are no races?

It gets a little confusing at times

Have you ever heard Albanese speak of the Aboriginal race?

He uses the term 'the Aboriginal people', although even that is a misnomer. It presumes Aboriginals are one people which they're not.

Only an idiot thinks calling them aboriginal people means they are one people.

Does referring to European people as such mean Europeans are one people? Cheesy

Only an idiot thinks one voice can represent them.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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freediver

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #106 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:35pm

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:10pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:04pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:59pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:47pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:52pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:34pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:19pm:

It has only been a few decades - with the mapping of the human genome - and the popularity of DNA ancestry, that the notion of race has been debunked as meaningless except as a reference to cultural/social/religious differences.

I watched a video of someone who thought he was 'pure' Han Chinese - until he received his DNA analysis results. Turns out he was likely 10% Korean.

He was not happy! Or 不开心 .

If DNA has debunked the existence of race, how is it possible to use DNA to identify a person's racial ancestry?

Also, did you know that there are significant amounts of human DNA that are only present in people originating from outside of Africa?

DNA analysis places ancestors geographically, not racially.

Another slight of hand. What is race, other than geographic origin?

Race is a term that means whatever the writer/speaker says it means, although usually the writer/speaker is referring to physical features

Prior to the discovery of DNA and its decoding, all notion of race was determined by physical features.

The Sentinel Islands people are an excellent example of people having an African appearance but genetically more closely related to peoples of East Asia than Africa.

So prior to the discovery of DNA, people would not have understood what you meant if you described your race as east Asian, European, African, Maori, Native American etc?

None of those peoples would have defined themselves by 'race' or those regions.

They would have described themselves in terms of tribal affiliations and/or socio-cultural status. 'Maori', for example, means 'ordinary person' and has no reference to 'race' - which did not exist as a concept.

So you think the concept of race did not even exist prior to the discovery of DNA? But also that DNA 'debunked' the concept of race?

Would you like to try to say something sensible Meister?

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Lisa Jones

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #107 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:36pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:18pm:

John Smith wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:15pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 5:41pm:

Bias_2012 wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 12:40pm:

Albosqueaky thinks Abos are a race. He's holding a referendum to prove it

Brian Ross doesn't think they are a race, he said all humans are the same, that there are no races ... yet he calls us racist if we talk about them. How can anyone be racist if there are no races?

It gets a little confusing at times

Have you ever heard Albanese speak of the Aboriginal race?

He uses the term 'the Aboriginal people', although even that is a misnomer. It presumes Aboriginals are one people which they're not.

Only an idiot thinks calling them aboriginal people means they are one people.

Does referring to European people as such mean Europeans are one people? Cheesy

No one uses the term 'the European people'. Although they're often loosely referred to collectively as 'the Europeans'.

Hmmm ..... when asked about my ethnicity I always tell people I’m a European woman. The question which invariably follows is : Northern European or Southern European?

Because my mum and dad were (respectively) Greek and Italian I am ABLE to answer : Southern European.

I sometimes wonder though had my dad been French and my mum Greek what would my answer be? I guess it would have been EUROPEAN : north and south. 🤷🏻‍♀️

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #108 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:38pm

Linus wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:30pm:

The point is that there is no biological validity to "race". It's a social construct. You seem to have difficulty in comprehending. Is that wilful or innate? Roll Eyes

'Race' was a concept largely popularised by European explorer nations (mainly Britain, France, Spain, Portugal and the Netherlands) of the 19th century to differentiate peoples into categories of biological difference, with the Europeans at the apex of the hierarchy and steeply descending down through the 'races' from there.

It has gone the way of phrenology.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #109 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:42pm

Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:36pm:

Because my mum and dad were (respectively) Greek and Italian I am ABLE to answer : Southern European.

I sometimes wonder though had my dad been French and my mum Greek what would my answer be? I guess it would have been EUROPEAN : north and south. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Northern, southern - meaningless terms in Europe to Europeans.

It does work in new countries such as Australia, Canada and the US largely due to their ignorance of European social and cultural chauvinism.

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Lisa Jones

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #110 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:43pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:25pm:

Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:19pm:

Linus wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:13pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:34pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:19pm:

It has only been a few decades - with the mapping of the human genome - and the popularity of DNA ancestry, that the notion of race has been debunked as meaningless except as a reference to cultural/social/religious differences.

I watched a video of someone who thought he was 'pure' Han Chinese - until he received his DNA analysis results. Turns out he was likely 10% Korean.

He was not happy! Or 不开心 .

If DNA has debunked the existence of race, how is it possible to use DNA to identify a person's racial ancestry?

Also, did you know that there are significant amounts of human DNA that are only present in people originating from outside of Africa?

DNA analysis places ancestors geographically, not racially.

Fun fact:

"...A DNA test has come back to haunt Pauline Hanson after the results showed she had Middle Eastern heritage....

Her genetic make up was traced back to a multicultural background, including 9 percent Middle Eastern, 32 per cent Italian, Greek or Turkish and 59 per cent from northern Europe..."

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3678167/Pauline-Hanson-slammed-DNA-test...

Meister is on the money.

Only a fool would trust those ancestry DNA sites. And only an even bigger fool would come online to post about the results of one such test. 😐

DNA databases have helped solve decades-old cold cases when relatives of the perpetrators submitted DNA samples to these companies that then matched DNA found at the crime scenes.

Completely different context.

👇 From Google (I thought it was an interesting read)

DNA to Solve Crimes

Since the advent of DNA profiling, this type of evidence has become an extremely powerful tool in the field of criminology.

Given that a person's DNA is the same in all areas of their body, it can't be altered or modified in any way. In this sense, it is a form of evidence resistant to tampering, although it can become degraded if collected and stored improperly. This degradation, however, will affect the ability of the DNA to be sequenced as opposed to being incorrectly sequenced.

Since no DNA is the same between two people – with the exception of identical twins – this form of evidence is now relied on as an accurate way to direct or conclude criminal cases.

Currently, DNA in a crime scene can help investigators to point their finger in the right direction or exclude an innocent person from a crime.

Identifying Victims of Crime

Another important function of DNA in criminology is that it can be used to identify victims of crime, many of whom would be otherwise unidentifiable because of the condition of their body when discovered. Hair and many other parts of the body can provide viable DNA evidence that is analysed and profiled to identify the victim of the crime.

Linking Two Crimes

DNA that is the same but found at two separate crime scenes can be used to link together the crimes. This can help criminal investigators determine if a serial criminal is at work or perhaps if the victims knew one another.

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #111 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:46pm

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:34pm:

John Smith wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:15pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 5:41pm:

Bias_2012 wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 12:40pm:

Albosqueaky thinks Abos are a race. He's holding a referendum to prove it

Brian Ross doesn't think they are a race, he said all humans are the same, that there are no races ... yet he calls us racist if we talk about them. How can anyone be racist if there are no races?

It gets a little confusing at times

Have you ever heard Albanese speak of the Aboriginal race?

He uses the term 'the Aboriginal people', although even that is a misnomer. It presumes Aboriginals are one people which they're not.

Only an idiot thinks calling them aboriginal people means they are one people.

Does referring to European people as such mean Europeans are one people? Cheesy

Only an idiot thinks one voice can represent them.

True. It denies their religious, cultural and social diversity enjoyed by all other peoples.

It's hilarious when watching how Americans speak of the 'Native Americans' as if they were all one people, then listen to 'Native Americans' speak of who they 'wouldn't piss on if they were on fire' along tribal lines.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #112 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:49pm

Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:43pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:25pm:

Lisa Jones wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:19pm:

Linus wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 6:13pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:34pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:26pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:19pm:

It has only been a few decades - with the mapping of the human genome - and the popularity of DNA ancestry, that the notion of race has been debunked as meaningless except as a reference to cultural/social/religious differences.

I watched a video of someone who thought he was 'pure' Han Chinese - until he received his DNA analysis results. Turns out he was likely 10% Korean.

He was not happy! Or 不开心 .

If DNA has debunked the existence of race, how is it possible to use DNA to identify a person's racial ancestry?

Also, did you know that there are significant amounts of human DNA that are only present in people originating from outside of Africa?

DNA analysis places ancestors geographically, not racially.

Fun fact:

"...A DNA test has come back to haunt Pauline Hanson after the results showed she had Middle Eastern heritage....

Her genetic make up was traced back to a multicultural background, including 9 percent Middle Eastern, 32 per cent Italian, Greek or Turkish and 59 per cent from northern Europe..."

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3678167/Pauline-Hanson-slammed-DNA-test...

Meister is on the money.

Only a fool would trust those ancestry DNA sites. And only an even bigger fool would come online to post about the results of one such test. 😐

DNA databases have helped solve decades-old cold cases when relatives of the perpetrators submitted DNA samples to these companies that then matched DNA found at the crime scenes.

Completely different context.

👇 From Google (I thought it was an interesting read)

DNA to Solve Crimes

Since the advent of DNA profiling, this type of evidence has become an extremely powerful tool in the field of criminology.

Given that a person's DNA is the same in all areas of their body, it can't be altered or modified in any way. In this sense, it is a form of evidence resistant to tampering, although it can become degraded if collected and stored improperly. This degradation, however, will affect the ability of the DNA to be sequenced as opposed to being incorrectly sequenced.

Since no DNA is the same between two people – with the exception of identical twins – this form of evidence is now relied on as an accurate way to direct or conclude criminal cases.

Currently, DNA in a crime scene can help investigators to point their finger in the right direction or exclude an innocent person from a crime.

Identifying Victims of Crime

Another important function of DNA in criminology is that it can be used to identify victims of crime, many of whom would be otherwise unidentifiable because of the condition of their body when discovered. Hair and many other parts of the body can provide viable DNA evidence that is analysed and profiled to identify the victim of the crime.

Linking Two Crimes

DNA that is the same but found at two separate crime scenes can be used to link together the crimes. This can help criminal investigators determine if a serial criminal is at work or perhaps if the victims knew one another.

Try reading about how US authorities identified the Golden State killer decades after he committed his crimes.

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Brian Ross Gold Member Offline Representative of me Posts: 41046	Re: abos arent a race Reply #113 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:13pm It is interesting that MeisterEckhart is agreeing with me, despite all the criticism he is receiving. Well done. Science once more invalidates the concept of "Race".
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Linus

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #114 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:18pm

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:13pm:

It is interesting that MeisterEckhart is agreeing with me, despite all the criticism he is receiving. Well done. Science once more invalidates the concept of "Race". Smiley

There's more genetic diversity within a so-called racial group than between so-called racial groups.The concept of race is bygone bunk.

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JC Denton

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #115 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:21pm

Quote:

There's more genetic diversity within a so-called racial group than between so-called racial groups.The concept of race is bygone bunk.

this is a moronic statement lol

it's like saying because there's more variance of height within the male and female genders then there is between them, therefore there is no average dimorphic size difference between men and women

and a lot of the time that isn't even true and that human races virtually universally differ on measured phenotypic traits, and that it isn't even a question of characteristic overlap

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Frank Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 45021 Gender:	Re: abos arent a race Reply #116 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:22pm So there is no need for an Aboriginal Voice. They are no different.
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JC Denton

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #117 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:25pm

there is no aboriginal race as aboriginals have chosen to define themselves extraracially

recognition and identification are the bedrock signifiers of aboriginality, not ancestry or shared phenotypic and genotypic markers

aboriginals are in effect post-racial, so making fun of them or excluding them definitionally cannot be racism

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Brian Ross

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #118 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:30pm

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 3:18pm:

I'll ask it again, shall I?

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:08pm:

Here is a question: What is your motivation behind this thread? Is it to denigrate people because of their claims to be Indigenous or is it just to stir things amongst people because it gives you pleasure to do so?

I suspect it is the latter rather than the former. You don't care how scientifically wrong you are. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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JC Denton Gold Member Offline Posts: 5470 Gender:	Re: abos arent a race Reply #119 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:31pm the point of it is to upset you brian
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