Australian Politics Forum - abos arent a race

John Smith

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #150 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:50pm

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:47pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:41pm:

John Smith wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:39pm:

Quote:

I'm not the one who announced I didn't finish high school.

So? Who did?

Lisa told all of us.
It was from an online confession from you.

And this was from someone called Larry and who believes everybody is guilty of multiple IDs? Really? Oh, dearie, dearie, me, Bobby. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

Are you surprised that Goober is that stupid? He thinks Michelle Obama is a Mn and Larry is a woman ffs.

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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John Smith

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #151 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:51pm

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:50pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:47pm:

Bobby. wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:41pm:

John Smith wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:39pm:

Quote:

I'm not the one who announced I didn't finish high school.

So? Who did?

Lisa told all of us.
It was from an online confession from you.

And this was from someone called Larry and who believes everybody is guilty of multiple IDs? Really? Oh, dearie, dearie, me, Bobby. Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

I believe it.
John says such silly things that it's not surprising.

You're an idiot so what you believe is irrelevant.

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 83942 Proud pre-1850's NO Voter Gender:	Re: abos arent a race Reply #152 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:56pm Well - they aren't in the race, anyway... if it were not for the admixture of white genes and white culture...
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Lisa Jones

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #153 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 10:47pm

Why are people wasting their time on a Saturday night responding to Five Foot Frodo the Dumb Dodo who never finished Yr 9 and was expelled from school and has never held down a proper job in his life?

Haven’t you all taken a look at his own garbage which he offers up as “posts” in every topic for an idea as to how dumb, ignorant, uneducated and clueless the tosspot is?? He was like this on Yahoo and even there we all made fun of the drunk/drugged chronically unemployed loser!

Now back to the topic please.

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Frank

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #154 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 10:50pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:36pm:

JC Denton wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:25pm:

there is no aboriginal race as aboriginals have chosen to define themselves extraracially

recognition and identification are the bedrock signifiers of aboriginality, not ancestry or shared phenotypic and genotypic markers

aboriginals are in effect post-racial, so making fun of them or excluding them definitionally cannot be racism

Creating the myth of race, and then categorising peoples by 'race' was a European explorer-nation project to justify superiority over and conquest of non-European peoples.

Aboriginal peoples define themselves as they always have: along tribal lines. Their territories, who they can breed with, who they can associate with and who they can shun are based on tribal affiliations not 'race'.

Breeding with Irish, Chinese or Maori was never part of those tribal lines.
So Denton's point is well taken. You can have one half Aboriginal grandmother and still self identify as 'fully' Aboriginal - clearly not about ancestry, genes, tribes.

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Lisa Jones

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #155 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 10:55pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:29pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:17pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 2:40pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:50pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:41pm:

freediver wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 1:26pm:

Also, did you know that there are significant amounts of human DNA that are only present in people originating from outside of Africa?

Yes, DNA commonly mutates along certain points the longer the bearing group is isolated from others.

The DNA in question is present in all modern humans outside of Africa, but the mutations occurred prior to modern humans leaving Africa. It is a binary relationship, not a gradual accumulation.

DNA mutations occur specific to regions, regional climatic conditions, food sources, availability of food sources, etc... And they continually occur.

Multiple mutations occurred in hominins outside of Africa - hence DNA analysis can place ancestors at likely geographic locations where the mutations likely occurred

It's a bit hard to place the origin if the genes are in every human of non-african Origin.

Permanent gene mutations (particularly on the Y-chromosome and in mitochondrial DNA) that can be identified as regional markers (and also those that do not cause defects or are beneficial) occur around every 500 years. Others occur more frequently.

They are mostly triggered by specific environmental pressure due to regional climatic conditions, food sources, availability of resources necessary for survival, etc... And they continually occur.

I’ve only asked for links about 4 times you know. 😐

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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

HYPATIA - Greek philosopher, mathematician and astronomer (370 - 415)

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #156 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 11:02pm

Frank wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 10:50pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:36pm:

JC Denton wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:25pm:

there is no aboriginal race as aboriginals have chosen to define themselves extraracially

recognition and identification are the bedrock signifiers of aboriginality, not ancestry or shared phenotypic and genotypic markers

aboriginals are in effect post-racial, so making fun of them or excluding them definitionally cannot be racism

Creating the myth of race, and then categorising peoples by 'race' was a European explorer-nation project to justify superiority over and conquest of non-European peoples.

Aboriginal peoples define themselves as they always have: along tribal lines. Their territories, who they can breed with, who they can associate with and who they can shun are based on tribal affiliations not 'race'.

Breeding with Irish, Chinese or Maori was never part of those tribal lines.
So Denton's point is well taken. You can have one half Aboriginal grandmother and still self identify as 'fully' Aboriginal - clearly not about ancestry, genes, tribes.

Hunter-gatherer societies are often not prudish about sexual interaction with strangers deemed close friends of the tribe.

You can self-identify (by definition) with anything. The question is: should this self-identification be taken seriously enough to warrant legal recognition?

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Linus

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #157 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 11:17pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 11:02pm:

Frank wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 10:50pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:36pm:

JC Denton wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:25pm:

there is no aboriginal race as aboriginals have chosen to define themselves extraracially

recognition and identification are the bedrock signifiers of aboriginality, not ancestry or shared phenotypic and genotypic markers

aboriginals are in effect post-racial, so making fun of them or excluding them definitionally cannot be racism

Creating the myth of race, and then categorising peoples by 'race' was a European explorer-nation project to justify superiority over and conquest of non-European peoples.

Aboriginal peoples define themselves as they always have: along tribal lines. Their territories, who they can breed with, who they can associate with and who they can shun are based on tribal affiliations not 'race'.

Breeding with Irish, Chinese or Maori was never part of those tribal lines.
So Denton's point is well taken. You can have one half Aboriginal grandmother and still self identify as 'fully' Aboriginal - clearly not about ancestry, genes, tribes.

Hunter-gatherer societies are often not prudish about sexual interaction with strangers deemed close friends of the tribe.

You can self-identify (by definition) with anything. The question is: should this self-identification be taken seriously enough to warrant legal recognition?

This seems to indulge in a double-standard. What would you say if Australia got invaded and colonised by China tomorrow? Would you use the same line of argumentation?

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #158 - Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 11:41pm

Well - there are missing links in any racial discussion - that's why ID strands are supplemented by Identification... we just use a little Frog or Pom or Irish ID DNA to fill in the gaps - and next thing you know we have Identified Dinosaurs living like they did 60,000 years ago... hunter gathering at Coles, Woolies, Macca's, the pub, the bottle-o, the club... you know.......................Centrelink................

We even have a few Velociraptors.... and the odd Trans-Rex.....

They'll make a great contribution to Aborassic Park......

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

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AusGeoff

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #159 - Sep 3^rd, 2023 at 12:04am

It's obvious that some people here have missed a
relevant point about so-called "race".

Modern scholarship views racial categories as
socially constructed, that is, race is not
intrinsic to human beings but rather a
created identity, often arising from socially
dominant groups to establish meaning in a
social context.

The concept of race has no basis in biological reality.

This is an interesting site explanation of "speciation".

Speciation- Evolution and the Fossil Record.

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JC Denton Gold Member Offline Posts: 5470 Gender:	Re: abos arent a race Reply #160 - Sep 3^rd, 2023 at 12:55am you're full of ch1t geoff looking at you repeating these old outdated chestnuts that belong in an ideologically charged 1962 (probably reflective of how geriatic you are) anthropology class even most leftoids don't adhere to these notions anymore, 'colourblindednss' is so 1997
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 48841 At my desk.	Re: abos arent a race Reply #161 - Sep 3^rd, 2023 at 7:42am John Smith wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 9:39pm: Quote: I'm not the one who announced I didn't finish high school. So? Who did? Did you?
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Boris Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3978 Gender:	Re: abos arent a race Reply #162 - Sep 3^rd, 2023 at 9:21am
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JC Denton Gold Member Offline Posts: 5470 Gender:	Re: abos arent a race Reply #163 - Sep 3^rd, 2023 at 10:10am
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Frank

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Re: abos arent a race
Reply #164 - Sep 3^rd, 2023 at 11:08am

MeisterEckhart wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:45pm:

Frank wrote on Sep 2^nd, 2023 at 7:22pm:

So there is no need for an Aboriginal Voice.

They are no different.

Worse than 'no need', the project will be divisive among aboriginal peoples.

Were it to get up, how long will it be before many Aboriginal peoples claim the voice isn't representing them and only lines the pockets of urbanised self-declared part-Aboriginals?

This has been happening for decades already.

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